MN MN - Joshua Guimond, 20, Collegeville, 9 Nov 2002 - #2

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Sasquatch321 said:
They interrogated Wolmering on several occasions and performed a search of his room and belongings following his death. Not all of this is public informatuon yet.
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I don't know if "interrogating" is there right word - but yes, Wollmering was questioned multiple times. We also know of 2 monks that were questioned and had their rooms searched in the early weeks of Josh's disappearance.
 
DarkJodo said:
I don't know if "interrogating" is there right word - but yes, Wollmering was questioned multiple times. We also know of 2 monks that were questioned and had their rooms searched in the early weeks of Josh's disappearance.
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I think yesterday you were saying they were dead focused on the water in the beginning, how does that hold true now?
 
Sasquatch321 said:
I think yesterday you were saying they were dead focused on the water in the beginning, how does that hold true now?
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Holds very true. Personal question here, Sasquatch321: If you were LE, and you thought there was even a possibility that this could be an abduction, would you wait weeks to start questioning witnesses and suspicious people living in the area of that missing person? Or would you start asking those witnesses and people of interest the night that they were reported missing? How about the next day? A week later? On December 22 2002 SCSO concluded their interviews.

I don't know why you are continually arguing that they were actively investigating and abduction scenario when they clearly and obviously were not.
 
DarkJodo said:
Holds very true. Personal question here, Sasquatch321: If you were LE, and you thought there was even a possibility that this could be an abduction, would you wait weeks to start questioning witnesses and suspicious people living in the area of that missing person? Or would you start asking those witnesses and people of interest the night that they were reported missing? How about the next day? A week later? On December 22 2002 SCSO concluded their interviews.

I don't know why you are continually arguing that they were actively investigating and abduction scenario when they clearly and obviously were not.
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There was nothing to go on an abduction back then and there is nothing to go on an abduction today., although you can work pretty damn hard at making it happen. There is also no proof he is in those waters. But here is what I know now that I never knew before, LE was stirring up the monks hard in the first month of this case. I think a few others are just learning this too. Nothing has changed. No witnesses, no confessions, no trail. 16 years later and your lead investigator claims 'I Have Nothing'. That is saying a lot.
 
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Josh leaves a party at random alone around midnight without his glasses, a coat warm enough for the weather, and possible intoxication of how much is anybodys guess. People see him walking but don't see anything else. Such is the story today. Does this scream abduction to you in the first 24 hours of the case, or is there a whole hell of a lot of information to process and people to talk to over the next month and until today? If anyone has any new information on the case, please come forward. They drained the lakes to lower levels, they scoured the campus, they interviewed hundreds in the first month. I'm actually feeling alot better about what was done now. For a long time actually I didn't even know if they looked at any monks at all.
 
It is up to law enforcement to investigate all avenues in a missing persons case. Even if there were signs that Josh could have been in the water, at least talk to the people who last saw him (this did not happen). You're a smart guy Sas - I'm sure you know how crucial those first 72 hours are in a missing persons case.

The point is that SCSO had a narrative that Josh was in the water on day 1 of the investigation, and only looked into other possibilities weeks later after their original narrative started to fall apart, when in reality, that investigation should have taken place much, much sooner. This department has a history of bungling up investigations, and this is just another example of them doing so.

If you think that SCSO did everything by the book, and even the best detectives in the world would have conducted the exact same actions that SCSO did, more power to you. For me - I vastly disagree.
 
DarkJodo said:
It is up to law enforcement to investigate all avenues in a missing persons case. Even if there were signs that Josh could have been in the water, at least talk to the people who last saw him (this did not happen). You're a smart guy Sas - I'm sure you know how crucial those first 72 hours are in a missing persons case.

The point is that SCSO had a narrative that Josh was in the water on day 1 of the investigation, and only looked into other possibilities weeks later after their original narrative started to fall apart, when in reality, that investigation should have taken place much, much sooner. This department has a history of bungling up investigations, and this is just another example of them doing so.

If you think that SCSO did everything by the book, and even the best detectives in the world would have conducted the exact same actions that SCSO did, more power to you. For me - I vastly disagree.
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Well you are playing a blame game on LE and it probably isn't fair. Even if, what would be different? I don't think anything, here we are 16 years later. National guatd, draining of lakes, interviewing friends family and monks all in the first month. I have to say it is somewhat more satisfying now. And I said if a monk did do this, he would be easily suspected, and that is why Wolmering was talked to several times. The overwatcher of Josh's dorm. Results not public.
 
