Found Deceased OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #5 *Arrests*

[Seattle1]

I can't get this to play. Someone please help! Lol!!
Which child had the birthday party??!

NG's allegations/headlines are incorrect. All defendants were already in custody by 4/17/24. We can't discuss the minors here.

 

[Warwick7]

NG's allegations/headlines are incorrect. All defendants were already in custody by 4/17/24. We can't discuss the minors here.

Thank you...
The twet made it sound like it was new information from msm, when it wasn't at all.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

The landowner just didn’t know there were bodies underneath. News reports also say there was hay placed near and on the digging site to draw Cullum’s cattle to the spot, to trample the earth, further disguising the dig.

KANSAS MOMS IN HORRIFIC HOLE, 10 FT DEEP, DIRT, CEMENT CHUNKS, HAY: BURIED ALIVE? | Crime Stories with Nancy Grace | Podplay

According to court documents, the elaborate plan to kill Veronica Butler and Jillian Kelly began with a simple lie, the day before the murders. Tad Cullum, the boyfriend of grandmother Tiffany Adam...

www.podplay.com

*has anyone heard how wide the hole was?

NewsNation visited the site at night and documented the disturbed earth about 50 feet from the dam where authorities eventually found the bodies buried 10 feet underground. There was a hay bale nearby that sources said Cullum had strategically positioned to attract cattle and obscure evidence of the digging

Kansas moms killings: What we know

New details have emerged about the killings of two Kansas mothers whose suspected killers had a violent history, according to court documents.

www.newsnationnow.com

 

[Seattle1]

For whatever reason TA did not want to kill/involve Brune and did not care about the life of whichever supervisor VB brought.

^^rsbm

Agree completely as we know the only reason that JK was murdered was because the defendants believed JK supported VB.

From the AA, pgs 5-6/7:

 

[OddOneOut]

According to this article, the cause of death has not been determined except that they were not shot.

MSN

 

[Seattle1]

I can't get this to play. Someone please help! Lol!!
Which child had the birthday party??!

From the AA pg 4/7, VB was taking daughter to a birthday party:

 

[doublestop]

I can't get this to play. Someone please help! Lol!!
Which child had the birthday party??!

VB's younger child.

 

[Seattle1]

Does someone have the link where Brian Entin is interviewing Veronica's attorney? I lost it.

I did not see MSM interview with VB's attorney but he was interviewed by OSBI per the AA, pg 5/7:

 

[GRT]

sbm

I don't know, but the way it turned out was that she "notified" authorities when they interviewed her post-murder. That's when she told them TA told her she wasn't needed this time.

Is it possible that Brune notified someone who then notified VB that Brune wouldn't be there--and that's why VB arranged for JK to go?

Maybe TA didn't think anyone would be there to supervise the visit and she didn't think VB would know. Then TA makes the call to VB and finds out a substitute will be coming with. Time is getting down to the wire, so they decide to take the both out.

I don't know but as CT told her daughter -- it didn't go as planned.

I just wonder what the plan was?

 

[Cryptic]

Again I'm a bit confused.
It was a court order for VB to have a supervisor with her when she picked up her kids. They were to stay with all three of them until the visit was over.

Sounds like Bruno (sp) and JK as well as others were pre-approved by the court. Anyway that's what I understood from documents and msm.

That is how I read it as well. Maybe something like:

Court: Due to prior, well, "stunts" you are required to have supervised visits. Here is a list of court approved supervisors.

VB then contacts the Pastor and his wife from the list when her usual supervisor cant make it. Pastor and JK view their certification and participation as part of their religious mission assisting "moms at risk" (and a few dads).

So, upon getting asked, JK responds- even on Easter weekend?

I dont know who pays for the supervisor? Maybe they receive a stipend from the Court upon supervising a visit? ie- so much per day?

