Mexico Mexico - David Hartley, 30, Lake Falcon, 30 Sept 2010 #1

[Tuffy]

Texas Sheriff Presents Evidence Backing Up Mexican Lake Pirate Attack

"Blood smeared on Tiffany Hartley's life jacket is nearly invisible to the naked eye but is among the evidence that corroborates her description of an attack by Mexican pirates.."

"'I just believe her' Gonzalez said late in the afternoon."

"Gonzalez also said that Border Patrol officers saw the couple eating lunch at Subway shortly before the incident — information that matches exactly with Tiffany Hartley's description of the couple's day."

"The blood on the life jacket, which has been sent to a crime lab for DNA testing, is faint — consistent with the vest having been wet when it was stained, Gonzalez said."

"In addition, he said, an independent witness with no connection to the Hartleys told investigators that he looked out onto the lake from Zapata to see Tiffany Hartley whipping across the water on her Wave Runner and a boat with several men in it pursuing her."

Snipped from: http://www.denverpost.com/commented/ci_16283930?source=commented-

So, there's the evidence that leads the Texas sheriff to believe Tiffany. Thoughts, everyone?

Wow, so now we know for a fact that she got blood on her life vest while she was in the water.

They had Subway for lunch.

A witness saw Tiffany on a Wave Runner followed by some men in a boat. (Wait...doesn't that actually conflict with her statement that they let her go?)

I'm sold. Not!

 

[alwaysonmymind]

I remember that. I know this is off topic- but did they ever catch Somer's killer? It got to be such a sad case for me, so I stopped following.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5643225&postcount=46"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Media Links** NO DISCUSSION**[/ame]

 

[oh_gal]

I have not read all the way through, so I don't know if you have been answered. But I know one "lie detector" person's site is banned here.
For good reason, they were DEAD WRONG regarding DT in Somer Thompson's case. Many took the info from that site and assumed DT was guilty because of her actions. She was 100% innocent.


MOO

Thanks for the heads up. Not sure if we're talking about the same person, or not, but how many females doing this can there be??

 

[spiderweb]

Wow, so now we know for a fact that she got blood on her life vest while she was in the water.

They had Subway for lunch.

A witness saw Tiffany on a Wave Runner followed by some men in a boat. (Wait...doesn't that actually conflict with her statement that they let her go?)

I'm sold. Not!

I'm not sold, either. Especially since the witness statement says that TH told him her husband's "brains were falling" and he wasn't breathing.

She hasn't once said anything close to that in an interview. Of course, I realize that those sort of details are not exactly things one would want to repeat, but the way she describes turning him over makes it seem like she wasn't sure he was dead and only assuming so because he was shot in the forehead (which doesn't add up for me either, since he was fleeing.)

I keep thinking about JFK's widow holding onto his head in the convertible, and the sheer horror inflicted by witnessing something like that, even watching a grainy video 40 years later...

I don't necessarily think LE is going to put all its cards out on the table right away...if they think this girl is going to incriminate herself without their help, they'll tell her they believe her and let her keep right on talking.

Also, if LE is so sure of her, why has a polygraph been suggested by the sheriff?

Something else that I found interesting - TH was active in 4-H growing up, including shooting activities, so she has some familiarity with firearms. And allegedly her husband had recently joined the NRA.

Don't know if I can post the 4-H link here...

 

[JDzWife]

I just heard on HLN that Tiffany and her husband were stopped by LE, I assume on their way to launch the wave runners? They were questioned and released. There is also video that has surfaced of this stop and, according to JVM, the two are seen conversing with each other, etc. JVM will have these updates on her show tonight.

 

[PrintGal]

Really on the fence here. My first impulse was that she didn't do it, but then the comment about "moving on" pinged my hink-meter. Her flat affect in some interviews is odd, too, but then I think of the baby-eaten-by-Dingo lady and how her affect convinced people she was guilty when she wasn't.....

 

[dodie20]

I wonder if this story got bigger than she (and possibly he, on the fence about that) imagined it would and her in-laws are pushing for her to go on all these shows. I can't imagine why she would say pirates were hiding her husband and the jet ski. The jet ski would have been their only haul. What else were they taking? If they wanted his jet ski, why didn't they take hers too. I mean there supposedly was three boats of pirates from what I heard. It makes no sense. Her whole story makes no sense and is making even less sense the more she talks and contradicts herself. I would think if she had killed him for insurance money she would have dragged the body back to shore. Jeez, I can't even make sense trying to write about it. :crazy: what's wrong with the law enforcement that she told her story to in the States. Sounds loony.

I'm thinking neither he nor his body never made it to this lake. Either he or his body is in Mexico. Then this girl can say, 'See, I told you they dragged him to Mexico'.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

So, they have evidence that backs up her story that we have not seen?
Interesting.

