Found Deceased OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #5 *Arrests*

[Cool Cats]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

Red Herring....This is not about conspiracy theory God misfit stuff.

A grandmother wanted full control of her grandkids and thought getting rid of the mom would get her exactly what she wanted.

To do this she used scare tactics plain and simple. This is the same thing Angela Wagner did in the Ohio Rhoden murder case.

According to the arrest affidavit TA was getting the others riled up by saying that in VB's care the children would be unprotected from being molested.

It was about "saving" the children. This is how TA got everyone riled up. This is what led to the plans and commission of the 2 homicides.

2 Cents

 

[Sundog]

They're, obviously, all people who think nothing of extreme violence and get off on it. I also see a connection to the lifestyle and business they were all in which was the same as Patrick Frazee.

<Snipped for focus>

Not sure what connection you are referring to, but their businesses were all respectable ways to make a livng - such as ranchers, raising cattle, working as a farrier, etc. I don't think that their "lifestyles and businesses" were the problem, I think it was the individual personalities and choices they made that were the problem.

 

[ConMac]

That is a possibility.

Yet, the group members do not appear to have been known locally as being involved in say, a mishmash of crimes ranging from bar brawling, stolen vehicles / farm equipment, small town drugs and / or..... cattle rustling.

The lack of apparent past criminality in the group may point towards other driving factors such as religion / political beliefs.

Or maybe this isn't their first rodeo it's just the first time 'things didn't go as planned'?

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783549481524605141

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

It's possible that the vehicle that CW was told to clean was not used to transport VB or JK prior to, or after, their murders. They may have not been in that vehicle at all. The cleaning may have been needed due to the dirt and hay near the burial site from their shoes, tools, etc. and that is why the vehicle needed cleaning. We don't know which vehicle was used to transport the victims.

These innocent women were beaten with a hammer. <modsnip - no link to an approved source to statement of fact>

 

[Error505]

This article is from a LE publication on the American State National from a law enforcement perspective. It gives more insight to the problems that can be caused by this mentality and group thinking.

American State Nationals: The newest group of sovereign citizens

Understanding the behavior and ideology of sovereign citizens is crucial for ensuring the safety of law enforcement officers, especially during traffic stops

www.police1.com

MOO

 

[AppleTreeGreen]

So it’s just a boilerplate template? A whole kit for $400 even though they don’t recognize US Currency, IIRC?

If this is the same as what I’ve read previously I don’t have the stomach to read it again. Is this the one where, amongst everything else, PG explains how his children were created from his sperm in their mother’s womb?

I truly prefer to skip the “birds and the bees” sex education from Paul Grice.

IMO

I noted that too and wondered if he knew his sperm had to combine with his wife’s egg to start the whole process? Or did he think his sperm just grew into a baby all by itself like one of those facehugger babies in the movie Alien?

Also, he had a wife and three kids. Why would he assert his rights over his family in that manifesto and than less than two years later put his rights to be with those very same kids at risks by committing this horrendous crime?

Also, who describes their children as property? They are human beings with their own thoughts, opinions, needs, desires, behaviors and so much more. IMO, property conjures up images such as itemitized parts of your car, bedroom furniture set or worse, slavery. He could have went with any other word, like responsibility, family, life, priorities but he went with property. MOO, it may also signify the ability to dehumanize another person, even one’s own family, and to dismiss or ignore their autonomy/individuality. I wonder how common the use of such language or pattern of speech was among their group when they spoke about VB, JK and others they perceived as enemies? I wonder too if such way of thinking made it easier for them to commit the crimes or to cope with and justify their actions mentally afterwards?

 

[Megnut]

From

charmingbetsy's post:​

Interestingly, Grice himself did not write the manifesto. A template is available for purchase for $400.

