17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #15

[gitana1]

IMO Seeing how quickly this has become a racial issue instead of just a sloppy police investigation racial tensions must be very high in FL.IMO When TM decided to confront GZ saying Whats your problem or Why are you following me as per TM GF Perhaps TM felt he was being singled out because he was AA and that led to him punching GZ.JMO.

Here in NJ there was a white officer sitting in his patrol car,he asked an AA 19 yr old to his car and asked what's up he knew him,AA 18 or 19 yr old pulled out his gun and blasted the officer.The officer did not have a chance to even draw his gun.No one ever turned it into a racial bias killing.Not the police ,not the officers family.

Two completely different scenarios. Trayvon did not kill anyone nor did he point a gun at anyone. And now we are comparing his case to one in which a black teen murdered an officer who asked him what he was doing?

The only evidence that Trayvon was the aggressor comes from a man who wants to avoid prison. Everything else, Zimmerman's background, his taped call to police, etc., points to the greater likelihood that Zimmerman was the aggressor, not Trayvon. And that is notwithstanding the oft repeated witness statement that Trayvon was on top, since that man did not see the beginning (or end, IIRC) of the confrontation.

But, Trayvon was black. And I really believe that this supports an unconscious assumption in many that Trayvon must have been stealing, casing houses, rudely confrontational, lying in wait before attacking the strange man following him, you know, the man he was trying to get away from, violent, used the no longer popular term "homie", was a gang banger, a troublemaker, etc.

And having mixed family members, or black family members or black friends or co-workers or bosses does not change that, IMO. It only adds exceptions to the unconscious attitudes. The fact is, repeated tests have revealed that most people, even those who support civil rights, who decry racial hatred and are not racists in the strict sense of the word, have underlying perceptions about blacks that differ from their perceptions about other "races".

Finally, while many believe racial bias had much to do with why Trayvon was shot, much of the outcry is due to a belief that racial bias determined how the case was investigated and whether Zimmerman would be charged or not.

He doesn't appear to be uninjured. ABC now claims there are injuries on the back of his head visible on the video.
And I don't find this voice analysis of comparing screams to normal speech to be credible.

Do you find Trayvon's mother credible? Do you believe a grieving mother would want to believe that the last thing out of her dead baby's mouth was screams of anguish?

Or how about the two ladies who were actually there that night and heard those screams in person, outside their door, and not filtered through a 911 call? They stated it was a young person crying and begging for help. Are they credible?

Yep....GZ had the perfect opportunity to introduce himself and ask TM a question when on the 911 call and did not do it....WHY? jmo

Because he wanted to single-handedly make sure this one did not get away.

 

[vlpate]

There is no proof, other than what has been said by Zimmerman's family, that proves GZ had any intention of going back to his car.

You are correct, and by the same token, there's no proof that he did continue to follow him aside from what has been speculated on by the press and the family...and as a result, half the planet.

His own 911 call clearly shows a man following Trayvon. When he says "okay" to LE, he was still clearly in pursuit.

How is it clear from listening to the 911 tape?

You can hear it.

I can't hear him continue to follow - but I never "heard" him following in the first place, I heard rain and static.

Backed up even more by the fact that Zimmerman wanted LE to call HIM back so that he could tell LE where he was.

He didn't request that police call him back, he requested police to call him when they got there so he could tell them where is was. Maybe he was planning to drive back to the club house if he couldn't discern the address. Who knows.

If Zimmerman was going back to his truck, he would have told LE that he would be in his truck and given LE a description of that truck so they could find him if they needed him.

Good point, but I think GZ would recognize a cop car.

Zimmerman felt above LE's advice and did his own thing and now a kid is dead because he couldn't comprehend simple instructions.