I guess it boils down to if you trust LE on this or not. They say her story has been backed up. Witness, blood, etc...
So, until I see otherwise, I think she's telling the truth.

 

[JulieR]

I do believe they were both there, I even think what she is saying is true as far as her husband being shot. I just think there is more to the story. 2 reasons I think this: 1 They knew better, then to go to that area. 2. Her behavior is very strange to say the least. I think they were there for more then just a fun afternoon of jet skiing. I really think it was a drug deal gone wrong. I think he was shot and she took off not really sure where he was hit at (that's why her story is changing) also would be a good reason for her to not want to take lie detector test, if she knew the men that shot her husband. She would have to tell the whole story why they were there. JMO

 

[OneLove]

How many times have we seen LE state that a person was NOT a "person of interest" and then later seen that it was just a way of biding time while investigating? My answer: so many times that anyone that BELIEVES it would probably buy the Brooklyn Bridge that I happen to own the title to and would like very much to sell.

 

[crystalgenie]

Mexico intensifies search for missing American

On Thursday, Tiffany Hartley said she might take a lie detector test if people continue to doubt the veracity of her account.

If "that's what the authorities think I need to do, then that might be an option," she said when asked on CNN's "AC 360" about taking a lie detector test.

Unable to pull her husband's body out of the water, Hartley headed back across the lake to U.S. waters. She said the gunmen fired "a few more" times on her way back.

"Once I started to get going, I just went as fast as I could and didn't look back until I couldn't see them anymore," she said.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/08/mexico.us.shooting/index.html

 

[KaylynnCouture]

I'm thinking neither he nor his body never made it to this lake. Either he or his body is in Mexico. Then this girl can say, 'See, I told you they dragged him to Mexico'.

That's possible. Have there been any reports of witnesses seeing both of them out on the lake, or just one witness seeing Tiffany speeding off on her jetski?

 

[OneLove]

Also, by a show of hands, how many people believe there are American LE in that area that are complicit in drug-dealing or other illegal big BIG money activities?

How much of a million+ dollar life insurance payout would it take to buy a local LE position of "too bad, so sad, hubby's gone over the border, not our problem"?

Also, to be fair, local LE wants their family members to LIVE. What would it take to buy YOUR family's safety?

I think there are more possibilities here for hinky-ness than the likelihood of her flat-line story being the truth.

 

[KaylynnCouture]

I'm curious as to why Tiffany thinks these men were pirates, as opposed to just men on a boat who were angry over something, drug cartel men, etc. What made her specifically identify them as pirates?

 

[darnudes]

I'm curious as to why Tiffany thinks these men were pirates, as opposed to just men on a boat who were angry over something, drug cartel men, etc. What made her specifically identify them as pirates?

Great scapegoat?

 

[alwaysonmymind]

I'm curious as to why Tiffany thinks these men were pirates, as opposed to just men on a boat who were angry over something, drug cartel men, etc. What made her specifically identify them as pirates?

Maybe because the media has been calling them pirates. Also the Somali pirates are on the news quite frequently.

http://www.kens5.com/news/pirates-94535754.html

And this makes me sad. We are huge Jimmy Buffett phans and this is giving pirates a bad name. irate:

 

[Mouser]

If "that's what the authorities think I need to do, then that might be an option," she said.

Her speech is very circuitous. I simply do not trust her.

 

[Tuffy]

Mexico intensifies search for missing American

snipped

Unable to pull her husband's body out of the water, Hartley headed back across the lake to U.S. waters. She said the gunmen fired "a few more" times on her way back.

snipped

respectfully snipped

Is this new information? The part about the gunmen firing "a few more" times on her way back?

I can't get past the fact that when she tries to retrieve her husband, they let her go only to chase her again and fire "a few more" shots. :waitasec:

Here is a picture of the half submerged church, in Guerrero Viejo, they went to explore:

 

[sorrell skye]

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/08/mexico.us.shooting/index.html

At first, "they [the pirates] just waved at us like we were friendly, a very friendly wave," she said. But then, as the couple passed, she said they began chasing them and firing shots.

I hadn't heard about the "friendly wave" before. Is this new?

I thought they were immediately chased & fired upon.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm curious as to why Tiffany thinks these men were pirates, as opposed to just men on a boat who were angry over something, drug cartel men, etc. What made her specifically identify them as pirates?

Because someone who robs, steals, or kills someone on the water is called a pirate.

From www.dictionary.com

pi·rate   /ˈpaɪrət/ Show Spelled
[pahy-ruht] Show IPA
noun, verb, -rat·ed, -rat·ing.
–noun
1. a person who robs or commits illegal violence at sea or on the shores of the sea.
2. a ship used by such persons.
3. any plunderer, predator, etc.: confidence men, slumlords, and other pirates.
4. a person who uses or reproduces the work or invention of another without authorization.
5. Also called pirate stream . Geology . a stream that diverts into its own flow the headwaters of another stream, river, etc.