Sheila and Katherine Lyon-sisters missing since 1975 - #1

[zwiebel]

Easter Sunday was March 30th in 1975. The girls disappeared on the 25th I think. I wonder if there could have been an Easter Carnival there? The 25th would have been a Tuesday so I guess school was out that week if the girls had been at the mall all day?

 

[otto]

This lists his locations over the years:

http://www.fbi.gov/baltimore/press-...napping-of-lyon-sisters-others-victims-sought

 

[SophieRose]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...f4d856-9330-11e3-84e1-27626c5ef5fb_story.html

Police knew about Welch early in the investigation, authorities said, but it’s not clear whether they ever suspected that he could be involved. Back then, he was 18 years old and was known to stay in homeless shelters and hotels. He had a serious girlfriend, police said, who also worked with the carnival. It would be decades before his convictions for sex crimes in other states.

Late last year, Montgomery detectives looking through the case files began to take a new look at Welch. “He jumped out at us in the past couple of months,” said Assistant Montgomery Police Chief Russ Hamill.

Old case file documents show that a young girl who was with the Lyon sisters that afternoon had described a man who followed the three of them that day. Police developed a sketch partly based on that description, they said. It resembles a mug shot taken of Welch a few years later — in 1977 — when he was arrested in a burglary case in Montgomery.

 

[SophieRose]

Fox News is reporting the name of the POI is Lloyd Lee Welch. He was a carnival ride operator. He is a convicted sex offender and in prison in Delaware.

He's due out in 2027 but has asked for early release and has a Board of Pardons hearing in July.

 

[SophieRose]

The possibility his girlfriend may have had some knowledge of his crimes is unstated but present, I think.

There's more about the girlfriend in the Washington Post article I posted above. Since he didn't have a car, I wonder if the girlfriend did and he borrowed it.

Picture of Welch with girlfriend in 1977

http://bethesda-chevychase.patch.co...st-in-lyon-sisters-cold-case-february-11-2014

 

[Wayners]

"Police said detectives are trying to find security guards who worked at Wheaton Plaza in 1975 and might have had some contact with Welch, particularly one who held the rank of captain."

I can't believe that police and FBI didn't bother to interview every security guard at the mall, especially security leadership. WTF! They should have ALL their names and statements. Also seems to me if you want to have a better idea of where Welch was, get his tax returns.

 

[Wayners]

Welch’s niece, Debbie Roe, 38, of Dover, Del., said she is the only member of the family who is in regular contact with him. She said she has written letters on and off to him for the past 13 years during his incarceration. She described him as “sweet” and said he is excited when she visits him in prison.
She said that Welch has denied involvement in the disappearance of the Lyon girls but told her that he was at Wheaton Plaza that day.
“The only thing he said he did was walk around the mall,” Roe said. “I think they need to look elsewhere. He doesn’t know where the girls are.”
Darlene Hawn, 57, Welch’s half sister, said news of his possible involvement was a surprise. “I don’t know what to say,” said Hawn, also of Dover. “It’s just a shock.”
Family members said that Welch had a difficult childhood. They said his father was driving drunk one night and crashed a car, killing his wife. Welch was a passenger in the vehicle, relatives said. After that, Welch was put in foster care, but they added that he briefly returned to live with his father and stepmother at their home in Hyattsville when he was 11 or 12. They also said he had brushes with the law. “He never stayed home,” Hawn said. “He was always going places and getting into trouble.”
Dolores Askins of Silver Spring said her sister, Helen Craver, dated Welch for about 10 years starting in the 1970s. During that time, Askins said, the couple worked for a variety of carnivals, setting up rides and tending the grounds. They lived on the road and had no permanent home. Askins said that they had four children together but that authorities eventually removed them because the couple were unable to provide for them.
“Nobody was happy that she took up with Lloyd,” Askins said. “Everybody was happy when she left him simply because of what she had been through.”
Askins said that Craver eventually remarried but never got her children back. She said that Craver died several years ago.

 

[Wayners]

I was 10 at the time and would think it would be too cold for a carnival. Having grown up just a few miles from the plaza and who went there regularly with my mother (she loved Woodies and Dannaman's Fabric store) I wasn't taken there for any carnival that week. I wasn't there on the 25th but bet I was at the plaza at least 1 day a week usually with my mother and sister.

Easter Sunday was March 30th in 1975. The girls disappeared on the 25th I think. I wonder if there could have been an Easter Carnival there? The 25th would have been a Tuesday so I guess school was out that week if the girls had been at the mall all day?

 

[Richard]

Easter Sunday was March 30th in 1975. The girls disappeared on the 25th I think. I wonder if there could have been an Easter Carnival there? The 25th would have been a Tuesday so I guess school was out that week if the girls had been at the mall all day?

The week of 24 - 28 March 1975 was school break for public schools in Montgomery County, MD. So there were a lot of school age kids at the mall on Tuesday, 25 March 1975.

The girls went to Wheaton Plaza to see the Easter displays, including the Easter Bunny exhibit at Mall Center near the fountain. That exhibit featured a person dressed in an Easter Bunny costume, sitting in a large chair and interviewing children - much like a Santa Claus attraction in December.

The previous day, Monday the 24th was rainy all day and so mall attendance was down, because back then, it was an open air mall, exposed to the cold and rain. Tuesday, the 25th, was a sunny and warm day and a good day for kids to congregate and shop. By all reports the mall was very busy that day and there were kids everywhere.

There were no carnivals in the area at that time. The main "carnival" time would be in September when each county had a week long County Fair.

There might be other times (mostly during the summer) when carnival rides might be brought to a shopping mall. But there were no such rides at Wheaton Plaza on the week in question.

