POLL - Kobe Bryant case dropped: How do you feel?

[BirdieBoo]

I wasn't attacking you, just asking you some very valid questions to try and understand your pov since you said your mind was not made up until you read the apology. If you think asking you some questions (less agressive than the ones you asked LinasK) was an attack then you might want to reasses the ones you asked LinasK (a victim of rape).

Nope, I don't watch b-ball at all, could care less about him personally. I read the court docs, all of them.
If you haven't followed the case closely then you may have missed where it was reported by her friends (that were there) about the party in the bar where she was giggling about this encounter. I don't have a link offhand, but if I come across it again I'll put it up for you.

And no, even that site you listed doesn't say that right after a rape that women try to have normal sexual relations right after. Look at it again, it says months, not within hours...

I have worked with women who have been raped, not one of them had sex immediately after they were attacked either. Only one other person on this board posted almost the exact same thing...it simply doesn't ring true. Not to the victims of rape, and not to those of us who actually have worked with real rape victims.

I've never, ever come across a real rape victim that went out within hours of being violently raped to have sex with anyone, even a hubby or long term bf! Speaking of that...
The AV's ex-bf refused to give DNA samples to be compared to the sperm found inside her body after the alleged rape. If he hadn't had sex with her why refuse to give a DNA sample?

Read the court docs, they are very informative and they are from both sides.

else. Neither have any of these organizations.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/rape.html
http://www.hopeforhealing.org/
http://www.rapecrisis.org.za/
http://www.ncptsd.org/facts/disasters/fs_foa_handout.html
http://www.actabuse.com/psycho-reactions.html
http://www.ncptsd.org/publications/...l?printable=yes
http://www.911rape.com/impact/


I am not saying nothing happened, I'm saying something doesn't smell right about this case. I think both of them were lying to some degree. She never told Kobe "no" according to the detective who initially interviewed her...yet he's (Kobe) hiding things too.
Maybe it will all come out in the civil case, unless they do a "sealed settlement agreement for an undisclosed sum" which is what Wood usually tries to get.

Whatever Seeker. You clearly showed your contempt for my right to my own opinion by asking if I even read the apology. I obviously don't know anything about rape. How do you think I got the job volunteering in the rape crisis center? Obviously because I know NOTHING about rape. Right down to the part about being held down by the neck.You're right, I'm wrong. Just like you are right about this case and the victim is wrong.

That's why many rape victims never tell a soul. Because people don't BELIEVE them. People accuse them of lying. People who weren't even there.

Did anyone tell you you didn't act like a molestation victim after the fact? Was your molestation portrayed in the media before the entire nation with a sympathetic slant towards your molester? Did people judge you for not getting away from your molester when "things started heating up"? Were you portrayed in the media as someone who seduced your molester with the idea of getting money? The answers to any and all of these questions have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with WHETHER OR NOT AN ACTUAL RAPE OCCURRED.They have everything to do with how our society treats rape victims.

Robert Chambers' attorneys portrayed Jennifer Levin just exactly the same way. According to them, she was a *advertiser censored*. She seduced Chambers. SHE ASKED FOR IT. And someone must have thought it was true. Because Jennifer wasn't just raped. She was MURDERED. And portrayed in the media as a loose woman. Who obviously therefore deserved it. Because things like that don't happen to nice girls. And you can't rape a *advertiser censored*. Someone must have thought it was true because her killer walks the streets today, a free man, 37 years old. He did have to do some prison time. But only because of THAT *advertiser censored*.


Men who are falsely accused of rape don't apologize for it in order to get out of standing trial for it. That's just my opinion, but I do have some experience to back me up.

I also notice you put up a link for South African rape crisis. I'd say that's reaching a little. South Africa is known for a lot, but not for its exemplary treatment of rape victims. As evidenced by the cartoon on that site of the little kid saying "You can get away with rape if you are famous and have a hotshot legal team"

I think Kobe is a rapist. That is my opinion and I won't change it for you. So it's time to leave me alone about it.

 

[peggy]

Sports Illustrated revealing parts of sealed Kobe interview with LE

When he was questioned by two police officers in the parking lot of the Lodge and Spa at Cordillera in the early morning of July 2, 2003, Bryant, after first denying an encounter took place, admitted to "holding her around her neck from behind" and graphically described a series of sex acts he engaged in with his accuser.

• As the officers and Bryant made small talk while walking to his room, Bryant told them he would pay his accuser to make the charges go away because "I'm in the worst f------ situation."

