Archangel85
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I agree with the detective that these two cases are connected. I hope he's able to find solid evidence.
Private detective explores 1967 abduction of two girls in Oklahoma. (Daily Oklahoman)
A Lawton private detective thinks he has solved two cold cases from
1967, but he won't release the suspect's name. Not yet. Not until he's sure.
No, I'm not at liberty to do so as yet.
The story from this link was posted earlier, but nothing was mentioned regarding the comments.
Link again:
http://blog.newsok.com/coldcaseokc/2007/08/05/judith-elwells-brother-speaks-out/
from the comments section:
Someone who claims to be Brenda Whites cousin posted this:
Interestingly I don't see that Judiths brother replied online to any of the possibly viable info posted in the comments section. Perhaps he didn't know this was online?
I'm also curious if Judith has DNA anywhere. I don't see her listed at Namus and can't find any online info whether there is DNA or not for her to compare to any unidentifieds.
A shame LE seemed to lose, misplace or ? the files for both Judith Elwell and Brenda Whites case.
If the files are gone, I wonder if that means any evidence collected is gone too.
NamUs lists Judith's DNA as being available. Do we know what kind it is? How can we find out? I ask because Judith's mother passed away 6 years after she disappeared and DNA sampling was not available then. Her brother is stated as being her only living relative, so I am assuming two things: that DNA sample came from him, which would not contain mtDNA because he is male, at least that is my understanding, anyway, and 2: that no maternal female relative was found to provide the mtDNA. If my assumptions are wrong, I'd like to know.
Not being a DNA expert, what kind of sample could her brother provide besides Y-STR? Can they obtain Y-STR for comparison from a female Jane Doe to compare to his?
I'm trying to figure out how they can rule someone out stating there is no DNA association when the sample types may not match.
I have a ton to learn here, so if anyone can shed some light, I would be very thankful.
Thank you, Roselvr. I'm clueless when it comes to DNA, so I checked around. I found out that CODIS has guidelines that have to be met before they will accept DNA samples, I believe I read one of them has to be mtDNA. The reply I got from NamUs when I submitted the match was that they were both in CODIS with no associations, but it seemed like a canned response to me, not sure, though, because I'm new at this. I also read that the best way to rule out a match with DNA is to have as many samples from both paternal and maternal relatives to build a more complete profile. I read someplace that Judith's brother was her only living relative, so it would seem to me that the sample is somewhat limited. I was under the impression that mtDNA can only come from a female, but I was wrong. A male sibling with the same mother as the MP has the same mtDNA as a sister, he just doesn't pass it off to his offspring. Judith's brother's mtDNA would work, his nucDNA could be 50% or less of a match.
I've noticed that some folks seem to know what type of DNA is available for whom. Where is that information coming from? Am I missing it? I've seen a few notes about what kind of DNA is available on some cases on the doenetwork site, but more often than not, I'm not seeing anything but "DNA available."
I suspected something like that when I watched the video on NamUs and they showed dental records, and then I couldn't find them. Later,someone mentioned that they stopped having them available to the general public.NamUs used to show the DNA history, type and who holds it. They hid it a few years ago saying it was part of a medical record HIPAA
I was thinking of baby teeth as a possible source, too. Good to know that they can extract it from those.
I suspected something like that when I watched the video on NamUs and they showed dental records, and then I couldn't find them. Later,someone mentioned that they stopped having them available to the general public.
NamUs lists Judith's DNA as being available. Do we know what kind it is? How can we find out? I ask because Judith's mother passed away 6 years after she disappeared and DNA sampling was not available then. Her brother is stated as being her only living relative, so I am assuming two things: that DNA sample came from him, which would not contain mtDNA because he is male, at least that is my understanding, anyway, and 2: that no maternal female relative was found to provide the mtDNA. If my assumptions are wrong, I'd like to know.
Not being a DNA expert, what kind of sample could her brother provide besides Y-STR? Can they obtain Y-STR for comparison from a female Jane Doe to compare to his?
I'm trying to figure out how they can rule someone out stating there is no DNA association when the sample types may not match.
I have a ton to learn here, so if anyone can shed some light, I would be very thankful.
I’d love to know if you ever figured out the DNA question, as I share your “out on a limb” potential match theory with the body found in Texas. I’m no professional but I see a striking similarity between them.
It might be a long-shot that she lived into adulthood and the other child abducted by who we think also abducted Judith ended up dead soon after. But hey, maybe she cooperated and the other child fought back and was killed.