From what I have read of recent news articles, Welch was only about 17 or 18 at the time, and not yet pursuing a career as a carny.

 

[Motherof5]

i wonder how they know that he was there at the time? 1975 was so long ago.

He told his niece that he was there that day and walking around the mall.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...f4d856-9330-11e3-84e1-27626c5ef5fb_story.html

 

[Motherof5]

I am completely new to the thread so please bear with me. Is there a link to locations and dates for other sexual offenses against children? Did he and his girlfriend work together in these sexual offenses as they travelled with the carnival?

"Welch, who also went by the name of Michael Welch or Mike Welch, worked as a ride operator for a carnival company that set up their attractions in malls around the country, Manger said. His girlfriend also worked at the carnival company.

Welch has "multiple convictions for sex offenses against young girls," Manger said."

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/02/11/justice/maryland-cold-case/

I'm not sure if we have all of that info yet but check the Lloyd Welch Person of Interest thread. Here is another link as well.

http://www.mymcpnews.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Info-Packet-Lyon.pdf

 

[Richard]

I am completely new to the thread so please bear with me. Is there a link to locations and dates for other sexual offenses against children? Did he and his girlfriend work together in these sexual offenses as they travelled with the carnival?...

Since Welch has only now been named as a person of interest in the Lyon case and his past crimes are just now being discussed, there are probably no websites with comprehensive comparisons of unsolved cases to his known offenses.

In reference to the Lyon Sisters case, it has never been proven that they were sexually molested, abducted, or killed. Those are all possibilities, but theirs has always been a missing persons case.

There are two threads in this topic titled "Possible Connections" and "Other Similar Cases", which discuss a number of other missing person cases of the era which might be connected in some way to the Lyon sisters' disappearance.

As more information comes out regarding Welch, his MO, his travels, etc perhaps some of those cases might be linked to him.

 

[Motherof5]

Richard, LE is asking about security guards. Do you have any link to articles that have interviews with the security guards or mention of them? I'm sure LE questioned all of the mall employees but I was wondering if you remember any mention of the security guards?

 

[SophieRose]

"Police said detectives are trying to find security guards who worked at Wheaton Plaza in 1975 and might have had some contact with Welch, particularly one who held the rank of captain."

I can't believe that police and FBI didn't bother to interview every security guard at the mall, especially security leadership. WTF! They should have ALL their names and statements. Also seems to me if you want to have a better idea of where Welch was, get his tax returns.

I'm sure they've got his tax returns. Problem is he was a drifter and often homeless. May not have made enough money as a carny to even file a return when working. Also read he had worked as a landscaper, may have been paid in cash.

 

[SophieRose]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...f4d856-9330-11e3-84e1-27626c5ef5fb_story.html
Dolores Askins of Silver Spring said her sister, Helen Craver, dated Welch for about 10 years starting in the 1970s. During that time, Askins said, the couple worked for a variety of carnivals, setting up rides and tending the grounds. They lived on the road and had no permanent home. Askins said that they had four children together but that authorities eventually removed them because the couple were unable to provide for them.
“Nobody was happy that she took up with Lloyd,” Askins said. “Everybody was happy when she left him simply because of what she had been through.”
Askins said that Craver eventually remarried but never got her children back. She said that Craver died several years ago.

The girlfriend remarried around 1982, probably during the time he was in prison in Maryland.

 

[gregjrichards]

He's due out in 2027 but has asked for early release and has a Board of Pardons hearing in July.

Oh no I hope he is denied he is clearly a predator based on his current convictions. Can people write in to keep him by post or email to keep him incarcerated like we do for others in the caper board?

 

[gregjrichards]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...f4d856-9330-11e3-84e1-27626c5ef5fb_story.html

Police knew about Welch early in the investigation, authorities said, but it’s not clear whether they ever suspected that he could be involved. Back then, he was 18 years old and was known to stay in homeless shelters and hotels. He had a serious girlfriend, police said, who also worked with the carnival. It would be decades before his convictions for sex crimes in other states.

Late last year, Montgomery detectives looking through the case files began to take a new look at Welch. “He jumped out at us in the past couple of months,” said Assistant Montgomery Police Chief Russ Hamill.

Old case file documents show that a young girl who was with the Lyon sisters that afternoon had described a man who followed the three of them that day. Police developed a sketch partly based on that description, they said. It resembles a mug shot taken of Welch a few years later — in 1977 — when he was arrested in a burglary case in Montgomery.

Thanks for posting this it has interesting information.

 

[nola]

Another article about this possible break in the case...
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20786916,00.html

 

[Richard]

Richard, LE is asking about security guards. Do you have any link to articles that have interviews with the security guards or mention of them? I'm sure LE questioned all of the mall employees but I was wondering if you remember any mention of the security guards?

I have been away from my home for a few weeks, and do not have access to my paper files at this time. However, I do recall one article in particular which discussed Mall Security and quoted the head of Security at the IVERSON Mall in Prince Georges County. As I recall, it was in reference to the breaking news about the Tape Recorder Man, and how the same or a similar TRM was seen at Iverson Mall and adjacent Marlow Heights Shopping Center a few days before Kate and Sheila went missing.

I looked for that article in the old posts yesterday hoping to find it or a reference to it, but no luck.

In regard to security at Wheaton Plaza, I do not have much information about it in 1975. It is possible that the mall had its own Security Head and guards, but also possible that they used a separate Security company like Pinkertons, to provide their manpower. Sometimes a place would have its own employes and augment the force on certain days with part time guards or guards from another agency.

 

[nola]

The Daily Mail article with photos I had never seen before.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2556390/Break-Lyon-sisters-disappearance-40-years-police-person-interest.html

Last sighting: The sisters had walked to this mall to buy pizza in March 1975