SI

 

[BirdieBoo]

Sports Illustrated revealing parts of sealed Kobe interview with LE

When he was questioned by two police officers in the parking lot of the Lodge and Spa at Cordillera in the early morning of July 2, 2003, Bryant, after first denying an encounter took place, admitted to "holding her around her neck from behind" and graphically described a series of sex acts he engaged in with his accuser.

• As the officers and Bryant made small talk while walking to his room, Bryant told them he would pay his accuser to make the charges go away because "I'm in the worst f------ situation."

SI

Thank you for posting that article Peggy. I wonder what kind of man has to pay his sexual partners (consensual or not) *Hush money*. Especially since prostitutes will do the same thing for a lot less.

 

[peggy]

Thank you for posting that article Peggy. I wonder what kind of man has to pay his sexual partners (consensual or not) *Hush money*. Especially since prostitutes will do the same thing for a lot less.

A wealthy rapist would do that.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Thank you for posting that article Peggy. I wonder what kind of man has to pay his sexual partners (consensual or not) *Hush money*. Especially since prostitutes will do the same thing for a lot less.

Well we know he paid his wife and that worked out ok!

 

[Seeker]

EAGLE COUNTY - Kobe Bryant's statements about last summer's event to sheriff's investigators, and a compact disc recording of the interview, was mailed to the Vail Daily anonymously Wednesday.

The large, brown envelope carried a Denver postmark and no return address.

The CD recording contained the voices of Eagle County Sheriff's Det. Doug Winters, Eagle County Sheriff's Det. Doug Loya and Bryant as Bryant was interviewed the night after he alleged raped a 19-year-old Eagle woman at the Lodge and Spa at Cordillera June 30, 2003.

Whether or not the transcript and CD were complete was impossible to discern at press time. However, since the voices of Winters, Loya and Bryant were discernible, the Daily opted to report on the recording. If any parts of the Bryant's interview have been edited out of the transcript provided to the Daily, those parts will be included later.

The recording and transcript, along with everything else related to the case, were sealed from the public after Bryant's attorneys requested and received a temporary restraining order prohibiting their release. District Judge Richard Hart is expected to rule this month on whether the information will remain sealed.

Bryant's version

On the recording Bryant sounded at times surprised, upset, agitated and disbelieving.

He wondered what the young woman wanted ... money perhaps ... and seemed surprised to learn that, according to Winters, she didn't want anything.

He said he would take a polygraph test, or cooperate in any other way the detectives asked. While the detectives talked what the results of a polygraph test might be, Bryant remarked that he didn't know his hands were shaking.

Bryant's version of events was similar to his alleged victim's. He said they took a tour of the hotel and grounds, that they ended up in his hotel room, that they talked about tattoos and that she showed him where the bears come down to the window near Bryant's suite, Room 35.

The rest is here

 

[BirdieBoo]

Seeker, your link doesn't work.

 

[Rum Tum Tugger]

Seeker, your link doesn't work.

Try this one ...

"Bryant cooperative, inconsistent when questioned"

"Investigate, punish leak, Bryant's attorneys ask"


September 16, 2004

EAGLE COUNTY - Kobe Bryant was cooperative with the sheriff's investigators who questioned him the night after an Eagle woman said he had raped her, although he gave them sometimes conflicting answers.

"Ask me what, ask me something, ask me anything," Bryant said, according to a transcript and recording mailed anonymously to the Vail Daily this week.

Bryant's first reaction to questions about having sex with his alleged victim was a denial, which Eagle County Sheriff's Detective Doug Winters would later say was one reason he didn't completely believe Bryant's version of events the night of June 30, 2003.

Winters: "OK. Um. I'll be blunt and ask you. Did you have sexual intercourse with her?"

Bryant: "No."

As the questioning continued, Bryant later said, "... uh I did have sexual intercourse with her ..."

Sheriff's Detective Dan Loya then asked, "OK, was it consensual?"

Bryant answered, "It was totally consensual."
Loya asked, "What makes you believe, what makes you believe it was consensual?"

Bryant answered, "'Cause she started kissing me, (inaudible) then she bent over and (inaudible)."
Bryant told the investigators that he stopped the first time he heard young woman say, "No." He said the young woman had sex voluntarily with him. Then while she was kissing him goodbye, she asked for an autograph, which Bryant declined to give, saying she could have it the next day when she showed up for work, he told the detectives.

