PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #3

[Eli9]

I am really sad for a number of things. Very innocent people were murdered or injured, and I'm not putting him ahead of them.

But the shooter seemed very much like a person on a good track, even if he was in pain enough to google a mental illness diagnosis. He did well in HS, well in his first two years of college, was continuing in his education while holding down a job that by all appearances he did well. Senior citizens have vulnerable immune systems, and his attention to detail in the kitchen was an asset, I bet.

If only a different family member took the gun that day, if only he had a migraine, if only he had a flat tire....his pain would have faded over the years as HS becomes less and less important and work places are generally far less harsh socially.

I can't imagine being his mother or father right now. I agree with many analyses that argue the "threat" should have been "neutralized" much sooner. Could you imagine the complexity of emotion when the threat turns out to be your own son, and you have to bury him, neutralized.

MOO

Your post was really well written and I agree with all of it. Hugs

 

[Elley Mae]

Oh, they can comment and they have.

.

Not under oath they comment.

 

[Simply Southern]

Snipers work in teams. They normally have a spotter. This shooter was alone on the roof.

It should be a dead giveaway when TC is looking at the snipers across the way with his rangefinder. imo

Secret Service was warned about, ID’d Thomas Crooks as a ‘threat’ 10 minutes before Trump took stage — but let ex-president go on anyway

The Secret Service designated Thomas Matthew Crooks as a ‘threat” before former President Donald Trump took the stage, but allowed him to go on anyway, law enforcement sources told the …

nypost.com

The lanky, awkward Crooks apparently stuck out in the crowd like a sore thumb from the moment he arrived.

He set off the metal detector at the rally entrance because he was carrying a rangefinder — a type of eyepiece scope often used by hunters or golfers to determine far-off distances on the fly.

Despite the unusual item, Crooks breezed right through the entry gates.

It wasn’t even confiscated, and a rooftop counter-sniper team would later report Crooks was scoping them out with his rangefinder while they watched him with theirs.

They all should have radio communication. Somebody is connected to that little thingy in their ear they use to communicate. The sniper or the second hand person could have contacted the secret service Command center to verify.

I just can't believe these people did not communicate with each other.

It's giving me more and more a feeling of .... Well it ain't my problem.

Moo

 

[fred&edna]

 

[Sundog]

I am really sad for a number of things. Very innocent people were murdered or injured, and I'm not putting him ahead of them.

But the shooter seemed very much like a person on a good track, even if he was in pain enough to google a mental illness diagnosis. He did well in HS, well in his first two years of college, was continuing in his education while holding down a job that by all appearances he did well. Senior citizens have vulnerable immune systems, and his attention to detail in the kitchen was an asset, I bet.

If only a different family member took the gun that day, if only he had a migraine, if only he had a flat tire....his pain would have faded over the years as HS becomes less and less important and work places are generally far less harsh socially.

I can't imagine being his mother or father right now. I agree with many analyses that argue the "threat" should have been "neutralized" much sooner. Could you imagine the complexity of emotion when the threat turns out to be your own son, and you have to bury him, neutralized.

MOO

If he hadn't done his murderous, evil deed that day, it would have been another time, perhaps even worse.

ETA: I prefer to focus on the victims, not on the assassin/perpetrator.

 

[PrairieWind]

I am really sad for a number of things. Very innocent people were murdered or injured, and I'm not putting him ahead of them.

But the shooter seemed very much like a person on a good track, even if he was in pain enough to google a mental illness diagnosis. He did well in HS, well in his first two years of college, was continuing in his education while holding down a job that by all appearances he did well. Senior citizens have vulnerable immune systems, and his attention to detail in the kitchen was an asset, I bet.

If only a different family member took the gun that day, if only he had a migraine, if only he had a flat tire....his pain would have faded over the years as HS becomes less and less important and work places are generally far less harsh socially.

I can't imagine being his mother or father right now. I agree with many analyses that argue the "threat" should have been "neutralized" much sooner. Could you imagine the complexity of emotion when the threat turns out to be your own son, and you have to bury him, neutralized.

MOO

I agree with this totally. I often think about the families (parents or children) of killers, and the pain they endure. they are sort of "silent victims." Sure, this young man did something horrific, but he was still their son and they loved him enormously. And now they have to plan a funeral under scrutiny and shame while dealing with their own grief.

 

[Sundog]

Good news that so far the Trump campaign has organized the raising of $5 million for the families of the three rally-goers who were victims of the assassination attempt on President Trump.

The funeral for Corey C. is today, and he will have a private burial service tomorrow.

 

[Elley Mae]

Both of his parents have some health issues, and while the young man lived with them, so far it does not appear to investigators that they were keeping close tabs on his activities or interests in the days and months leading up to the shooting, these people said. The couple has struck investigators as loving parents but perhaps not particularly attuned to the specifics of their son’s life, the people said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2024/07/16/thomas-crooks-phone-motive-parents-trump-shooting/

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

I thought he was looking through the range finder when he was on the ground earlier not on the roof? and yes I know he was a shooter not a sniper but there was a photo posted early with an officer in black and two I supposed snipers wearing all camo. Which is what I thought possibly someone was saying that they may have initial thought he was on the security team

I don’t think it matters if he was on the ground or the roof when they scoped each other out. When the sniper spotted him on the roof 20 minutes before the first shots were fired <modsnip - no link to statement>

Not everyone has looked through a scope or a rangefinder but you can see amazingly well. And the area we are discussing is not that far. I would imagine the USSS has the best of the best optics.
imo

 

[formerlyme]

They all should have radio communication. Somebody is connected to that little thingy in their ear they use to communicate. The sniper or the second hand person could have contacted the secret service Command center to verify.