Freedom Bundle @ Affidavit of Repudiation

This set includes everything you need to claim American state national status. 1. Recording Cover Sheet 2. Affidavit of Repudiation 3. Certified Proof of Service 4. Judgment of Un-Rebutted Affidavit 5. Deed of Re-Conveyance 6. Declaration of Status If you already have an AoR, order the $250...

30b71e2f-803f-4073-bcd1-2fe0761aa668.paylinks.godaddy.com

View attachment 499480

I just found THE LAST thing I'd spend $400 on.

And I STILL wouldn't.

Renounced his citizenship, hello. Watch him GRAB onto every right, every counsel, very motion, every waiver the justice system affords the accused in this country.

I hope that $400 Freedom Bundle came with free gum or something at least.

Waste o'money, it ain't gonna help him now.

It offends me to no end that five adults could conspire and carry out such a heinous crime. The callousness is unfathomable.

Jmo

 

[Rixey]

Surely Paul Grice knew an arrest was imminent and I would hope that he therefore had the foresight to retain council before he confessed.

I would very seriously doubt that he did. Because he was questioned & released early on, he may well have thought he had gotten away with everything, so he might not have realized he was still on their radar and in (desperate) need of an attorney. I also expect LE was very happy to allow him to think that.

Secondly, what competent defense attorney would have advised him to just go ahead and provide LE with a confession but not secure lesser charges, etc, etc?? I think he still believes what he did was justified and that he is not subject to the laws of the US or Oklahoma. He's relying on the same logic he used to buy his "freedom kit" and things are still not working working out for him but it may take a good long while before he figures that out.

I feel very sorry for his children, like the others they are now victims of the arrogance & malice of the misfits.

 

[Sundog]

This article is from a LE publication on the American State National from a law enforcement perspective. It gives more insight to the problems that can be caused by this mentality and group thinking.

American State Nationals: The newest group of sovereign citizens

Understanding the behavior and ideology of sovereign citizens is crucial for ensuring the safety of law enforcement officers, especially during traffic stops

www.police1.com

This LE publication you listed also refers to an article that discusses the Sovereign Citizen movement and its focus on Child Protective Services (CPS) cases. One example the author gives (among many) is the case of David Motusiewitz and his family, described below, which shows how a family who were part of the sovereign citizen movement dealt with CPS and even recruited others to stalk the mother of the child involved in the custody dispute. They also showed up in court with restraints and electronic shocking devices, and the grandmother had created a website with a video called "A Grandmother's Impossible Choice" which focused on CPS' kidnapping of the children and accusations of sexual abuse of the children by the mother.

The custody problems began in 2006 when Christine Belford and David Thomas Matusiewicz
divorced and agreed to shared custody of their three children. David Matusiewicz and his family also attempted to recruit others to aid in the surveillance of Belford and her children (Department of Justice, 2018).Numerous courts repeatedly found the abuse allegations against Belford to be untrue. The courts noted that there was “overwhelming, uncontradicted evidence that the accusations that [Belford] sexually molested or abused her children were false” (Department of Justice, 2018).

Both Belford and David Matusiewicz were to appear in court on the morning of February 11, 2013, for a child support hearing. That day, David Matusiewicz and his father Thomas arrived early at the courthouse. They brought ammunition, a bulletproof vest, knives, restraints of various sizes, photographs of their targets, and electronic shocking devices (Department of Justice, 2015). At the behest of his son, Thomas Matusiewicz shot and killed Belford and her companion Laura Mulford in the lobby of the New Castle County Courthouse in Delaware (U.S.v. Matusiewicz, 2015). Thomas Matusiewicz then took his own life. For their actions, David Matusiewicz, his mother Lenore Matusiewicz, and his sister, Amy Gonzalez, were convicted of cyberstalking resulting in death in 2015. The offenders were sentenced to life in prison (Department of Justice, 2015).

Sarteschi CM. (2023.) Sovereign Citizens and QAnon: The Increasing Overlaps with a Focus on Child Protective Service (CPS) Cases. International Journal of Coercion, Abuse and Manipulation.


