OH - Loletha Hall, 61 (Uber Driver) shot to death by William Brock, 81 - 25 Mar 2024

[ch_13]

I'm reading through the articles on this case and it's unclear to me if Brock was actually scammed or not. Apparently the caller said Brock's family member needed bail which later turned to claims the family member was a hostage held for ransom. It seems Hall was sent to pick the money up.

But did Brock actually believe this story or was he trying to extract vigilante justice by turning the tables on the person he believed was the scammer? If he really thought his family member had been kidnapped would he have killed the collector of the ransom, since in a real scenario that would have ensured his family member would also be murdered?

 

[rleigh123]

Then to be frank, he shouldn't have a firearm. Like they take away people's driving licences if they're shown not to be safe to drive any more.

MOO

One is a right and one is a privilege.

IMO
Maybe he was just old and afraid he'd be a victim of some nut. And he was right. He didn't know what they would try next.
But this poor woman. God bless her and her family. It breaks my heart.

 

[iamshadow21]

One is a right and one is a privilege.

IMO
Maybe he was just old and afraid he'd be a victim of some nut. And he was right. He didn't know what they would try next.
But this poor woman. God bless her and her family. It breaks my heart.

Federal law applies, I think, if someone is incapable.

Mental Health Reporting in Ohio

giffords.org

He was a victim, but he crossed the line and became a perpetrator of violence. He chose violence. And killed a woman who had nothing to do with any of it.

MOO

 

[rleigh123]

Federal law applies, I think, if someone is incapable.

Mental Health Reporting in Ohio

giffords.org

He was a victim, but he crossed the line and became a perpetrator of violence. He chose violence. And killed a woman who had nothing to do with any of it.

MOO

IMO

But in the context of this conversation, the US doesn't take away guns just because a citizen is in the stages of the late aging process.

 

[katydid23]

Then to be frank, he shouldn't have a firearm. Like they take away people's driving licences if they're shown not to be safe to drive any more.

MOO

Oh, I agree completely.

 

[Herat]

The scam described above, relative needing bail money, is well-known, but I thought it was generally an internet scam where a credit card or bank wire was demanded, not a cash pickup. This is a bit unusual and I think there have to have been people watching this transaction and pickup. Likely planning to follow the Uber driver and pick it up from another address.

If the package was being picked up, it was for a destination and that needs to be further explained and identified.

The introduction of a firearm was unnecessary and his neglect lead directly to her tragic murder.

 

[katydid23]

I may have my facts wrong, but haven’t police confirmed that this encounter lasted several minutes, where this man physically attacked this woman, robbed her of her phone (he could not have mistaken this for a firearm after that point), and then interrogated her at length between each of the three times he shot her? That sounds like lucid behavior to me. Extracting information from a person in the process of dying of her wounds is calculating, as are the timing of his phone call to police and the substance of that call where he laid out the events.

He remains a victim of one crime while being a perpetrator of a much more serious offense, surely.

I would like to know what actions he took between the scam call and Ms. Hall’s arrival. If he actually remained convinced the call was legitimate, what efforts did he make to meet the demands, seek assistance, or attempt to make direct or indirect contact with his incarcerated relative?

He was anticipating a knock at his door and was always planning on confronting someone with a gun and a plan to incapacitate them? Again, the behavior of someone using reason.

Moo and cow and a hearty hallo to this forum and its residents.

Well, it can seem like someone is using reason, but if they have dementia, the reason is often very flawed.

My mother was scammed a few times, the first time when she was in her 80's. Someone called her and pretended to be her grandson, begged her not to tell anyone, or he'd be fired---but said he had been arrested for a DUI in Florida...and needed 7k in CASH to be sent to him...

The instructions were for her to go to bank and get the cash, put it in an envelope inside a magazine and send it to the PO Box in Tampa---AND MY MOM WENT AND GOT 7K IN HUNDREDS AND PUT IT IN AN ENVELOPE AND PLANNED TO GO TO THE BANK---
Luckily my big brother called her and she asked where her grandson was and he told her, at work---so she told him about it and he was able to convince her it was all a scam.

My Mom was a very street smart, intelligent business woman---she NEVER would have made a decision like that even a few years earlier. She just couldn't process things mentally like she used to.

But she did use 'reason'---she didn't want her grandson to lose his job and his marriage---she wanted him to be able to bail out and get an attorney---she loved him and wanted to help him anyway she could...

 

[katydid23]

Well, it can seem like someone is using reason, but if they have dementia, the reason is often very flawed.

My mother was scammed a few times, the first time when she was in her 80's. Someone called her and pretended to be her grandson, begged her not to tell anyone, or he'd be fired---but said he had been arrested for a DUI in Florida...and needed 7k in CASH to be sent to him...

The instructions were for her to go to bank and get the cash, put it in an envelope inside a magazine and send it to the PO Box in Tampa---AND MY MOM WENT AND GOT 7K IN HUNDREDS AND PUT IT IN AN ENVELOPE AND PLANNED TO GO TO THE BANK---
Luckily my big brother called her and she asked where her grandson was and he told her, at work---so she told him about it and he was able to convince her it was all a scam.

