17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #13

[CHICANA]

Under that same law, you cannot be the aggressor and then use this law. Your hands must be clean and not part of any criminal activity, such as 'stalking' and then turning around, confronting, start a fistfight, shoot to kill and then use that as standing your ground...

http://blog.richardhornsby.com/2012/03/trayvon-martins-death-is-not-a-stand-your-ground-case/

That's what I thought too, but you can. There's a statute on that same site that explains it.

 

[jjenny]

This law is NOT designed to allow for the part bolded. This law protects you if you are attacked and have to defend yourself. If you were walking down the street and a rapist put a knife to your throat, you could shoot him and that would be justifiable as should be. No woman should have to be raped and killed because she can't defend herself. No store owner should be shot and killed during a robbery because they couldn't defend themselves against an armed robber. But, no one should be allowed to shoot someone they started a fight with either. That's when the shooter ends up with charges pressed and it's up to a jury to decide if the shooting was justifiable. Folks are confusing the SYG defense with manslaughter, IMO.

In theory that's what they might have designed it for. But again, in this type of cases, one person ends up dead so who is there to contradict the other person claiming self-defense?

 

[jjenny]

That's what I thought toy, but you can. There's a statute on that same site that explains it.

Yep, you really still can claim self-defense but I believe you do have to make attempts to get away first.

 

[RANCH]

Here's the Florida statue 784.048 on stalking. Notice the word "repeatedly" is used.

(2) Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows, harasses, or cyberstalks another person commits the offense of stalking, a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes...ing&URL=0700-0799/0784/Sections/0784.048.html

 

[Donjeta]

It's a miracle to me that anybody ever gets charged for murder.
IMO this law is just a free ticket to kill and then lie about self defense later.

 

[songline]

I agree about him being scared after taking a life but what I've bolded above is very concerning if he thought this way. Even if there was a physical altercation~what kind of mindset he must have had; thinking a gun is the only way to solve a problem. :waitasec: That is so far from my way of thinking that I honestly can't understand it even a little. Starting to feel that Mr. Zimmerman, IF he thought this way, was living a very shallow unhappy life. Again MOO

I do not believe inguns to begine with.
But I do know that in life there are times tha unexpected things happen,
and we have no choice in the way we handle it.

 

[songline]

the officer beside him looks bruised too I think it is artifacts IMO

:what: I do not see that.

 

[Isabelle]

GZ's friend, FT, said there was no gash, it was a contusion (bruise). An EMT would not let him walk away with an open wound, no way. And it looks like it is dark, could be his hair, it is very hard to tell. But the top of his head is not consistent with lying on the ground with someone banging the back of your head. In any event, GZ's attorney claimed GZ went to the doctor's and because he had already started to heal, stitches would not be done. I'm waiting on the doctor's report myself. His lawyer could have had one the night he made that statement early last week. We have yet to see anything that would verify GZ's claim of an injury. Plus a bruise that night would not be that dark, that fast. Bruising goes through color stages from lighter to darker within days. jmo

http://www.ehow.com/info_8128124_coloring-stages-bruises.html

Would be something else if Trayvon tried to defend himself, but in doing so he didn't want to severely injure GZ! Trayvon would have been right to do what he needed to, no matter what injury befell GZ. Sickening.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I do not believe inguns to begine with.
But I do know that in life there are times tha unexpected things happen,
and we have no choice in the way we handle it.

we always have a choice - its just sometimes we make the wrong ones. But there is always a choice.



JMHO

 

[Isabelle]

Transcriptions & start times of 911 calls including GZ's that night:

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/20/911-calls-paint-picture-of-chaos-after-florida-teen-is-shot/

Does anyone know how long GZ's call to 911 lasted? That time isn't given.

From start of GZ's call to 911 call where gunshot is heard is approximately 7 minutes. I think The length of GZs call to 911 is important.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...gment/2012/03/31/gIQAc4HhnS_blog.html?hpid=z6

More on NBC altering Zimmermann's words on 9-11 call to make him appear racist.

Why is a major media organization inventing a motive? What is their motive? Do we like to be lied to ...if it supports our own "conclusions" and therefore we will not criticize media who mislead others into believing what we believe.

Do we now condone inventing and disseminating evidence to GET WHAT WE WANT?

The facts and evidence may be there to support a trial for GZ. But can GZ get a fair trial when the media is putting out falsities? Aren't there people who will believe what the MSM tells them and bring THAT into the jury room? Do you care whether you have a media you can trust?

You may let the media get away with this..even secretly LIKE it...but someday, someone YOU love may be dependent on the truth. Be careful what you condone in orderto get what you want.

Well what I want is an honest police force and states attorney office that does not treat cases based on the color of skin which there appears to be plenty of evidence in this circumstance and past ones. A police force that does this might make some people feel safe but it is best to remember the minority and majority is a changin.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Does anyone know how long GZ's call to 911 lasted? That time isn't given.

From start of GZ's call to 911 call where gunshot is heard is approximately 7 minutes. I think The length of GZs call to 911 is important.

This one says 4:10 and does not appear to have been cut.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jL72w4xiTVU&feature=youtu.be

 

[Isabelle]

Good morning all...