Winters later testified in court that the alleged victim said she told Bryant "no" at least twice.
Loya and Winters talked to Bryant for about 75 minutes in his room and the parking lot of the Lodge & Spa at Cordillera last summer.

Bryant told Loya and Winters he regularly had similar sexual encounters with a woman named "Michelle." Bryant said Michelle could verify that he held her from behind the same way he held the 19-year-old Eagle woman who accused him of sexual assault.

Bryant said the two took a tour of the Cordillera grounds, which ended back at his room. He said she showed him where the bears come up to the back window.

Family concerns

Bryant told the investigators that his wife and daughter mean everything to him. He also expressed concerns about his career and his image if the rape allegation became public.

"Is there any way I can settle this, whatever it is?" asked Bryant.

"Well, what do you mean by settle?" Winters answered.

"If my wife, if my wife found out that anybody made any type of allegations against me, she would be infuriated," Bryant said.

Bryant told investigators he would take a polygraph test.

"If it becomes public I'll lose my wife ... that's all I care about."

Tattoos

During questioning, Loya asked Bryant how the woman showed him a tattoo on her back. He told the investigators that she had a tattoo on her ankle and shoulder. When asked about the young woman, he immediately recalled her name for the investigators.

Bryant: "She had like a strap or whatever and she like lowered it. I told her to turn around and she lowered it and she showed me."

Winters: "OK, all right um, did anything happen in the room?"

Bryant: "Like what?"

Loya: "Uh, did you guys hug or kiss?"

Winters: "Kiss or hug?"

Bryant: "No."

That was before the detectives informed him of her accusation and that evidence of a sexual encounter have been obtained. Later he claimed that she had kissed him first to initiate their encounter.

Motives?

Bryant seemed surprised the alleged victim didn't appear to investigators to want anything from him.

Bryant: "... I can't believe this girl. What does she want from me?"

Winters: "I don't think she wants anything."

Bryant: "Are you kidding me?"

Loya: "What are you willing to give her?"

Bryant: "She has to want, she has to want something (inaudible) she has to want something."

Winters: "What do you mean she has to want something? I don't understand."

Bryant: "She has to have a, she has to have a motive, to do, she has to have a motive to do this."

Winters: "What would be, what do you think her motive is, then?"

Loya: "Are you willing to pay that if she is?"

Bryant: "I got to. I got to. I'm in the worst (edited) situation."

{Continued next post)

 

[Rum Tum Tugger]

The hug

Bryant said she asked him for a hug, which he said was initially platonic, but grew into much more.

Detective Winters: Yeah, did she ask you to give, did you ask her to give you a hug?

Bryant: We stood there and you know I pretty much (inaudible) like I don't know, I might have hugged you all, like, when you came up to me, and I'd be like a hug, you know what I mean.

Detective Loya: Was just a friendly gesture?

Bryant: Right. I mean it looked like this, like OK, all right ... whatever ... you know ... she kissed me (inaudible).

Detective Winters: And I, and I don't disagree that any of that happened, okay. I do not disagree with it that any of that happened, okay.

The demonstration

Bryant demonstrated on Loya how he and the young woman were positioned on the chair where the sexual encounter occurred.

Detective Loya: Did you ever have her from the back of her head or her neck? Were you ... ? What kind of intercourse was it?

Bryant: (inaudible) held her from the back? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Detective Loya: Yeah.
(Lots of voices talking over.)

Bryant: (Inaudible). All right um ... (inaudible)

Detective Loya: I don't want you to demonstrate.

Bryant: I held her from the back and I went like this.

Detective Loya: So what did you have around her neck?

Bryant: I had my right hand like this and my other hand like that.

Detective Winters: Okay.

Detective Loya: Okay.

Bryant: But ... (inaudible).

Detective Loya: How hard were you holding her?

Detective Winters: OK, all right.

Bryant: I don't know. My hands are strong. I don't know.

Media apprehension

Bryant said he feared the news media finding out about the investigation.

Bryant: All right, all right, can I ask you a question, though?

Detective Winters: I'll let you ask some questions.

Bryant: I do not want it to get to the media.

Detective Winters: We don't either.

Detective Loya: That's why we're here at this time of night.

Bryant: So how could that happen?

Detective Winters: And we're doing everything we can to try to avoid this going out publicly. We're working on that okay. I, I don't know the answer to that right now okay, I can't promise you anything. I wish I could but I can't. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way in our line of work, okay?

