PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #5

[Sundog]

They're human, just like the people they are sworn to protect. There is no big conspiracy here, just human beings being fallible, just like you and I.

We're looking at incompetency by the SS, at what level we don't know - was it the person who approved the operational plan? Was it the lack of communication of the SS with local law enforcement? Was it the failure to hold President Trump in the holding area for a longer period of time before he went out onto the stage? Was it the failure to let the SS agents who were on President Trump's detail know that there was a problem? Was it a failure to use drones and test the connectivity in advance? Failure to determine an appropriate perimeter?

Probably all of the above.

Maybe no conspiracy but definitely incompetence, way beyond infallible man philosophy.

 

[zleuther]

Actions consistent with "thought there was a local sniper at a highpoint N or NW of TC"...

122110: Butler Township Patrolman 1, TC aimed at him
...is my lingo, the narrator of the most famous bodycam so far.

Here's what I would do, if I thought there was a local sniper at a highpoint N or NW of TC.

1. note location of TC = N side of roof
2. abandon sitting duck location
3. go to closest cover that might have options = behind own car
4. think a pistol might suffice, if the local sniper flushes TC right away
5. to let the local sniper flush from N side of roof = I should flush from S side of roof*
6. go to closest cover S of roof = trees

* TC dodging sniper bullets sure can't go N or E or W

Unless I'm mistaken, it seems like what we all saw Butler Township Patrolman 1 do was consistent with "thought there was a local sniper at a highpoint N or NW of TC".

Words consistent with "thought there was a local sniper at a highpoint N or NW of TC" follow...

18:25:24 Butler Township Patrolman 1 on roof asks, "Did he get himself, Mike, or did they get him from over here?"

Secret Service agent shakes his head no and points toward USSS sniper location atop barn.

Butler Township Patrolman 1, it can be reasonably concluded, thought the two most likely causes of TC's death were suicide or local counter sniper's bullet = "thought there was a local sniper at a highpoint N or NW of TC".

 

[Elley Mae]

Wasn’t it a ss sniper that said after Cheatle resignation 1 down 4 to go.

Seems that person would have better knowledge of what needs to be done.

Maybe that person should be in charge instead of yes men/women.

Jmo

 

[Bodine]

History is rife with extraordinarily well trained units (special forces, CIA, police tactical units, etc, etc) allowing terrible things to happen on their watch. Israeli intelligence and special forces are some of the best in the world (out of necessity), yet they got caught off guard by a massive attack, by a terrorist group that they keep tabs on.

People will be thrown under the bus by politicians when all is said and done, lose their jobs, etc. but this isn't any different than Reagan or RFK (and many others) getting shot.

Sometimes the bad guys (almost) win.

 

[Ontario Mom]

They're human, just like the people they are sworn to protect. There is no big conspiracy here, just human beings being fallible, just like you and I.

I'm curious about the bolded. What reason do you have to believe there isn't or wasn't something else going on?
I can't say whether there is or isn't, so I'm curious how it is anyone else can be so certain?

 

[Betty P]

Apparently, there's some crazy talk going on online

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/08/politics/democratic-convention-target-extremists/index.html

 

[Simply Southern]

They had a bad day, it happens to all of us.

Every airline pilot it's afforded one bad day?
Every surgeon, every law enforcement agent, ship captain...

Nope the SS is suppose to be the best of the best. Good planning and execution ensure success. They're plan lacked basic security even to a lay person's eyes.

No one had to die that day. They need to be held accountable, as any of the above would be held accountable.
Moo...

 

[Donswife48]

They're human, just like the people they are sworn to protect. There is no big conspiracy here, just human beings being fallible, just like you and I.

They are sworn to protect, and they didn't. The fact that Trump was targeted and shot, the fact that 3 people were hit, one killed, the other two serious doesn't justify their human beings being fallible. I will not flippantly declare they just had a bad day. The ones that had a bad day was the people that were killed and injured. MOO

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

I continue to be perplexed, that in the aftermath of the shots fired….. the Secret Service agents on stage didn’t do more to cover their protectee or target. And to ‘secret’ him to the waiting vehicle. Why wasn’t a ‘full secure wall’ formed around and above their watch? With the protectee to remain crouched and covered? I also fail to understand why the brief delay, and then allowing the former president to be visible in those immediate moments thereafter. And in the moments when he was then ‘walked’ to the vehicle.

IMO there was inadequate cover then as well. Whether or not there was need to obtain a shoe, or be seen by the crowd. And also in apparent confusion whether there was an ‘all clear’ given. IMO seems there will be plenty to learn from this unfortunate incident at the rally.

Being old enough to have lived through the JFK, RFK, and MLK assassinations and the attempts on Ford, Wallace, and Reagan there would be hope to have secure unfaltering procedures for ready immediate use. Sadly in this case there were other victims too. MOO

 

[Luna20]

There wasn't. A very motivated perp got over on them.......end of story.

If they sucked so bad at their jobs, presidents and dignitaries would be getting shot at regularly.......they're not.

It only takes one to kill a candidate, regularly doesn’t apply here.