My Mom was a very street smart, intelligent business woman---she NEVER would have made a decision like that even a few years earlier. She just couldn't process things mentally like she used to.

But she did use 'reason'---she didn't want her grandson to lose his job and his marriage---she wanted him to be able to bail out and get an attorney---she loved him and wanted to help him anyway she could...

Also, these scammers continued to call my Mom for months afterwards, with other various scams. They'd pretend to know her and be a friend of hers, and she was confused and didn't want to be rude so she'd act like she knew them too...they'd ask for money to be sent because she owed them for this or that

 

[smackdowncrime]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/16/us/ohio-uber-driver-murder-charge/index.html

Additional charges filed against man in killing of Uber driver he mistakenly believed was a scammer​

An 81-year-old Ohio man pleaded not guilty to multiple counts of murder and other charges Wednesday related to the shooting death of an Uber driver he mistakenly believed was working with a scammer attempting to extort him, according to the Clark County prosecutor.

 

[PrairieWind]

That poor woman. She had no idea what he was talking about. She must have been terrified.

 

[smackdowncrime]

That poor woman. She had no idea what he was talking about. She must have been terrified.

I am upset that he didnt call 911. He had her at gunpoint, she had no weapon, and he chose to execute her

 

[smackdowncrime]

I feel this man was trained by fear mongering to see some people as his enemy and deserving of execution. That is why he didnt call 911 when he had her at gunpoint and she was unarmed

 

[flowershop]

New video that shows the police confronting Brock. There is also footage of the police taking a call from the scammer.

Video New video shows cops confronting Ohio man after he shot an Uber driver

Police bodycam footage shows the moment cops confronted an elderly Ohio man after he shot and killed an Uber driver.

abcnews.go.com

 

[Herat]

Notice how the scammer tells the police woman on the phone that she is in serious trouble, likely before she repeats that she is the police.

I hope they find that guy and their entire gang.

 

[Warwick1991]

The scam described above, relative needing bail money, is well-known, but I thought it was generally an internet scam where a credit card or bank wire was demanded, not a cash pickup. This is a bit unusual and I think there have to have been people watching this transaction and pickup. Likely planning to follow the Uber driver and pick it up from another address.

If the package was being picked up, it was for a destination and that needs to be further explained and identified.

The introduction of a firearm was unnecessary and his neglect lead directly to her tragic murder.

I have read about variants of the "relative in trouble" scheme, and a number of them now involve someone physically picking up money. There have been several in the Boston, MA area. Here's one where an arrest was made: “Common scam”: Police say South Shore resident lost $9,500 to man claiming to be her grandson

 

[kccorona]

New (to me) article with this piece of info I hadn’t seen yet-

When Hall tried to get back into her vehicle, Brock allegedly shot her, and there was a "subsequent scuffle at the door of Ms. Hall's vehicle," the sheriff's office said. Brock then allegedly shot her two more times, before calling 911.

Shot trying to get back into her vehicle. I can only imagine the fear she felt.

It’s an awful situation all around, indisputable. For me though, the scammer calls and Brock’s aggressive attack on Ms Hall are two completely separate events and should be handled as such in the courts.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

New (to me) article with this piece of info I hadn’t seen yet-

Shot trying to get back into her vehicle. I can only imagine the fear she felt.

It’s an awful situation all around, indisputable. For me though, the scammer calls and Brock’s aggressive attack on Ms Hall are two completely separate events and should be handled as such in the courts.

They're not completely separate though. When you deconstruct a murder criminally, part of the process is establishing motive and state of mind. That often distinguishes one charge from another. The scammer call was the triggering event, not some unrelated thing that coincidentally also happened.

MOO

 

[GoBuckeyes]

This is absolutely horrific and heartbreaking.

The threatening scam call was earlier in the day. I wonder if I'd call the cops after I received a scam call like that (they probably wouldn't show up for hours). I suppose he thought that was the end of it until she showed up to his home. And after all, he did have a big gun just in case.

"Brock confronted her, asking who she was working with, took her cell phone and blockaded her exit. Hall was shot three times, Schultz said, and allegedly only after the third time “did he then make contact with authorities to report the incident."

I take issue with some of his actions. In the picture above, it looks like she has her phone in her hand. Did he take it from her at gunpoint? Did he force her out of the car at gunpoint? She looks absolutely terrified.

I can understand why he was on high alert. And this situation isn't totally his fault. He may be wondering what if anything he could have done differently. Unfair for either of these elderly people to be put in this situation.

This must be a new form of swatting. I can't help but feel this was done by someone who was able to watch this unfold. What more can be done to protect these workers?

The workers and the homeowner. He's a victim, too.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

New (to me) article with this piece of info I hadn’t seen yet-

Shot trying to get back into her vehicle. I can only imagine the fear she felt.

It’s an awful situation all around, indisputable. For me though, the scammer calls and Brock’s aggressive attack on Ms Hall are two completely separate events and should be handled as such in the courts.

I couldn't disagree more. But for that phone call, he wouldn't have attacked anyone.