Detective Loya: Hey Kobe, have you ever had any of these allegations made against you before?

Bryant: No. Are you kidding me?

Detective Loya: No?

Bryant: Never, I like, I treat everybody with the utmost respect, absolutely nothing. ...

Skepticism

Winters said he isn't sure when the sex was no longer consensual, but at some point he thought it became became so.

Detective Winters: And I understand, and just let me finish okay. So one you lied to us, okay, that doesn't help. Two, um, then, then we confront this issue and you seemed a little bit skeptical in the details of exactly what happened throughout the entire incident okay. I'm not saying you're a person that would do something like this okay. I agree with you, I agree that you got caught up in the moment. Okay. No doubt about it, you know, no doubt about it whatsoever. What I think you got caught up in also Mr. Bryant, is that, and I agree, I, I completely agree you, it was consensual up to the point of the hugging and kissing issue I agree, completely consensual. I have no issues with that whatsoever. What I, what I'm being, what I'm skeptical on is that I don't know how consensual the sexual intercourse was. Okay. I don't, I don't, I guess to be honest with you I'm not sure, I'm not sure, if we're getting all the facts presented to us as far as exactly what happened.

Early alert

More than two hours before Bryant was contacted by law enforcement that night, a Vail Daily reporter received a telephone tip that sheriff's investigators were on their way to Cordillera to question him about a sexual assault allegation.

The Daily decided not to report on the investigation until more formal action took place that advanced the case against Bryant. If authorities had deemed the allegations against Bryant unfounded and closed the case, the Daily would not have reported on the accusations.

The transcript

The Daily published a story about the transcript Thursday, and a complete transcript of the interview was posted on the paper's Web site, vaildaily.com, with light editing for profanity and some of the most graphic details in the questioning. The printout and audio recording were mailed anonymously from Denver in a large, brown envelope with no return address.

Sources close to the case said the transcript was accurate.

At the request of Bryant's attorneys, District Judge Richard Hart had issued a temporary restraining order prohibiting any public release of records or evidence from the case.

Calls for investigation by Bryant's attorneys left some legal experts unmoved.

"This woman has been getting pounded for 14 months, and now the first time someone comes out with something about Kobe Bryant the defense is yelling foul," said former Denver District Attorney Norm Early. "He isn't going through anything his victim hasn't gone through over and over."

Local defense attorney Jim Fahrenholtz said Bryant's statements were really nothing special.

"It doesn't seem too out of the ordinary for a guy being asked questions about committing adultry. Most men would naturally be nervous. It seemed consistent with what had said all along. If someone sent it to try to be damning to him, I didn't find it that damning."

Fahrenholtz said they dealt with the situation head-on when they held their press conference at Los Angeles' Staples Center the day Bryant was charged.

A spokeswoman for prosecutors said Bryant's statements were one piece of their case.
"We had a strong case and a lot of evidence, and this was one piece of it," said District Attorney's Office spokeswoman Krista Flannigan.
"His statements would have been admissible had criminal trial gone forward."

Bryant's statements were part of the physical evidence his defense attorneys had hoped to keep out of the criminal trial, if it had gone forward. As the two investigators were collecting Bryant's clothing and other physical evidence, Bryant gave them the T-shirt he was wearing, which turned out to be stained with three flecks of the woman's blood.

The criminal case was dropped Sept. 1 after Bryant's alleged victim told prosecutors she could not go forward with testifying. The lawsuit, filed last month in federal court in Denver, is still pending.

"It's too bad they didn't go to trial," said Fahrenholtz.

 

[Doyle]

thanks for these tidbits RumTum Tugger.

I personally would have like to see it go to trial.

I am not a fan of Kobe at all. I would like to see where all the 'reported' information about the 'supposed' victim really came from. I would not be surprised to see one Pamela Mackey masterminding a lot of slime at the 'supposed' victim.

In my mind he is guilty.

I was recently in vegas for a few days, and I attended the world music awards, and lo and behold, one of the presenters was Kobe. He was greeted with a tremendously favorable reception. So for him, this is just about over.

 

[lisag]

I dont think he is guilty of rape... I think he is guilty of adultery.

I think the "victim" has issues..

I think Kobe is a jerk for haivng an affair..

I think his wife is an insecure knob for putting up with it/him..

 

[BirdieBoo]

So for him, this is just about over.

Until he does it again.