I just can't believe these people did not communicate with each other.

It's giving me more and more a feeling of .... Well it ain't my problem.

Moo

I am still hopeful it is not something as aggravating as not communicating all teams should have had access to communications working together.

 

[Fabled Automatic]

If he hadn't done his murderous, evil deed that day, it would have been another time, perhaps even worse.

ETA: I prefer to focus on the victims, not on the assassin/perpetrator.

I understand your position, but there can often be meaningful information gleaned from trying to understand the motivations of troubled individuals who commit terrible acts.

If we never bother to question them or understand them, what they were going through, we stand to never gain any knowledge that might help us prevent further incidents in the future.

Look at how much knowledge we've gained from understanding serial killers. It's helped create an entire body of science and social science that helps us develop profiles and aids LE in many ways.

 

[Elley Mae]

By 3 p.m. on Saturday, roughly three hours before the shooting, Crooks was at the security screening area for the rally. He first aroused suspicion when he passed through the magnetometers carrying a rangefinder, which looks similar to a small pair of binoculars and is used by hunters and target shooters to measure distances when setting up a long-range shot, according to a senior law enforcement official briefed on the investigation.

The rangefinder would not have prevented Crooks from getting through the security screening point, but it did attract the attention of security personnel who kept an eye on him until he left the secure area.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/16/politics/trump-shooter-requested-saturday-off-from-work/index.html

…

Did he use the rangefinder while in the secured area?

 

[formerlyme]

My number one thought , a larger security presence would have made the difference, yes he was spotted but when he left no one followed? because they had an assigned area in the hot zone so to say that could not be left? I would have expected snipers on multiple roofs/heights, found out that was not to be. More security was needed a larger presence. And that is how I feel the difference would have been made. JMO
I think that candidates should have a ss team, and that team should advise them of security needs , local communities should provide officers as needed and candidates should be responsible for hiring added protection if needed. However it gets muddled because MR. Trump is not just a candidate , he is a former president So I am still on the fence at who should be financially responsible for the extra protection.
regardless, more security would have made this turn out differently. This is just my opinion.

 

[Sundog]

I am still hopeful it is not something as aggravating as not communicating all teams should have had access to communications working together.

When we do our active shooter/crisis plan training annually at our university, we bring in LE experts from the state, and it is drilled in to us over and over again that there is ONE person in command at the command center and he/she coordinates everything. The command center is identified in advance and communication channels are specific and written down and all parties are informed (local, regional, state and federal law enforcement). The first year we did this training was for an active shooter possibility, over the years we have done a few other scenarios. We are constantly updating the call chart, who calls who, etc. and in what order and how communication takes place and is confirmed. And when the SS comes to our campus with a political candidate for the highest office in the country (president or vice president, or both) then we defer to the SS, not to the campaign manager or anyone else. SS is in charge of the command center.

If some of our local LE are working on parking but are needed at the event or elsewhere, they are notified and drop what they are doing and move to the appropriate site and take appropriate action. Even our campus police, who are certified/licensed police offers with specialized training in active shooter/crisis situations.

It doesn't guarantee success, but everything is meticulously laid out and reviewed enough times that everyone knows the plan. I expect nothing less from the kind of event that the SS was responsible for in Butler, Pennsylvania.

 

[Sundog]

I understand your position, but there can often be meaningful information gleaned from trying to understand the motivations of troubled individuals who commit terrible acts.

If we never bother to question them or understand them, what they were going through, we stand to never gain any knowledge that might help us prevent further incidents in the future.

Look at how much knowledge we've gained from understanding serial killers. It's helped create an entire body of science and social science that helps us develop profiles and aids LE in many ways.

I appreciate your reply to my post. LE should of course learn from this situation and the context of all information, including what led up to the shooting with the goal of preventing future assassinations and shootings.

However, speculating about who or what the shooter might have been in life if this hadn't happen is not my focus, I am focusing on who he was, not on who he could have been or might have been.

 

[Fabled Automatic]

I appreciate your reply to my post. LE should of course learn from this situation and the context of all information, including what led up to the shooting with the goal of preventing future assassinations and shootings.

However, speculating about who or what the shooter might have been in life if this hadn't happen is not my focus, I am focusing on who he was, not on who he could have been or might have been.

Ah, I see what you're saying. Yes, I agree. Not much point in wondering what could have been. The unfortunate fact is, he did what he did.

 

[fred&edna]

I am still hopeful it is not something as aggravating as not communicating all teams should have had access to communications working together.

There could be another explanation but I'm not sure what else it could be.

ETA: More LE officers could have helped but wouldn't that be the SS Coordinator's job of getting additional qualified manpower?

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

Interesting look at the timeline and locations:

 

[Sundog]

There could be another explanation but I'm not sure what else it could be.

jmo

Agree. There have been over 50 (maybe lots more, I don't know the exact number) campaign rallies for the Trump team and all have gone on without a problem, so what happened at this one. Other rallies have been held at both inside venues and outside locations, including many airport hangars - often in rural communities.

So far it is sounding like security for this rally was poorly executed, to say the least.

 

[justtrish]

There could be another explanation but I'm not sure what else it could be.

jmo

Being close to the military community (spouse and son are Army) I think complacency comes to mind. They train and train and train and one of the biggest risks I see is getting complacent. No accidents in xyz time so things feel "easy" or maybe mindless.. just going through the motions and it leads to people messing up even the simple things.