That scream for help did sound so young and I do believe too that it was Trayvon screaming for help, not GZ...


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/31/trayvon-martin-shooting-911-call-screams_n_1394224.html

TM's parents must have some voice recording of Trayvon..so this can be done correctly, to prove this was Trayvon who was screaming for help. Poor kid must have been so frightened...

I pray for justice for Trayvon..lease:

Probably have the recording of his voice on his voice mail, or any friend who he left a voice mail for. Has Trayvon's phone been accounted for yet? If not, could it be Trayvon had it recording during the attack??!!

 

[Isabelle]

This one says 4:10 and does not appear to have been cut.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jL72w4xiTVU&feature=youtu.be

So the time between GZ's call to 911 to gunshot is approximately 2:50. That's fast.

 

[songline]

But the fact is GZ suspected TM of a crime or he would have never gotten out of his car to follow him. He wasn't just interested in calling LE and have THEM check this kid out, he wanted to do it himself and chose to bring his gun with him. It was in his pants not on a belt which tells me he grabbed it. I know some put it there but it is not a secure place to carry a gun so it tells me he grabbed it and put it in his waistband out of view.

The gun, itself, is not the issue. The issue is he got out of his car knowing he was going to pursue someone he felt was involved in a crime when he should have stayed with the car because he knew he had a gun on him. He did not take the safety of other's into account. Never considered it.

I believe people have a right to own a gun, two, three, whatever the law allows. I think if they feel safer wearing one that is fine, too. But carrying a gun requires that you need to be responsible and not engage in irresponsible behavior which is what I feel GZ did......obvious to us now. He did not listen to LE even though he acknowledged that he understood and went ahead to "investigate" on his own. A gun owner knows what their responsibilities are while carrying a gun because they all attended classes on safety. GZ did not act in a responsible manner as a private citizen. He literally took the law into his own hands with tragic results.

Gun owners are responsible citizens. I know my husband was very responsible having had a license to carry for over 30 years. To me GZ slipped through the cracks with his background and was given a license when he should have been denied. I also think that all those potential arrests and charges that were dropped will come back to haunt both he and his family.

This has nothing to do with anyone owning or carrying a gun. And gun owners know that. Is the fear that this case will cause people to rally over gun control? I think most of us know what happened here and it's not about the gun. It's about a person who put his good judgment aside to do what he wanted to do and just happened to have a gun with him. If he didn't have the gun...it could have been a knife. It's about the man, not the gun. jmo

I think the police should have investigated to be sure that what was told to them was an accurate account of the facts.
I do not think that hanging anyone without a thorough investigating is productive or pro-active.
It gives mad man a license to kill and call it self defense.

I do not know what GZ was thinking because I do not know him at all. But you seem to know what he was thinking :waitasec:
I do not know that TM jumped him, or that GZ wanted to take the law in his own hands. NON of us know that.
I ONLY KNOW that something happened and that it must be thoroughly investigated That is what I know.
I find it unbelievable for anyone to say what happened as if they know.
I can only say we have some opinions about both of them.
I think GZ is an overzealous man I think TM was not such a good kid.
My opinions about them does not mean at all in the case
nor does it mean that I can’t see that something spiraled and snowballed out of control.

 

[Aedrys]

In theory that's what they might have designed it for. But again, in this type of cases, one person ends up dead so who is there to contradict the other person claiming self-defense?

Well then, let's release all murderers from prison. After all, the victim is dead, so there is no one to contradict the murderers when they say they are innocent. Let's drop investigations once and for all, and just let people go, trusting their word that they didn't do anything wrong because the victim is dead and can't talk. Yes, GZ is innocent because Trayvon is dead and can't talk back. Case closed.

:banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[Helplessly Hoping]

I do not believe inguns to begine with.
But I do know that in life there are times tha unexpected things happen,
and we have no choice in the way we handle it.

Not a gun person here either but respectful of those that are and their rights~though I think we need to make some changes in the current laws but that's a tome I will spare you from

As to having no choice in the way we handle the unexpected....Maybe. But it NEVER had to reach that point. Had Mr. Zimmerman simply let LE respond and handle the "suspicious" teen, the obvious call IMO; we wouldn't be here today. He made a choice to engage. MOO

 

[Isabelle]

I still GZ is a delusional psychotic. Or, maybe delusional sociopath and knew how to turn it off an on when needed.

 

[Isabelle]

If current investigation into the case determines GZ must be arrested, I think it will be done very quietly and we won't know until he is in 'protective' custody.

 

[LambChop]

Would be something else if Trayvon tried to defend himself, but in doing so he didn't want to severely injure GZ! Trayvon would have been right to do what he needed to, no matter what injury befell GZ. Sickening.

What is interesting is GZ's claim through his attorney that it was a gash requiring stitches that after GZ went to the doctors a couple of days later the wound had already started to heal so the doctor did not stitch his head. After the lockup tape was released and you can't see a gash, it suddenedly became a contusion (and not released by GZ's attorney but by his friend, FT). The attorney was taking GZ's word regarding the "gash and stitches" and was verifying it on national tv as true. Now the attorney looks bad. jmo