MOO

Hard to know what Zimmerman felt or what his comprehension skills are based on speculation of whether he was walking one way or the other. IMO

 

[LolaMoon08]

I don't see why anyone is that concerned with his accounts being deleted? Usually when a minor ends up deceased, the parents delete the accounts? I've seen it happen a million times? Even when the child is "clearly" the innocent victim in a case. Not saying that Trayvon is not "clearly" a victim in this case... it's clear to me... not to everyone though. If my deceased child was being drug through the mud, you better believe I would make sure to delete his/her account... not to hide anything (I didn't see anything that bad on his account?) but because I wouldn't want people like that having access to my child like that.

MOO

 

[daisy7]

yes, and it was not the C word, He said F'ing Punks, you can clearly heard the "puh" sound.

I must have missed hearing the unKs sound. Can someone direct me to this? TIA!

 

[kimpage]

Wow on MSNBC Bonaparte---city manager said they are investigating the meeting..And an interview RZ SR. gave he said he never told police or anyone at the station he was a Magistrate Judge.....I call BS on this Something hinky happened in Sanford the night TM was 'Murdered" IMHO JMHO and all that

 

[iluvmua]

Two completely different scenarios. Trayvon did not kill anyone nor did he point a gun at anyone. And now we are comparing his case to one in which a black teen murdered an officer who asked him what he was doing?

The only evidence that Trayvon was the aggressor comes from a man who wants to avoid prison. Everything else, Zimmerman's background, his taped call to police, etc., points to the greater likelihood that Zimmerman was the aggressor, not Trayvon. And that is notwithstanding the oft repeated witness statement that Trayvon was on top, since that man did not see the beginning (or end, IIRC) of the confrontation.

But, Trayvon was black. And I really believe that this supports an unconscious assumption in many that Trayvon must have been stealing, casing houses, rudely confrontational, lying in wait before attacking the strange man following him, you know, the man he was trying to get away from, violent, used the no longer popular term "homie", was a gang banger, a troublemaker, etc.

And having mixed family members, or black family members or black friends or co-workers or bosses does not change that, IMO. It only adds exceptions to the unconscious attitudes. The fact is, repeated tests have revealed that most people, even those who support civil rights, who decry racial hatred and are not racists in the strict sense of the word, have underlying perceptions about blacks that differ from their perceptions about other "races".

Finally, while many believe racial bias had much to do with why Trayvon was shot, much of the outcry is due to a belief that racial bias determined how the case was investigated and whether Zimmerman would be charged or not.



Do you find Trayvon's mother credible? Do you believe a grieving mother would want to believe that the last thing out of her dead baby's mouth was screams of anguish?

Or how about the two ladies who were actually there that night and heard those screams in person, outside their door, and not filtered through a 911 call? They stated it was a young person crying and begging for help. Are they credible?



Because he wanted to single-handedly make sure this one did not get away.

So I guess Zimmerman, his father, His brother, possibly his own mother, His friends, The SFPD, The EMTs, the Prosecutors, The TWO witnesses etc. are all in one big conspiracy together????

 

[TonyGatto]

I'm wondering...

If GZ had such aspirations to be in law enforcement why wasn't he on a police force? What could have kept him from that dream?

 

[LolaMoon08]

I must have missed hearing the unKs sound. Can someone direct me to this? TIA!

It's not there, IMO. It, IMO, ends with "oons" not "unks."

:moo::moo::moo:

 

[Adrienne37]

Wow on MSNBC Bonaparte---city manager said they are investigating the meeting..And an interview RZ SR. gave he said he never told police or anyone at the station he was a Magistrate Judge.....I call BS on this Something hinky happened in Sanford the night TM was 'Murdered" IMHO JMHO and all that

I was so not impressed with Bonaparte during one of his interviews last week. He mumbled and stumbled his way through the entire interview.


