TRIAL OF CHAD DAYBELL CHARGED WITH MURDER OF JJ VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN AND TAMMY DAYBELL #2

[Love Never Fails]

I think you have a valid point, @Love Never Fails. LV was still his "emergency contact." If anything happened to him, she would be notified. She remained the sole beneficiary of his life insurance policy, even after they divorced. And I would bet that she retained a key to his apartment. It is possible that Alex got into the apartment, after LV gave him the key, and did away with Joe Ryan. Tylee then became the survivor of Joe Ryan, with a $2,000 per month Social Security benefit. Lori received the proceeds of the life insurance policy. [I do not know this for certain, but it sure seems possible.]

It is sad too because Lori charged Ryan with child abuse and they fought in court. Joe must have loved her every bit as much as Charles did and figured she lost her mind. Yeah, she is crazy like a fox. He likely felt she would take good care of his daughter if he died.

 

[nodamselindistress]

If you watch any of Lori's cousin Megan's interviews, you will see it is Lori's M.O. once she tires of someone to make up outlandish lies to turn everyone against them and side with her. She did it over and over and over again. Charles was not having an affair and Joe was not abusing Tylee

ETA: One can only wonder what she would have accused Chad of when she tired of him. He killed my kids perhaps?

 

[alexwood]

If Chad wasn't the leader, then JP will argue that he doesn't deserve the DP. To me it's clear that he was running the show.

But, I don't believe he will get the DP. Just my opinion, though.

 

[Pyrite]

If the raccoon were real, why wouldn't Prior and Chad just ID exactly where it is (Chad would know!) and then dig it up in front of LE?

MOO

It was just a hypothetical when someone asked about how the raccoon not being found would be explained.

I doubt Chad was offering any explanations to LE once the kids were found. If he was even asked. Once the kids were found buried in his backyard, no one cared about the raccoon, nor should they IMO.

 

[alexwood]

If Chad wasn't the leader, then JP will argue that he doesn't deserve the DP. To me it's clear that he was running the show.

But, I don't believe he will get the DP. Just my opinion, though.

 

[sassyblue]

I imagine some (if not all) of his children are in the courtroom so he has to show at least a small amount of grief.

I doubt they are attending the trial but probably watching it online.

But for sure he needs to pretend he is heartbroken for them and the jury.

Who knew that soulless, ugly man was also a pretend bad actor...oh wait...also a writer, prophet, and a portal dweller not to mention all of his illustrious reincarnations.

Busy guy...oh yeah...his middle name. His parents must have been psychic too.

 

[scapa]

It was just a hypothetical when someone asked about how the raccoon not being found would be explained.

I doubt Chad was offering any explanations to LE once the kids were found. If he was even asked. Once the kids were found buried in his backyard, no one cared about the raccoon, nor should they IMO.

Yep. At that point things were already "in the Lord's hands," as Chad said to his daughter, and the good ol' raccoon MacGuffin just became part of the afterstory.

It's the combo of utter shamelessness that bothers me the most -- these were people who had spent a lifetime learning (supposedly) about right, wrong and the rest of it. CD / LD were believing members of the LDS church in good standing. They had to know, beyond the nonsensical backdrop of light/ dark, portals and visions, that what had been done and would be done was heinous, unforgiveable, and grieve the world sorely.

But these bodies, these murders, these people don't mean a thing to them. I'm not sure they ever will.

 

[wnk]

Going through my list of State witnesses in the LVD trial, these are the ones we haven't seen yet:

1. Kay Woodcock
2. Brandon Boudreaux
3. Ray Hermosillo
4. Jared Willmore (Madison Co. - LVD & CD prison phone call)
5. Joe Powell
6. Melanie Gibb
7. Nathan Duncan
8. Zeluma Pastenes (friend of LVD)
9. Colby Ryan
10. Mark Saari
11. Chuck Kunsaitis
12. Mike Douglass
13. Scott Cowden (Chandler FD paramedic re: CV's death)
14. Airel Werther (Chandler PD homicide re: CV's death)
15. Sandra Ynclan (Chandler PD homicide re: CV's death)
16. April Raymond (friend of LVD)
17. Nathan Moffatt (Chandler PD re: CV's death)
18. Sydney Woodbury Schenk
19. Josh Wilson
20. Wynn Hill
21. David Warwick
22. Bruce Mattingly (Fremont Co - electronic evidence from Daybell home)
23. Benjamin Dean (FBI - TD phone data, including raccoon text)
24. Dave Stubbs (Rexburg PD - electronic records, wedding photos)
25. Nicole Heideman
26. Nick Ballance (FBI - cell phone locations)
27. Summer Shiflet (LVD's sister)
28. Rick Schmitt (Rexburg PD - storage unit footage)
29. Steve Daniels (FBI forensics - excavation of JJ & TR's remains)
30. Dr Garth Warren (forensic pathologist - JJ & TR's autopsies)
31. Dr Angi Christensen (FBI forensics - examination of TR's remains)
32. Douglas Halepaska (FBI forensics - tool marks on TR's bones)
33. David Sincerbeaux (ID State PD forensics - fire debris analysis)
34. Rylene Nowlin (ID State PD forensics - DNA to TR's remains)
35. Katherine Dace (forensic biologist - DNA on shovel & ax)
36. Tara Martinez (forensics - AC's prints on plastic bag)
37. Samantha Gwilliam (TD's sister)
38. Colter Cannon
39. Helena Kaaiakamanu (Fremont Co Sheriff - TD's paintball 911 call)
40. Christina West (Fremont Co Sheriff - 911 call for TD's death)
41. Alyssa Greenhalgh
42. Cammy Wilmore (Fremont Co EMT - TD's death)
43. Brenda Dye (Fremont Co coroner - TD's death)
44. Spencer Cook (School district tech director - CV's address blocked in TD's email acct)
45. Kelsey Harris (TD's friend & workout buddy)
46. Shanna Miller (TD's friend & workout buddy)
47. Keeley Coleman (DNA analyst - LVD's hair on duct tape)
48. Ricky Wright (FBI - AC's GPS location)
49. Dr. Erik Christensen (forensic pathologist - TD's cause of death)
50. Bruce Mattingly (Fremont Co Sherriff - TD's medical records, FitBit, life insurance)
51. Alice Gilbert (TD's neighbor and friend - Daybells' relationship, widowhood/courtship, asking for $)
52. Todd Gilbert (TD's neighbor and friend - TD's funeral, LVD & CD courtship)
53. Audrey Barattiero (LVD's friend - beliefs, negative spirits, threats)
54. Vince Kaaiakamanu
55. Ian Pawlowski (husband of LVD's niece - beliefs, "spiritual attacks")
56. Taylor Ballard (insurance agent - Daybells' health insur policy plans)
57. Angela Yancey (school district admin - changes to TD's insurance policy)
58. Collin Nesbit (Kauai PD - serving documents in HI)
59. Ryan Pillar
60. Doug Hart
61. Nicholas Edwards (investigator for Idaho AG)

---

Not sure if Kay (#1) is testifying here.
#4's testimony has already basically been covered by other witnesses.
#13-17 were specific to Charles' death, which is CD is NOT being prosecuted for.

Of the remaining witnesses from LVD's trial, there were a number whose testimony went across two partial days -- Zulema, Dave Stubbs, Nick Ballance, Steve Daniels, Angi Christensen, Samantha Gwilliam, Erik Christensen, Ian Pawlowski -- but none that lasted longer than that, which makes me wonder if we're in for someone new tomorrow? Or maybe the State just recognizes that cross-examination is taking a lot longer than in LVD's trial?

 

[aafromaa]

Not quite true. Here is the timeline:

September 2019 – Lori Vallow moves with JJ, Tylee and Alex Cox to Rexburg, Idaho, where Chad Daybell lives.

• Lori enrolls JJ at Kennedy Elementary School in Rexburg on Sept. 3. Less than three weeks later, JJ attends class for the last time and his mother tells the school she will now be homeschooling her child. Tylee was never enrolled in any school in Idaho even though Lori claims her daughter is attending BYU-Idaho.

8 September 2019 – Lori Vallow, Alex Cox, JJ and Tylee visit Yellowstone National Park. Photos of the family members there mark the last signs of life for Tylee.

9 September 2019 – Alex Cox’s cellphone places him in the yard of Chad Daybell’s property for around two hours in the morning. Chad Daybell texts his wife Tammy Daybell to say that he has shot a raccoon and buried the animal in the pet cemetery on the grounds of the property.