Bolded and underlined by me

 

[Error505]

This LE publication you listed also refers to an article that discusses the Sovereign Citizen movement and its focus on Child Protective Services (CPS) cases. One example the author gives (among many) is the case of David Motusiewitz and his family, described below, which shows how a family who were part of the sovereign citizen movement dealt with CPS and even recruited others to stalk the mother of the child involved in the custody dispute. They also showed up in court with restraints and electronic shocking devices, and the grandmother had created a website with a video called "A Grandmother's Impossible Choice" which focused on CPS' kidnapping of the children and accusations of sexual abuse of the children by the mother.

The custody problems began in 2006 when Christine Belford and David Thomas Matusiewicz
divorced and agreed to shared custody of their three childpossible Choice” filled with allegations of abuse, and false polygraph reports (Department of Justice, 2018). David Matusiewicz and his family also attempted to recruit others to aid in the surveillance of Belford and her children (Department of Justice, 2018).Numerous courts repeatedly found the abuse allegations against Belford to be untrue. The courts noted that there was “overwhelming, uncontradicted evidence that the accusations that [Belford] sexually molested or abused her children were false” (Department of Justice, 2018).

Both Belford and David Matusiewicz were to appear in court on the morning of February 11, 2013, for a child support hearing. That day, David Matusiewicz and his father Thomas arrived early at the courthouse. They brought ammunition, a bulletproof vest, knives, restraints of various sizes, photographs of their targets, and electronic shocking devices (Department of Justice, 2015). At the behest of his son, Thomas Matusiewicz shot and killed Belford and her companion Laura Mulford in the lobby of the New Castle County Courthouse in Delaware (U.S.v. Matusiewicz, 2015). Thomas Matusiewicz then took his own life. For their actions, David Matusiewicz, his mother Lenore Matusiewicz, and his sister, Amy Gonzalez, were convicted of cyberstalking resulting in death in 2015. The offenders were sentenced to life in prison (Department of Justice, 2015).

Sarteschi CM. (2023.) Sovereign Citizens and QAnon: The Increasing Overlaps with a Focus on Child Protective Service (CPS) Cases. International Journal of Coercion, Abuse and Manipulation.


Bolded and underlined by me

Great post! Thank you! Parts of this sounds very much like Grandma Tifany and her God’s misfits way of thinking. Uncanny the parallels.
MOO
EBM context

 

[anneoakley63]

Someone mentioned in a recent post (in the previous thread) that they felt the misfits were very motivated by $$$$ rather than religion. It’s interesting that on his Facebook profile CT’s favourite quote is “Money isn’t everything, but it ranks rite (sic) up there with oxygen.” He strikes me as crafty, smug and cold.

*October 2009
View attachment 499322
At 17, Paul Grice is a veteran working cowboy, having earned pay for “day work” on horseback since he was eight-years-old – checking and moving cows, feeding, roping, branding, shipping. Riding Bueno, the Quarter Horse he bought with his own wages five years ago, Grice is hungry to win this year’s SGHA “All-Around” belt buckle. “Two years ago I was third,” he says. “Last year I was first runner-up – I won $406, but no buckle. I’m shooting for the buckle this year.” He has a good shot at it, though local cowgirl Riata Rivale is giving him a good run for it.

Until his family’s move to Roy, NM, this year, Grice grew up in Kenton, Oklahoma, a short ride from the Colorado and New Mexico state lines. Paul and Laekyn have grown up together competing in 4-H and open rodeos. Both are planning lives built around horses. Paul will continue working cattle on ranches, though if he can swing it he’d like to take time out to attend ranch management school at a north Texas college. He knows that even in ranching, “A lot of people nowadays want someone with some education. It’s a step to a bigger job.”

Growing Up Rodeo - youth rodeo - New Mexico - SGHA - Tim Keller

This edition should be forever discarded. He gives true cowboys a very bad name.