 

[Marie A]

‘God’s Misfits’ murder victims ‘did not have gunshot wounds’, cause of death unknown

Paul Grice, latest suspect to be charged with murder, told investigators he was involved in ‘burial’ of Veronica Butler and Jilian Kelley

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Knox]

Does someone have the link where Brian Entin is interviewing Veronica's attorney? I lost it.

It was Chris Cuomo? Attorney does not say much in the interview, FWIW.

Kansas mom’s attorney: Custody fight ‘contentious from beginning’

The custody dispute between Butler and her children’s paternal grandmother, Tifany Adams, was “contentious from the beginning.”

www.newsnationnow.com

 

[Leilei]

I think the reason Brune couldn’t be used as the supervisor was that TA would need to meet her at Fourways with the children. If that was the scenario then the other ‘misfits’ would need to intercept and kill VB. i think TA was so vindictive that she wanted to inflict pain on and kill VB herself. she was proud to do so…
moo

Yep. I've thought that TA wanted to be the last face that VB saw, and the last voice that VB heard. IMO.

 

[Warwick7]

It was Chris Cuomo? Attorney does not say much in the interview, FWIW.

Kansas mom’s attorney: Custody fight ‘contentious from beginning’

The custody dispute between Butler and her children’s paternal grandmother, Tifany Adams, was “contentious from the beginning.”

www.newsnationnow.com

Thank you so much!

 

[Knox]

That is how I read it as well. Maybe something like:

Court: Due to prior, well, "stunts" you are required to have supervised visits. Here is a list of court approved supervisors.

VB then contacts the Pastor and his wife from the list when her usual supervisor cant make it. Pastor and JK view their certification and participation as part of their religious mission assisting "moms at risk" (and a few dads).

So, upon getting asked, JK responds- even on Easter weekend?

I dont know who pays for the supervisor? Maybe they receive a stipend from the Court upon supervising a visit? ie- so much per day?

Scroll down to bottom at link below, affidavits are there with the details you are looking for.

Adams paid for the court ordered supervisor. She told Veronica, Brune was unavailable for the 3/30/24 visitation, so Veronica contacted Jillian (alternate).

Court Documents: 4 suspects in missing Kansas women case part of anti-government group

Court documents show the details of the investigation that led to the arrest of four suspects in the murders of Veronica Butler and Jillian Kelley.

www.newschannel10.com

 

[Seattle1]

Is it possible that Brune notified someone who then notified VB that Brune wouldn't be there--and that's why VB arranged for JK to go?

Maybe TA didn't think anyone would be there to supervise the visit and she didn't think VB would know. Then TA makes the call to VB and finds out a substitute will be coming with. Time is getting down to the wire, so they decide to take the both out.

I don't know but as CT told her daughter -- it didn't go as planned.

I just wonder what the plan was?

Generally, a Court Order for supervised visitation provides the names of the individuals sanctioned by the Court as supervisors, and also defines the instructions for changing the schedule and the deadline to do so. This is to prevent last minute mockery, etc.

From the AA, pages 4-5, we know that TA lied to VB when she stated that CB was not available to supervise visitation on March 30 and requested VB furnish an alternate supervisor from those previously named by the Court:

 

[Arkay]

If TA didn't tell Brune to take the couple of weeks off, then VB would have been driving alone. Why why why make VB find a sub to just kill her? Its wild.

I dont know a lot about supervised custody, so someone more knowledgeable might have to chime in. But when that sort of thing is commanded by the state, does the Supervisor usually show up for the exchange? Apparently they were headed to the exchange or right near it, right? So would Brune have been at the meeting spot where all of this occured?

I’ve mentioned before that I had to serve in this capacity as a supervisor for a married couple who had lost custody of all three children due to drug abuse.

I don’t know how it works in other states, but here in NY the handover is at a child welfare agency. I’m a teacher, so I’d been already cleared ages ago as someone who is responsible and safe around children.