 

[VespaElf]

Could this be the REAL reason the "AV" refused to continue with Criminal case??

http://www.globemagazine.com/

http://www.tabloidcolumn.com/kobe-bryant.html


The Father is possibly someone she met at Rehab...........oh that wouldve gone over well with a Jury!!!!!!


I still feel Kobe is a pampered,over paid sports "star" who is guilty of two things-

Adultry and Bad Judgement !!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Is that true? How absolutely sad is that. She's going to bring a kid into her messed up life? Wonderful. Just wonderful. She's at least 8 weeks pregnant by a guy she met in rehab who has Hep. C? :loser: :loser: :loser:

Note to Kobe: Next time you cheat on your wife, make sure she's not a drug addicted head case.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Well, here they are - in all their gross glory. Not for children:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0924041kobea1.html

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Bryant accuser adopts 'attorney for the damned' in civil suit


DENVER (AP) — The Kobe Bryant defense team that saw a rape charge against the NBA star thrown out three weeks ago faces a tough new challenge in civil court: L. Lin Wood, a fearless, media-savvy Atlanta lawyer once called the "attorney for the damned."

Wood is representing Bryant's 20-year-old accuser in a lawsuit in which the woman is seeking an unspecified amount of money, as well as public vindication.

"If you're going to go to war — and I do adopt the philosophy that every lawsuit is a war and each step along the way can be described as a battle — then you've got to believe in what you're fighting for and in the person you're fighting for," Wood said in a recent interview. "I do that."

The federal lawsuit against Bryant is unusual territory for Wood, who is best known for bringing libel and defamation cases on behalf of the accused.

Story continues


www.courttv.com

 

[VespaElf]

Bryant accuser adopts 'attorney for the damned' in civil suit


DENVER (AP) — The Kobe Bryant defense team that saw a rape charge against the NBA star thrown out three weeks ago faces a tough new challenge in civil court: L. Lin Wood, a fearless, media-savvy Atlanta lawyer once called the "attorney for the damned."

Wood is representing Bryant's 20-year-old accuser in a lawsuit in which the woman is seeking an unspecified amount of money, as well as public vindication.

"If you're going to go to war — and I do adopt the philosophy that every lawsuit is a war and each step along the way can be described as a battle — then you've got to believe in what you're fighting for and in the person you're fighting for," Wood said in a recent interview. "I do that."

The federal lawsuit against Bryant is unusual territory for Wood, who is best known for bringing libel and defamation cases on behalf of the accused.

Story continues


www.courttv.com

She dropped out of the criminal case because she didnt want her private life on display........well what does she think will happen in a civ trial where the 'gloves are off'???? IF she is pregnant Mackay can (and would) ask for all those lovely details............sheesh and in Lin Wood certainly lessens her credibilty (if thats at all possible)!
I hope we get to find out what the text messages said,who Mr.X is AND in the end she doesnt get a dime!!!!!!!!!!

 

[BirdieBoo]

She dropped out of the criminal case because she didnt want her private life on display........well what does she think will happen in a civ trial where the 'gloves are off'???? IF she is pregnant Mackay can (and would) ask for all those lovely details............sheesh and in Lin Wood certainly lessens her credibilty (if thats at all possible)!
I hope we get to find out what the text messages said,who Mr.X is AND in the end she doesnt get a dime!!!!!!!!!!

Why would her pregnancy have any relevance in the civil case?

 

[BirdieBoo]

Well, here they are - in all their gross glory. Not for children:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0924041kobea1.html

Thanks for those transcripts Jeana.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

She dropped out of the criminal case because she didnt want her private life on display........well what does she think will happen in a civ trial where the 'gloves are off'???? IF she is pregnant Mackay can (and would) ask for all those lovely details............sheesh and in Lin Wood certainly lessens her credibilty (if thats at all possible)!
I hope we get to find out what the text messages said,who Mr.X is AND in the end she doesnt get a dime!!!!!!!!!!

That's crap. She dropped the civil case because she's a lunatic. Lin Wood is her best hope for a settlement before any trial. I can't see a jury awarding her anything, but someone from his camp may want this settled in order to avoid damaging his "reputation" any more than it has been. If he's truly innocent of the rape charges, then I hope he certainly learns his lessons. He had a long time affair already going on when this happened. No wonder the wife got the big rock. She had to hear about all this at once. If she has to go through a civil trial, its going to cost him a fortune just to keep her happy.