~jmo~

 

[Isabelle]

I don't see why anyone is that concerned with his accounts being deleted? Usually when a minor ends up deceased, the parents delete the accounts? I've seen it happen a million times? Even when the child is "clearly" the innocent victim in a case. Not saying that Trayvon is not "clearly" a victim in this case... it's clear to me... not to everyone though. If my deceased child was being drug through the mud, you better believe I would make sure to delete his/her account... not to hide anything (I didn't see anything that bad on his account?) but because I wouldn't want people like that having access to my child like that.

MOO

Parents may have deleted the accounts to prevent ugly, hurtful comments.

 

[RANCH]

Sounds like "cuh" to me, followed by "oon" to me?

MOO

I'm not certain what is being said. Even with the enhancement that CNN did.

 

[mikeysmommom]

Do not know about the rest of you but if I had any so called pull,I would have called the DA at his house and asked him to come to mine JMO.Not go to the police station and have all those witnesses and video tapes JMO. My Uncle was a Judge in NJ,No one in my family ever got a break ever.Just saying

 

[legalmania]

He was born in 1983

Yes I went back and edited it. There is no file date.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Parents may have deleted the accounts to prevent ugly, hurtful comments.

Rightfully so.

:moo:

 

[SwampMama]

This thread is growing so quickly that it has been several pages ago when someone inquired about the likelihood or (unlikelihood) of EMTs cleaning GZ up at the scene. I work as a first responder and I can say that we have done minor cleanups on people involved in scenes.

If the person is not a suspect or covered in victims blood (which would be evidence) then we do offer cleansing wipes, gauze pads, etc to whoever may be bleeding, even if they refuse transport to the hospital. Blood is a bio hazard and if they were going to transport GZ in the cop car then they wouldn't have wanted him bleeding all over the car. So in my opinion, even if the paramedic, EMTs or other first responders didn't write out a report of care given, there still would have been someone who likely offered GZ something to wipe blood with, even if just to assess the wound under the blood.

As for George's injuries and his refusal for transport to the hospital, people are often in shock and have to be coaxed to go get checked out at the ER. We had one guy who refused care and refused to be transported to the ER. He went the next day and he turned out to have a broken pelvis. OWW!! That had to hurt but shock can cover pain and injuries till after the shock wears off.

So just to sum it up, someone other than the reporting EMTs may have offered to help George clean up some. There are often many types of first responders from different agencies (Police dept, fire dept, ambulance service,etc).

Each place is different in who responds and how, but our department will do (and has done) a cleanup the best we can at a bloody suicide, a gory accident, etc (once the police determine that they have done everything they need to do). We are very conscious of procedures for police in collecting evidence though and would clear it with a cop before offering something to a suspect.

This is just my offering, from my experiences as a first responder. Just my opinion on how it would have been handled in my area.

 

[TonyGatto]

So I guess Zimmerman, his father, His brother, possibly his own mother, His friends, The SFPD, The EMTs, the Prosecutors, The TWO witnesses etc. are all in one big conspiracy together????

Very possible.

 

[jjenny]

I'm wondering...

If GZ had such aspirations to be in law enforcement why wasn't he on a police force? What could have kept him from that dream?

Hmm. He was after all arrested for battery on a police officer.

 

[LambChop]

Wow on MSNBC Bonaparte---city manager said they are investigating the meeting..And an interview RZ SR. gave he said he never told police or anyone at the station he was a Magistrate Judge.....I call BS on this Something hinky happened in Sanford the night TM was 'Murdered" IMHO JMHO and all that

That could be true because it could have been GZ that told everyone his dad was a judge. jmo

 

[iluvmua]

I must have missed hearing the unKs sound. Can someone direct me to this? TIA!

This might help:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGuctYqCDvo"]DIAGNOSTIC: George Zimmerman Clearly says " Coons" Before Killing Trayvon Martin - YouTube[/ame]

Listen real closely, Even though the title of the video says he said the C word.

and read some of the comments below.

 

[mikeysmommom]

I'm not certain what is being said. Even with the enhancement that CNN did.

It was hard for me to at first .IMO he has a VA accent at least one I can hear.