Australia Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat 100km NW of Melbourne, 4 Feb 2024 #4

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TootsieFootsie said:
There are many people who would not be able to react with a scream or yelling even if their life was in danger.

I'm one of those, I'd be frozen to the spot, unable to make a sound.
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Sissy said that when she was attacked she forgot all about her phone. The attack happened so quickly.

Source: Under Investigation show
 
I cannot stop thinking about the correlation with a possible dented vehicle and the comment from one of the pressers regarding lots of movement to and from the residence that morning after Sam left for her run...
 
I never scream when I'm frightened. The one time I really wanted to, I opened my mouth and nothing happened. I'm sure it's common enough for someone to completely freeze up when in the grip of a huge shock. Additionally, the perp(s), if they were even remotely prepared for what they were doing, would have known they needed to do something immediately to keep her from screaming and attracting attention. I know tasers and pepper spray are basically illegal in Australia, but someone bent on murder or abduction may very well have access to contraband items as well. Or they could have given her a quick blow to the back of the head or even just clamped a hand over her mouth while grabbing her from behind to make sure she didn't have a chance to make a sound.

Just writing that makes me so angry for her. :(
 
Dogmum05 said:
I am not familiar with Ballarat and the Mt Clear area ... can anyone tell me how far away from houses/people the 7km spot everyone is focussed on is? Is it close enough for people to hear screaming. If a stranger had come towards Sam to attack her, she would have fought but also screamed and screamed alot I reckon. If the 7km spot is close enough to houses for screams to be heard and none were then I am thinking more that it is someone she knows or possibly a car accident but the car accident theory has never really worked for me as very very hard not to leave some evidence.
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From what I can tell, the closest buildings would be those which form Mt Clear College. It backs onto the forest between Boak Road and Olympic Avenue. A 10 min walk or 2 min drive from where the police were searching.

Interestingly, cars park along that road (Olympic Ave) and may not seem out of place if a perp was parked there.

b.jpg b1.jpg

Google Maps
 
I went through a haunted house with my kids many years ago, screamed blue murder, and nearly bashed the poor demon to death that jumped out at me - the kids were laughing and holding me back, but my reactions surprised me more than that demon! So yeah, who knows how we react! oh, and the demon was fine, amused and cautious, no doubt, from that point on. And safe to say I will never visit a haunted house again!
 
Liadan said:
I went through a haunted house with my kids many years ago, screamed blue murder, and nearly bashed the poor demon to death that jumped out at me - the kids were laughing and holding me back, but my reactions surprised me more than that demon! So yeah, who knows how we react! oh, and the demon was fine, amused and cautious, no doubt, from that point on. And safe to say I will never visit a haunted house again!
Click to expand...
Haha
Me too.
I scream blue murder.
Oh, and kick and bite.
 
Dotta said:
Haha
Me too.
I scream blue murder.
Oh, and kick and bite.
Click to expand...
That's me too. I was followed and attempted attack years ago in Europe and my reaction was so loud and crazed I think the guy felt like the victim! We don't know until we are in the situation though. I surprised myself with how much rage I felt rather than fear. I just thought how dare you you lowlife piece of crap. He had a knife but was so shocked by my crazed reaction he dropped it.
 
A damaged vehicle - I am not sure that police are referring to it being damaged because it hit SM but maybe it is implicated in moving her away from the site where she was taken. I mean, we ostensibly know she went to Mt Clear, but we don't know if her 'abduction' took place along the path or at the return point (or as she travelled back from the return point?).
As Nifty (I think) pointed out, ironically, it's a smash repair business; I read "lots of damaged cars" at the disposal of people. So what if the business did car pickups, and maybe one that was due to be picked for a fix-up was used? So, on Saturday, someone uses a car to drive to the damaged car (parks nearby); the damaged car is then used on Saturday to transport SM elsewhere, the damaged car is put back to the original location, and the person drives away in a car. Finally, the damaged car is picked up again Monday morning for fixing at the auto garage.
Most vehicles these days have GPS so I am sure police would be checking all the family car movements. I wonder if there is access to old vehicles that don't have GPS- probs, not the classic cars, as they would be far too prominent on any CCTV footage.
 