A van drove me and the children to the agency in Manhattan, where the children were reunited with their parents for two hours, twice a week. Then I escorted the children again back home to where they were staying.
Had I not been there, in NY the parents would not have been able to spend time with the children as they took the children outdoors.

Of course they lost custody because they were deemed unsafe to be alone with the children. Therefore they couldn’t spend even two hours with them without a supervisor to ensure the children were safe.
What if the parents, unsupervised, did drugs with the kids there? Or absconded with them?

In NY, the schools are also notified that the parents cannot pick up the children from school until custody is regained (as did eventually happen with the couple I supervised). Unsafe parents are unsafe parents.

It just wouldn’t happen here unless someone badly messed up.

My point is that SOMEONE had to escort VB until she regained legal custody. So if this was TA’s plan, SOMEONE else would die along with VB.

I agree that TA likely didn’t want Brune in that situation. I can also envision a scenario in which VB drives alone, but at the handoff and following, she must have a verified escort.

What I, as a mega-city dweller, cannot fathom is HOW in ANY state, children can be handed over at some nowhere spot, rather than at a city agency or police station.

It’s a volatile situation, and very emotional for the children when they must depart from their parents at the end of the visit.

JMO and experience.

ETA: I posted this before I read the post from @Rixey, but yes, supervision is required throughout.

 

[Warwick7]

That is how I read it as well. Maybe something like:

Court: Due to prior, well, "stunts" you are required to have supervised visits. Here is a list of court approved supervisors.

VB then contacts the Pastor and his wife from the list when her usual supervisor cant make it. Pastor and JK view their certification and participation as part of their religious mission assisting "moms at risk" (and a few dads).

So, upon getting asked, JK responds- even on Easter weekend?

I dont know who pays for the supervisor? Maybe they receive a stipend from the Court upon supervising a visit? ie- so much per day?

The documents said Bruna (sp) was to be paid by TA and JK was to be paid by VB.

 

[Odeto BJ]

VB then contacts the Pastor and his wife from the list when her usual supervisor cant make it. Pastor and JK view their certification and participation as part of their religious mission assisting "moms at risk" (and a few dads).

So, upon getting asked, JK responds- even on Easter weekend?

I dont know who pays for the supervisor? Maybe they receive a stipend from the Court upon supervising a visit? ie- so much per day?

OK - OK, Veronica Butler 27 & Jilian Kelley 39, Vehicle Abandoned, Texas County, 30 Mar 2024 #2 *Arrests*

So sad. It looks like the Twombly's had a decent family life until they messed it all up. Then I have my hopes set on her to spill the tea and take a plea.

www.websleuths.com

Quoting myself: but just after the arrests it was my speculation that TA and JK were aware of each other and their interaction had been "sour".
I think that TA could make her excuse to CB as per the affadavit and also never told VB that she needed to arrange an alternate supervisor....and VB would have been traveling alone. LE would have found that out during their investigation; and that would point the finger at TA. Although in my mind, that is more subtle than what else TA did: arrange for babysitting for the children at the same time as the exchange was supposed to be occurring. Only difference is: we know that the babysitters were members of God's misfits. Thus far, there is nothing that indicates CB was.

Thus the prior speculation: TA put the onus on VB to arrange supervision; VB indicated it would be JK; TA had had enough exposure to JK to know that she was supportive of VB.... so TA related to her cohorts that JK was obstructing their goals and would need to become a victim. Only my speculation: but I continue to believe that TA and possibly other members of God's misfits had specific cause to be PO'd with JK, even if such cause was flimsy or even fantasy.
I have also always thought that the overall plan had to include a disposition for the car: and that burying it was not part of the original plan. I too want to know the rest of the dimensions of that hole.

MOO and speculative as applicable.

MOO

 

[Sincerely]

Why wouldn't Brune have ridden with Veronica? Can non-custodial parents who require supervision be allowed to drive with the kids to some place to have the supervised visit and meet up with the supervisor? Or would Brune have taken the kids to Veronica?

Oh that’s a great question.