2010.07.26 Grand Jury begins

[A_Closer_Look]

I never doubted the MFH plot. I always thought the LS was being truthful about it.
I think it was a pretty boneheaded idea to try to 'sting' TH at the point and time that they did though, I mean... she was probably well aware of the intense scrutiny that she was already under by the investigation, and then BLAMMO some tag team shows up to ask for a deposit on a discussion you had previously to kill your husband. I'd call 911 too! I think the timing made this sting completely obvious.

 

[loves2bmom]

The probably polyed him , found he was being truthful

I'm willing to bet they also have some sort of communication between the two. Whether it be a large amount of phone calls or maybe even an email or text. I wouldn't think just his word and a possible poly would be enough. I think they have more! JMO

 

[Aedrys]

I'm willing to bet they also have some sort of communication between the two. Whether it be a large amount of phone calls or maybe even an email or text. I wouldn't think just his word and a possible poly would be enough. I think they have more! JMO

God, I hope the Grand Jury wasn't subjected to any sexting pictures she sent to this landscaper. She should be humiliated if so. And I feel for them if they had to see that. I bet the landscaper's cheeks were red if they did have to see those pictures and then hear his explanation. And we haven't heard if Mike Cook has testified yet, have we?

 

[Calliope]

I never doubted the MFH plot. I always thought the LS was being truthful about it.
I think it was a pretty boneheaded idea to try to 'sting' TH at the point and time that they did though, I mean... she was probably well aware of the intense scrutiny that she was already under by the investigation, and then BLAMMO some tag team shows up to ask for a deposit on a discussion you had previously to kill your husband. I'd call 911 too! I think the timing made this sting completely obvious.

bbm

Yeah. That's about the time I started wondering if LE really had a grip on this case.

As far as landscaper goes, it's still just he-said / she-said. Unless they have some proof she made the offer, then his testimony is pretty worthless IMO. And if they had proof, there wouldn't have been that attempted sting.

 

[Aedrys]

bbm

Yeah. That's about the time I started wondering if LE really had a grip on this case.

As far as landscaper goes, it's still just he-said / she-said. Unless they have some proof she made the offer, then his testimony is pretty worthless IMO. And if they had proof, there wouldn't have been that attempted sting.

Then why put him in front of the Grand Jury if his testimony is worthless? They must have some proof of what happened other than he said/she said, or he would not be in front of the Grand Jury testifying. I think they just wanted icing on the cake by catching her admitting that it happened. I don't think they actually needed that, though.

 

[A_Closer_Look]

bbm

Yeah. That's about the time I started wondering if LE really had a grip on this case.

As far as landscaper goes, it's still just he-said / she-said. Unless they have some proof she made the offer, then his testimony is pretty worthless IMO. And if they had proof, there wouldn't have been that attempted sting.

Yeah, they'll need something more than his word, that is for sure. I wonder if TH confided in any friends, maybe even after the sting, admitting anything about the MFH. Maybe they have that information now that others seem to be going before the GJ. Maybe they need his statement in order to build on somebody elses statement?

 

[Calliope]

Then why put him in front of the Grand Jury if his testimony is worthless? They must have some proof of what happened other than he said/she said, or he would not be in front of the Grand Jury testifying. I think they just wanted icing on the cake by catching her admitting that it happened. I don't think they actually needed that, though.

Worthless for conviction, I mean.

 

[tlcya]

Just as we here are deciding whether and how much credence to give landscaper's story of MFH plot, so shall the GJ. Their function is to hear the tesimony of various individuals in this case and decide whether there is enough there to warrant filing criminal charges. The burden of proof when considering testimony at GJ is less stringent than criminal court. If the GJ determine there is enough smoke, they will holler fire (or in this case, file charges). IF that happens, then a trial jury of Terri's peers or a judge will determine her guilt or innocence.

The GJ is often used when LE and prosecutors are convinced they are onto the right person or persons but have a very circumstantial case. Its a sort of feeling them out sort of phase. If it doesn't get past the grand jury, who has a lower burden of proof to consider, then it certainly won't get past a trial jury or judge.

MOO - the GJ was convened because LE sincerely believes Terri is guilty of both MFH and criminal act regarding Kyron but they are light on evidence. They are sticking their toes in and testing the waters with this whole GJ thing. Again MOO

 

[cypress]

If I was sitting on a jury, the landscaper's testimony would become iffy for me when I learned he didn't come forward of his own accord. To take it a step further, I would be curious about how police obtained this information and if the landscaper has any outstanding warrants or other possible legal troubles that might influence his need to get on the good side of LE. Did he confess to this after an hour of questioning? Three? Ten? Also, if there are sexts between the landscaper and Terri, they only prove Terri has issues when it comes to sex, not that she wanted her husband dead.

LE wanted to arrest her for the MFH plot, but they needed corroboration. When the sting was unsuccessful in obtaining that corroboration, I believe the possibility of arresting her for the MFH plot fell apart.

I believe the landscaper's testimony is more about shaping the jurors' thoughts about Terri's character than anything to do with the intent or ability of the prosecutor to prosecute Terri for the MFH plot.

 

[citigirl]

I think it would be useful to put the landscaper on the stand in front of the Grand Jury (low risk) and see how he testifies. Assuming they have a lot of other evidence.

Kind of a practice before the real trial.

 

[Billylee]

Out of all of TH's friends that we assume helped her in some way, this landscaper is the only one that I'm aware of who implied that TH told him there was anything wrong with the marriage, and specifically that TH alleges some sort of distress inflicted upon her by KH. Has anyone else heard anything from any of TH's friends or family in this regard?