DarkJodo said:
It is up to law enforcement to investigate all avenues in a missing persons case. Even if there were signs that Josh could have been in the water, at least talk to the people who last saw him (this did not happen). You're a smart guy Sas - I'm sure you know how crucial those first 72 hours are in a missing persons case.

The point is that SCSO had a narrative that Josh was in the water on day 1 of the investigation, and only looked into other possibilities weeks later after their original narrative started to fall apart, when in reality, that investigation should have taken place much, much sooner. This department has a history of bungling up investigations, and this is just another example of them doing so.

If you think that SCSO did everything by the book, and even the best detectives in the world would have conducted the exact same actions that SCSO did, more power to you. For me - I vastly disagree.
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I agree and the fact that SCSO did a horrible job with JW's case doesn't help.
jmo
 
Not that anyone asked me, but based upon the history of sexual abuse at St. John's, I would have been in that abbey in a New York minute, as well as to every church property in the vicinity (probably a number of those, right?). I would have searched the tunnels, and anywhere particular monks spent their time doing their special hobbies of botany, etc. Of course I would have had to go through the proper channels to get a warrant, but police know how to make that happen quickly. With regard to interviewing Bruce Wollmering, I don't want to bear false witness against anyone, but I have little to no trust that he would tell the truth about any of his sexual misdeeds, much less about a crime he may have committed. Hindsight is 20-2o but did they actually establish alibis right away for these monks? Having said all of this, I wanted to make acomment about the search for Josh in the woods. For the second time in the last five years, I observed/read of a case (Madelyn Lingenfelter) in which a large wooded area was searched by a HASTY team, along with dogs and a helicopter, and they could not find her. Two and a half months later, local citizens were looking for a Christmas tree and discovered the remains of Madelyn, which were located very close to where her car was parked and in the search area. So I'm thinking -- maybe there is a chance Josh is in those woods. But my heart tells me otherwise -- that he was taken somewhere and I'm going to skip what else I think.
 
Josh is either in the lake, in the woods or abducted. The reason why I doubt he is in the woods is that he was a sophomore, he knew his way around campus. The lake is possible, but to me the suspicious behavior from the Abbot not allowing the Abbey to be searched right away and filing a restraining order against Josh's dad speaks volumes to me that they have something to hide.
And Jodo, Sanner didn't graduate from SJU.
 
Jbrown324320 said:
Josh is either in the lake, in the woods or abducted. The reason why I doubt he is in the woods is that he was a sophomore, he knew his way around campus. The lake is possible, but to me the suspicious behavior from the Abbot not allowing the Abbey to be searched right away and filing a restraining order against Josh's dad speaks volumes to me that they have something to hide.
And Jodo, Sanner didn't graduate from SJU.
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If anything too I hope we have searched potential dump sites near or surrounding St Johns. Where would someone maybe kill or dump a body from 0 to 20 miles from St. Johns. Check all of the spots out with cadaver dogs. I think if he was taken by a vehicle it would be reminiscent of what happened to Wetterling.
 
Jbrown324320 said:
...but to me the suspicious behavior from the Abbot not allowing the Abbey to be searched right away
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All buildings (including the abbey) were searched by SCSO during day 1 of the search. St. John’s allowed them to search without a warrant (normally they would need one).

Much later, they didn’t let the Guimond family search the abbey initially (they eventually did).

The restraining order happened years later.
 
DarkJodo said:
All buildings (including the abbey) were searched by SCSO during day 1 of the search. St. John’s allowed them to search without a warrant (normally they would need one).

Much later, they didn’t let the Guimond family search the abbey initially (they eventually did).

The restraining order happened years later.
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This is just bombshell stuff that is answering the worst worries of this case. They did do it, so now what?
 
All good thoughts. I’ve mentioned this before, but I’ve also considered the possibility that if the perp was a monk, he may not have acted alone. Thinking out loud - if a pervert monk can’t get his sexual needs met on campus, where else could he go, and what sort of people would participate? Would those same people assist him In hiding the evidence, namely, a body. I hate thinking about these things, but you have to when you enter a den of iniquity like this.
 
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