 

[anneoakley63]

Why do I think we are only scratching the surface of what these Godless murderers have been up to?

I think LE has to dig deeper.

MOO

I 1000% agree. I believe there is still a lot to be uncovered surrounding this case, those involved and their activities leading up to this.

 

[anneoakley63]

All five individuals allegedly went to Hugoton, Kansas, where Butler lived, but they couldn't get her out of her residence.

Grice was booked into the Texas County jail on Wednesday.

Fifth person arrested in connection to death of 2 Kansas moms

Paul Grice was charged with two counts of first-degree murder, two counts of kidnapping and one count of conspiracy to commit murder in the first degree

www.koco.com

Grice is being held without bond at the Texas County Detention Center in Guymon, a jail official said. Court and jail records don’t indicate if Grice has an attorney who could speak on his behalf.

Oklahoma prosecutors charge fifth member of anti-government group in Kansas women's killings

Oklahoma prosecutors have charged a fifth member of an anti-government group with killing and kidnapping two Kansas women.

apnews.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1783228085908771020

bbm - this may have already been answered and if so, I apologize. But....did she know they were trying to get her out of the residence?

 

[imstilla.grandma]

bbm - this may have already been answered and if so, I apologize. But....did she know they were trying to get her out of the residence?

Not a lot of details on that. For some reason, they were relatively sure she’d come out of her house. Possibly a setup meeting to go to. Or someone had been stalking her habits?

 

[vls12345]

bbm - this may have already been answered and if so, I apologize. But....did she know they were trying to get her out of the residence?

I have wondered the same thing.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

The absolute perfect picture of irony...reading over your Freedom Bundle while sitting in your prison cell, serving LWOP, or worse.

Yes! And presumably after having spent $400.00 dollars. US American dollars. (emphasis added) MOO

 

[anneoakley63]

So I'm not very informed on the entire Sovereign Citizen thing and this may be a dumb question. Looking at the filings by PG, it seems they were filed at the Clerk's office. Does that mean he is no longer a US Citizen? I just don't understand how all of that works.

 

[Artis]

Tifany Adams is “unhinged,” acccording to Leanne Webb, who met Adams last year at a political event and became friendly with her. “She has a lot of weird beliefs, and thinks that the rest of the world is corrupt. It was all conspiracy theories and stuff that didn’t make any sense.”

In February, Adams, 54, reposted an article which claimed modern society was living in a simulation. “She posted a few times a day sometimes, but it was all stuff like that,” says Webb.

“It was just bizarre, bizarre stuff,” said Webb, who later unfriended them. “And they were going to raise [her grandkids] to believe the same things.”

God’s Misfits cult grandma Tifany Adams, accused of killing 2 Kansas moms, is ‘unhinged’ conspiracy theorist: pal

“She has a lot of weird beliefs, and thinks that the rest of the world is corrupt. It was all conspiracy theories and stuff that didn’t make any sense,” said a former pal.

nypost.com

Ha! Well, the world is a corrupt place but double murder is what - moral and upstanding? SMH. And, simulation theory? That is the realm of theoretical physics (the Matrix). I think Elon Musk is a believer. Doesn't really fit with the southern bible thumper picture we've been seeing. That's further evidence, for me, that these people were not motivated by any religious stuff. They're simply homicidal criminals like all of the other ones covered here.

 

[AugustWest]

So I'm not very informed on the entire Sovereign Citizen thing and this may be a dumb question. Looking at the filings by PG, it seems they were filed at the Clerk's office. Does that mean he is no longer a US Citizen? I just don't understand how all of that works.

It serves no legal purpose at all. The whole sovereign citizen thing is something that people who think they are smarter than they are invented to limit their liability to and with the government. The basis of it is that they believe the U.S. government has no jurisdiction over them through a twisted reading of U.S. treaties that deal with admiralty law and international law. If you know someone that believes this hocus pocus, please laugh at them for me.