22 September 2019 – JJ is last seen alive. He attends Kennedy Elementary School in Rexburg, Idaho, in the day and is also seen at Lori Vallow’s apartment that night by her friends Melanie Gibb and David Warwick who were staying with her that weekend. The friends say they saw Alex Cox carrying JJ into the apartment.

Cocomod, my post was in response to someone posting that MP should have known what happened to the kids because she lived right next door. The “she” was MP not LVD - MP did not move to Idaho until Halloween - sorry for any confusion on that one.

 

[alexwood]

That's a great point about Tammy's life insurance being increased, @cocomod. Borrowing from the timeline article you posted, I have extracted a couple of things that are noteworthy (IMO).

Vallow-Daybell - Latest Timeline, 23 March 2024

Social media posts indicate that sometime in 2014, the Vallows moved to Kauai in Hawaii. The couple operates a small business on the island. The family then moves back to the mainland between 2016 and 2017.
[Now, I think this small business was a juice bar, if I recall correctly. I can just picture LV, clad in her bikini, squeezing the fruits. The hostess with the mostest.]

Joseph Ryan dies on April 3, 2018. According to the medical examiner’s report, the cause of death is ruled a heart attack. He is cremated and little other information is available about his death.
[Q: Who ordered the cremation of Joseph Ryan? Was it Lori, or was it Joseph Ryan's sister, Annie Cushing?]

 

[alexwood]

Wasn’t the op talking about Melanie B now P

Yes. It was Melani Boudreaux Pawlowski who was the subject. She moved to Rexburg after LV and Alex. Although, I believe that LV arranged for all three rentals for them, simultaneously, at the same complex.

 

[Spartygirl]

I think you have a valid point, @Love Never Fails. LV was still his "emergency contact." If anything happened to him, she would be notified. She remained the sole beneficiary of his life insurance policy, even after they divorced. And I would bet that she retained a key to his apartment. It is possible that Alex got into the apartment, after LV gave him the key, and did away with Joe Ryan. Tylee then became the survivor of Joe Ryan, with a $2,000 per month Social Security benefit. Lori received the proceeds of the life insurance policy. [I do not know this for certain, but it sure seems possible.]

I AGREE with both of you @Love Never Fails

IMO, LVD and/or AxC caused his death.

She reaped the benefits from his death.

 

[alexwood]

The whole raccoon text is so obviously made up to cover CD's involvement in Tylee's burial. It stood out like a sore thumb to the reviewer/analyzer because CD and TD did not exchange texts like that normally. Why text that as soon as Alex left? Why not wait until she got home and explain what happened just in case she wandered out there and saw the disturbed earth? CD outsmarted himself on that one (and I am so glad he did!).

Oh, yeah. You have to get up p-r-e-t-t-y e-a-r-l-y to outsmart ole' CD.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Lauren at HTC, confirmed with many in the courtroom that some jurors were crying during BB testimony. But CD did not cry until JP placed his hand on his shoulder and Chad made a crying face then stopped. Then at the sidebar Chad was looking at pictures of Tammy deceased on his computer and did NOT cry.

 

[Love Never Fails]

That's a great point about Tammy's life insurance being increased, @cocomod. Borrowing from the timeline article you posted, I have extracted a couple of things that are noteworthy (IMO).

Vallow-Daybell - Latest Timeline, 23 March 2024

Social media posts indicate that sometime in 2014, the Vallows moved to Kauai in Hawaii. The couple operates a small business on the island. The family then moves back to the mainland between 2016 and 2017.
[Now, I think this small business was a juice bar, if I recall correctly. I can just picture LV, clad in her bikini, squeezing the fruits. The hostess with the mostest.]

Joseph Ryan dies on April 3, 2018. According to the medical examiner’s report, the cause of death is ruled a heart attack. He is cremated and little other information is available about his death.
[Q: Who ordered the cremation of Joseph Ryan? Was it Lori, or was it Joseph Ryan's sister, Annie Cushing?]

Lori received the call that he was dead because she was the emergency next of kin for Ryan so I do believe SHE ordered a cremation. I think his sister Annie said the same thing.