Dogmum05 said:
That's me too. I was followed and attempted attack years ago in Europe and my reaction was so loud and crazed I think the guy felt like the victim! We don't know until we are in the situation though. I surprised myself with how much rage I felt rather than fear. I just thought how dare you you lowlife piece of crap. He had a knife but was so shocked by my crazed reaction he dropped it.
Click to expand...
If someone I knew and didn't think of as a threat turned on me though I think it would really stun me ... I'd be in disbelief and slow to react I reckon.
 
Well that show wasn’t so helpful! A disappointment to me. Nothing really new but was interesting to see footage of the trails, it’s more open and beautiful than I imagined. Not thick/heavy remote bush land.

Interesting how others on WS thought the show was deliberately applying high pressure to a very specific statistically most likely POI, I just can’t see it myself but perhaps we see what we want to see? The specific POI theory might be right - time will tell… It’s my #3 theory as it has to be considered but I just can’t see it in this case as the most likely, for various reasons.

I’m still running with random predator theory as #1. Highly organised and switched on though - to be able to disable phones, leave no trace or clue. Scary to think someone like that may still be out there. Hopefully if so, they are being very closely watched.

#2 accidental encounter with criminal behaviour. Two options:
- SM accidentally witnessed a drug deal or someone’s drug stash, and was silenced.
- or maybe a hit & run involving a driver that already had something to hide (speeding, drunk, drugged, unlicensed, car thief? Or just panicked?). Even a carload of drunk or methed up hoons, joyriding through the forest after an all night party, egging on the driver, a dare of sorts to deliberately hit a runner? I think it’s happened before so plausible. And then a scramble to cover up, move & body. Also a possibility that as a result of collision SM ended up landing on or in the vehicle or in the back of the pickup tray - in panic car keeps going and pulls over later to deal with it. It was interesting reading the link of the mother and son in NT who moved a body to hide a hit and run. How silly of them not to check the body had all its limbs?!

Question in the case of Gerard Baden Clay was he left to care for his kids while under investigation? IIRC his kids went off to live with grandparents during that period, which went on for weeks - but I may have it wrong.
 
Toowong(s) said:
Well that show wasn’t so helpful! A disappointment to me. Nothing really new but was interesting to see footage of the trails, it’s more open and beautiful than I imagined. Not thick/heavy remote bush land.

Interesting how others on WS thought the show was deliberately applying high pressure to a very specific statistically most likely POI, I just can’t see it myself but perhaps we see what we want to see? The specific POI theory might be right - time will tell… It’s my #3 theory as it has to be considered but I just can’t see it in this case as the most likely, for various reasons.

I’m still running with random predator theory as #1. Highly organised and switched on though - to be able to disable phones, leave no trace or clue. Scary to think someone like that may still be out there. Hopefully if so, they are being very closely watched.

#2 accidental encounter with criminal behaviour. Two options:
- SM accidentally witnessed a drug deal or someone’s drug stash, and was silenced.
- or maybe a hit & run involving a driver that already had something to hide (speeding, drunk, drugged, unlicensed, car thief? Or just panicked?). Even a carload of drunk or methed up hoons, joyriding through the forest after an all night party, egging on the driver, a dare of sorts to deliberately hit a runner? I think it’s happened before so plausible. And then a scramble to cover up, move & body. Also a possibility that as a result of collision SM ended up landing on or in the vehicle or in the back of the pickup tray - in panic car keeps going and pulls over later to deal with it. It was interesting reading the link of the mother and son in NT who moved a body to hide a hit and run. How silly of them not to check the body had all its limbs?!

Question in the case of Gerard Baden Clay was he left to care for his kids while under investigation? IIRC his kids went off to live with grandparents during that period, which went on for weeks - but I may have it wrong.
Click to expand...
From memory, GBC did leave his kids with his parents a lot, but there was also worry that his parents were involved, and so there was a kerfuffle about them staying with them.
 