Imagine telling a parent that LE had a bad day. ‘Sorry, we regret to inform you that your child is dead. It doesn’t happen often, it was just a random bad day’.

 

[Missing Susan]

Wasn’t it a ss sniper that said after Cheatle resignation 1 down 4 to go.

Seems that person would have better knowledge of what needs to be done.

Maybe that person should be in charge instead of yes men/women.

Jmo

1. former vp, SS codename Cobra
2. recently impeached cabinet secretary
3.Cheatle
4. Rowe
5. ????

 

[Friday Fan]

Apparently, there's some crazy talk going on online

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/08/politics/democratic-convention-target-extremists/index.html

Yeah, and there's some other crazy stuff (cyber related etc)

 

[zleuther]

I'm pretty sure I'm in the correct thread LOL, if anybody wants to discuss TC's drone and/or his backpack. (Or really anything re the thread title???)

Like TC's casing of the fence line, the theory isn't so much that he needed more research for AR-15 sight lines. No, he was researching the possibility of LEO intervention.

Look at the roof and imagine where LEO might be. Suppose LEO plans to be on the roof but not until Trump takes the stage, well, 80/20 they'd set some things there first, for example.

And TC needed to plan ahead for the backpack. If LEO speaks to him, he sure can't have the backpack with him -- they'd ask to look what's inside.

Don't mind me, but LEO knew he was walking around without a backpack. Over and over and over again. That means as soon as LEO saw him with a backpack, LEO shoulda concluded that the backpack wasn't so much for carrying essentials as it was for concealment.

 

[Seattle1]

It's a good thing the SS snipers were well trained, experienced and paying attention. The SS sniper took out the killer extremely fast and with great accuracy, without risk to public safety. It was over before local LE knew what was happening.

According to Trump's account, following TC's shots, the sniper reacted to fire/smoke from TC's weapon on the rooftop and fired a single shot within 5 seconds, taking out the threat. The sniper has 23 years of service with the agency.

Live on X

 

[newclues]

IMO:
TC
- frustrated intellectual had job beneath his intellect
- show off he could outsmart all the security experts
- important VIP DJT was visiting in neighboring area
- close to home opportunistic assassin/assassination
- notoriety to leave his mark by killing/trying to kill VIP

 

[layer]

IMO:
TC
- frustrated intellectual had job beneath his intellect
- show off he could outsmart all the security experts
- important VIP DJT was visiting in neighboring area
- close to home opportunistic assassin/assassination
- notoriety to leave his mark by killing/trying to kill VIP

Seems like it.

Try this:
LHO
- frustrated intellectual had job beneath his intellect
- show off he could outsmart all the security experts
- important VIP JFK was visiting in neighboring area
- close to home opportunistic assassin/assassination
- notoriety to leave his mark by killing/trying to kill JFK

Works surprisingly well. The point being that if this kid was being used as an asset ("village idiot" in tradecraft) this is about what you'd expect to find. It's something that bothers me, because whatever led this kid to do this: foreign or domestic intelligence or terrorism, lone nut sociopathy or psychopathy; or just plain ole evil; whatever it is it's still out there. And there are a whole lot of other troubled kids. And they take notes.
JMHO

 

[zleuther]

6:08 NYT: LEO bodycam of first roof sighting...
View attachment 122084_1_08_vi_trump_shooting_bodycam_wg_480p.mp4

Seems the only LEOs to see TC on the roof were 3 who at 6:08 were all near the water tower. Also note according to the After Action assessment...

6:05 ..."he has a back pack"...per radio from a local sniper
...one's definitely still at his post, other is believed by me to be inside near his post but moving from window to window to try to match TC movements.

 

[LadyL]

Seems like it.

Try this:
LHO
- frustrated intellectual had job beneath his intellect
- show off he could outsmart all the security experts
- important VIP JFK was visiting in neighboring area
- close to home opportunistic assassin/assassination
- notoriety to leave his mark by killing/trying to kill JFK

Works surprisingly well. The point being that if this kid was being used as an asset ("village idiot" in tradecraft) this is about what you'd expect to find. It's something that bothers me, because whatever led this kid to do this: foreign or domestic intelligence or terrorism, lone nut sociopathy or psychopathy; or just plain ole evil; whatever it is it's still out there. And there are a whole lot of other troubled kids. And they take notes.
JMHO

just a small note though - he wasn't a kid
he was fully an adult and referring to him as a kid diminishes his terrible act IMO
yeah he looks young and is maybe a lot younger than some of us here but he was an adult

 

[Sundog]

President Trump announced that he will be going back to Butler for a rally in October and that plans are underway for that to happen. I wonder if the venue will be indoors or outdoors.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

just a small note though - he wasn't a kid
he was fully an adult and referring to him as a kid diminishes his terrible act IMO
yeah he looks young and is maybe a lot younger than some of us here but he was an adult

I don't think calling him a kid diminishes his crime.

I call anyone whose brain isn't fully developed a kid. It doesn't mean anything legally. It's not like saying he shouldn't be held accountable as an adult. We even charge teen killers with adult charges. But the point is, to me, he was a kid. It doesn't take away from the heinous crime he committed. MOO