 

[aafromaa]

Going through my list of State witnesses in the LVD trial, these are the ones we haven't seen yet:

1. Kay Woodcock
2. Brandon Boudreaux
3. Ray Hermosillo
4. Jared Willmore (Madison Co. - LVD & CD prison phone call)
5. Joe Powell
6. Melanie Gibb
7. Nathan Duncan
8. Zeluma Pastenes (friend of LVD)
9. Colby Ryan
10. Mark Saari
11. Chuck Kunsaitis
12. Mike Douglass
13. Scott Cowden (Chandler FD paramedic re: CV's death)
14. Airel Werther (Chandler PD homicide re: CV's death)
15. Sandra Ynclan (Chandler PD homicide re: CV's death)
16. April Raymond (friend of LVD)
17. Nathan Moffatt (Chandler PD re: CV's death)
18. Sydney Woodbury Schenk
19. Josh Wilson
20. Wynn Hill
21. David Warwick
22. Bruce Mattingly (Fremont Co - electronic evidence from Daybell home)
23. Benjamin Dean (FBI - TD phone data, including raccoon text)
24. Dave Stubbs (Rexburg PD - electronic records, wedding photos)
25. Nicole Heideman
26. Nick Ballance (FBI - cell phone locations)
27. Summer Shiflet (LVD's sister)
28. Rick Schmitt (Rexburg PD - storage unit footage)
29. Steve Daniels (FBI forensics - excavation of JJ & TR's remains)
30. Dr Garth Warren (forensic pathologist - JJ & TR's autopsies)
31. Dr Angi Christensen (FBI forensics - examination of TR's remains)
32. Douglas Halepaska (FBI forensics - tool marks on TR's bones)
33. David Sincerbeaux (ID State PD forensics - fire debris analysis)
34. Rylene Nowlin (ID State PD forensics - DNA to TR's remains)
35. Katherine Dace (forensic biologist - DNA on shovel & ax)
36. Tara Martinez (forensics - AC's prints on plastic bag)
37. Samantha Gwilliam (TD's sister)
38. Colter Cannon
39. Helena Kaaiakamanu (Fremont Co Sheriff - TD's paintball 911 call)
40. Christina West (Fremont Co Sheriff - 911 call for TD's death)
41. Alyssa Greenhalgh
42. Cammy Wilmore (Fremont Co EMT - TD's death)
43. Brenda Dye (Fremont Co coroner - TD's death)
44. Spencer Cook (School district tech director - CV's address blocked in TD's email acct)
45. Kelsey Harris (TD's friend & workout buddy)
46. Shanna Miller (TD's friend & workout buddy)
47. Keeley Coleman (DNA analyst - LVD's hair on duct tape)
48. Ricky Wright (FBI - AC's GPS location)
49. Dr. Erik Christensen (forensic pathologist - TD's cause of death)
50. Bruce Mattingly (Fremont Co Sherriff - TD's medical records, FitBit, life insurance)
51. Alice Gilbert (TD's neighbor and friend - Daybells' relationship, widowhood/courtship, asking for $)
52. Todd Gilbert (TD's neighbor and friend - TD's funeral, LVD & CD courtship)
53. Audrey Barattiero (LVD's friend - beliefs, negative spirits, threats)
54. Vince Kaaiakamanu
55. Ian Pawlowski (husband of LVD's niece - beliefs, "spiritual attacks")
56. Taylor Ballard (insurance agent - Daybells' health insur policy plans)
57. Angela Yancey (school district admin - changes to TD's insurance policy)
58. Collin Nesbit (Kauai PD - serving documents in HI)
59. Ryan Pillar
60. Doug Hart
61. Nicholas Edwards (investigator for Idaho AG)

---

Not sure if Kay (#1) is testifying here.
#4's testimony has already basically been covered by other witnesses.
#13-17 were specific to Charles' death, which is CD is NOT being prosecuted for.

Of the remaining witnesses from LVD's trial, there were a number whose testimony went across two partial days -- Zulema, Dave Stubbs, Nick Ballance, Steve Daniels, Angi Christensen, Samantha Gwilliam, Erik Christensen, Ian Pawlowski -- but none that lasted longer than that, which makes me wonder if we're in for someone new tomorrow? Or maybe the State just recognizes that cross-examination is taking a lot longer than in LVD's trial?

Thanks, wnk! That’s a very helpful list. Going by the projection of 2 days on the stand and using your list, my best guess would be ZP.