Dogmum05 said:
If someone I knew and didn't think of as a threat turned on me though I think it would really stun me ... I'd be in disbelief and slow to react I reckon.
Click to expand...
We really don't have the power over our reactions.
It is instinct kicking in.
It happened to me twice,
and really my body reacted the way it did - screaming and attacking/running at high speed.
It happened in a split of a second - so reasoning how to react was out of a question.

I was amazed later at my reaction.

JMO
 
Liadan said:
A damaged vehicle - I am not sure that police are referring to it being damaged because it hit SM but maybe it is implicated in moving her away from the site where she was taken. I mean, we ostensibly know she went to Mt Clear, but we don't know if her 'abduction' took place along the path or at the return point (or as she travelled back from the return point?).
As Nifty (I think) pointed out, ironically, it's a smash repair business; I read "lots of damaged cars" at the disposal of people. So what if the business did car pickups, and maybe one that was due to be picked for a fix-up was used? So, on Saturday, someone uses a car to drive to the damaged car (parks nearby); the damaged car is then used on Saturday to transport SM elsewhere, the damaged car is put back to the original location, and the person drives away in a car. Finally, the damaged car is picked up again Monday morning for fixing at the auto garage.
Most vehicles these days have GPS so I am sure police would be checking all the family car movements. I wonder if there is access to old vehicles that don't have GPS- probs, not the classic cars, as they would be far too prominent on any CCTV footage.
Click to expand...
Liadan said:
A damaged vehicle - I am not sure that police are referring to it being damaged because it hit SM but maybe it is implicated in moving her away from the site where she was taken. I mean, we ostensibly know she went to Mt Clear, but we don't know if her 'abduction' took place along the path or at the return point (or as she travelled back from the return point?).
As Nifty (I think) pointed out, ironically, it's a smash repair business; I read "lots of damaged cars" at the disposal of people. So what if the business did car pickups, and maybe one that was due to be picked for a fix-up was used? So, on Saturday, someone uses a car to drive to the damaged car (parks nearby); the damaged car is then used on Saturday to transport SM elsewhere, the damaged car is put back to the original location, and the person drives away in a car. Finally, the damaged car is picked up again Monday morning for fixing at the auto garage.
Most vehicles these days have GPS so I am sure police would be checking all the family car movements. I wonder if there is access to old vehicles that don't have GPS- probs, not the classic cars, as they would be far too prominent on any CCTV footage.
Click to expand...
I mentioned that I wondered if there was a possibility of a vehicle "borrowed" from the smash repair business and potentially used to transport a victim. There would probably be a number of cars being held at a smash business at any one time.
 
Toowong(s) said:
Well that show wasn’t so helpful! A disappointment to me. Nothing really new but was interesting to see footage of the trails, it’s more open and beautiful than I imagined. Not thick/heavy remote bush land.

Interesting how others on WS thought the show was deliberately applying high pressure to a very specific statistically most likely POI, I just can’t see it myself but perhaps we see what we want to see? The specific POI theory might be right - time will tell… It’s my #3 theory as it has to be considered but I just can’t see it in this case as the most likely, for various reasons.

I’m still running with random predator theory as #1. Highly organised and switched on though - to be able to disable phones, leave no trace or clue. Scary to think someone like that may still be out there. Hopefully if so, they are being very closely watched.

#2 accidental encounter with criminal behaviour. Two options:
- SM accidentally witnessed a drug deal or someone’s drug stash, and was silenced.
- or maybe a hit & run involving a driver that already had something to hide (speeding, drunk, drugged, unlicensed, car thief? Or just panicked?). Even a carload of drunk or methed up hoons, joyriding through the forest after an all night party, egging on the driver, a dare of sorts to deliberately hit a runner? I think it’s happened before so plausible. And then a scramble to cover up, move & body. Also a possibility that as a result of collision SM ended up landing on or in the vehicle or in the back of the pickup tray - in panic car keeps going and pulls over later to deal with it. It was interesting reading the link of the mother and son in NT who moved a body to hide a hit and run. How silly of them not to check the body had all its limbs?!

Question in the case of Gerard Baden Clay was he left to care for his kids while under investigation? IIRC his kids went off to live with grandparents during that period, which went on for weeks - but I may have it wrong.
Click to expand...
I think his sister & parents looked after the children
 
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