But…I’ve got another name to throw in there as a possibility…hint…she did not testify at LVD’s trial…yes I’m talking about MP. Will she testify in this trial? Rumors suggested she didn’t at LVD’s to avoid possible charges herself but I felt then and still do that it was because she had violated the court order and the state knew they had LVD without her and decided not to risk it because the court was already aware that she had listened to BB’s testimony. MP was with LVD in Hawaii when TD was killed and in MO with LVD when TD was shot at IIRC and she was around CD enough to start calling him dad. Will she testify in this trial????

I think the next witness…that could take 2 days….will be either ZP or MP…I really can’t see anyone else on the stand for 2 days at this point.

 

[TigerLou]

Chad invented 90% of their ideology. He invented the dark and light scales and controlled them.

JP is insistent that he didn’t. Sigh.

JP would ask one of the diggers, did you dig up the whole area or did you stop when you found both children. If they stopped , He would ask Then the raccoon could have been there, just not where you dug.

Exactly this. I can hear it in his voice too. Like nails on a chalkboard.

Thanks, wnk! That’s a very helpful list. Going by the projection of 2 days on the stand and using your list, my best guess would be ZP.

But…I’ve got another name to throw in there as a possibility…hint…she did not testify at LVD’s trial…yes I’m talking about MP. Will she testify in this trial? Rumors suggested she didn’t at LVD’s to avoid possible charges herself but I felt then and still do that it was because she had violated the court order and the state knew they had LVD without her and decided not to risk it because the court was already aware that she had listened to BB’s testimony. MP was with LVD in Hawaii when TD was killed and in MO with LVD when TD was shot at IIRC and she was around CD enough to start calling him dad. Will she testify in this trial????

I think the next witness…that could take 2 days….will be either ZP or MP…I really can’t see anyone else on the stand for 2 days at this point.

I thought MP at first too—I forgot the state excluded her last time for watching the testimony. Hopefully she behaved herself this time if it’s her!

 

[Ruminations]

The whole raccoon text is so obviously made up to cover CD's involvement in Tylee's burial. It stood out like a sore thumb to the reviewer/analyzer because CD and TD did not exchange texts like that normally. Why text that as soon as Alex left? Why not wait until she got home and explain what happened just in case she wandered out there and saw the disturbed earth? CD outsmarted himself on that one (and I am so glad he did!).

I found the 'splaining style of writing very similar to the letter from "Karen Walker" to Chad. And even more similar to the letter [not really] from Charles to Chad.

What a moron.

MOO

 

[aafromaa]

I do not think that Prior will get away with claiming Alex buried Tylee and JJ on Chad's property to frame him. Just had to put that out there! (IMO!)

I really expected JP to suggest that CD did help with the burial of both Tylee & JJ but that he was only helping cover up after they were dead and had no knowledge they were going to be killed. Still not believable to me but perhaps more likely to create reasonable doubt for a jury than that he knew nothing of it because LVD & AC were framing him. The racoon text and the video in the police car talking to ED pretty much make it impossible to believe he didn’t know the bodies were there until LE found them. Accessory after the fact is still criminal but not conspiracy to commit murder. I do think CD has created room for reasonable doubt on some things but I just don’t think the jury is going to be able to get past the bodies on his property without JP admitting CD at least had some responsibility for them being there. I think JP is blowing all his hard work trying to create reasonable doubt on other things when he can’t get past the fact that the bodies were on CD’s property. I think he’s using an all or nothing approach - either CD is totally innocent or guilty of all - and no way will jury buy totally innocent. JMO

 

[Ruminations]

Can I get possibly too speculative for a minute?

Didn't the Madison LE person testify that Tammy was found "colder than the air temperature," more than once?

And wasn't October of 2019 particularly brutally cold?

Was Tammy stored "frozen" outside, and moved in to call 911?

Lividity suggests she was lying on her back. The simplest explanation is she was killed in her bedroom.

But... how could she be colder than the air? That is just not physically possible unless the room temperature had been dramatically lower before LE arrived.

I guess it is possible that something happened such as the thermostat was located near the door where people started coming and going, causing the sensor to be chilled and the corners of the house heated.

But- it seems to me that if Tammy was detectably colder than the air to the touch, she would have to have been chilled to the core to a significantly lower temperature. If I take something out of my 55 degree basement to a room upstairs, it doesn't feel cold to the touch for more than a moment.

From the fridge (maybe high 30s to 40 degrees) it still doesn't take that long to warm up. But Fridge temp is too cold for a home owned by the stingiest home owners.

I wonder if the coroner took Tammy's temperature?

MOO