I think this may have a lot to do with why the landscaper is testifying at the GJ. Keep in mind, this was 6 or 7 months before Kyron went missing. If this turns out to be some sort of true statement, it could have EVERYTHING to do with this case.

According to sources, Terri Horman had talked to the landscaper about being in a bad marriage and had claimed that Kaine had "hurt" her emotionally.

http://www.kgw.com/home/Hormanprobelatest-97771724.html

 

[Ms Suzanne]

I do feel they will find out what happened to little Kyron with this LS.I feel IMHO they need to be looking much harder at him.

 

[Kat010]

So can we assume that they think he's credible?

Well, no, not necessarily. After all, Mafia guys are called to testify at grand juries all the time!

I suspect that his story sounds "good" enough (in terms of targeting TH) for a trial run in front of the GJ. There'll be no cross-examination, etc. and they can see how his story holds together and how the jurors react.

Unless they've got something to back him up, they've got he said/she said. And during an actual trial, the defense could have a high old time with that failed sting. Using him, I think, would be a real risk unless they have more than his story.

Which, of course, he failed to come forward with 9 months ago. So apparently even he didn't think the threat was serious enough to report.

And I'll bet that's just what the defense will say. They'll rip that point apart, then move on to ding on LE and that dumb sting.

To try and put him on during a trial they'd have to be awful desperaate--unless they have rock solid evidence backing him up. IMHO.

 

[Aedrys]

I think he's credible enough to be put in front of the Grand Jury, but I'm not so sure he's credible enough to be part of a criminal trial unless LE has more damning evidence we don't know about. That's highly possible since they don't share very much evidence with us as it is.

However, I highly doubt LE would put anyone in front of the Grand Jury that wasn't credible at all. That's just wasting time and resources. I do agree it might be a trial run to see if they want to use him at the criminal trial, but if he wasn't credible, he wouldn't be in the front of the Grand Jury, IMO.

 

[sherbetjello]

Honestly, I think the MFH plot would be awful to use in court to "paint a picture." She wasn't convicted, or even charged, with any crime there (if she had been, if there was SUFFICIENT evidence, she would be in jail) and that leaves too much room for her attorney to work that angle.
It's a big wedge, huge even.

I am going to relate it real quick: Those girls that were in jail with Casey Anthony, the ones that said "they knew she murdered Caylee" girls? That was hersay, and it was ran with.. now there is someone else jumping in saying that it was all made up. There is actually none evidence that any of these girls have that PROVES the murder, just words. Words shouldn't bear this much weight, ESPECIALLY in a national case such as Kyrons. Any and everybody would jump in to hang Terri Horman, and that isn't justice people. Those are emotions working.

 

[Chablis]

I wonder how Terri paid the landscaper, considering Kaine never knew they had one?

 

[nursebeeme]

Honestly, I think the MFH plot would be awful to use in court to "paint a picture." She wasn't convicted, or even charged, with any crime there (if she had been, if there was SUFFICIENT evidence, she would be in jail) and that leaves too much room for her attorney to work that angle.
It's a big wedge, huge even.

I am going to relate it real quick: Those girls that were in jail with Casey Anthony, the ones that said "they knew she murdered Caylee" girls? That was hersay, and it was ran with.. now there is someone else jumping in saying that it was all made up. There is actually none evidence that any of these girls have that PROVES the murder, just words. Words shouldn't bear this much weight, ESPECIALLY in a national case such as Kyrons. Any and everybody would jump in to hang Terri Horman, and that isn't justice people. Those are emotions working.

the grand jury is for locking in testimony and investigation.

how do you know the grand jury is not trying for a true bill for murder for hire?

 

[Emeralgem]

Out of all of TH's friends that we assume helped her in some way, this landscaper is the only one that I'm aware of who implied that TH told him there was anything wrong with the marriage, and specifically that TH alleges some sort of distress inflicted upon her by KH. Has anyone else heard anything from any of TH's friends or family in this regard?

I think this may have a lot to do with why the landscaper is testifying at the GJ. Keep in mind, this was 6 or 7 months before Kyron went missing. If this turns out to be some sort of true statement, it could have EVERYTHING to do with this case.

According to sources, Terri Horman had talked to the landscaper about being in a bad marriage and had claimed that Kaine had "hurt" her emotionally.

http://www.kgw.com/home/Hormanprobelatest-97771724.html

I have never assumed the landscaper helped her in some way concerning Kyron but I did read in an article from one of the Portland area newspapers that aquaintances from the fitness center were saying Terri was very vocal at the gym about her problems with Kaine..JMO

 

[Breathe]

If they're trying to paint a picture of Terri's character, does that mean Mike Cook will be called to testify?

 

[Kat010]

If they're trying to paint a picture of Terri's character, does that mean Mike Cook will be called to testify?

Doubtful if he'd be called to trial. Once they put him on the stand, especially in terms of TH's character, the door opens for his. Then his entire messy background comes out.

Along, no doubt, with a very smart defense attorney going over and stressing what good friends he and KH were in school, how much they shared. Obviously, since MC rushed in to do various things--website, $ collection, banners, etc.--there's a link to KH.

Oh, that brush would tar in several directions, and it would reach all the way to KH. Unless, of course, KH can testify that everything that MC did re looking for Kyron he did without ever speaking to KH at all (disputed by MC's own postings on the website) and that in fact, he didn't speak to MC at all, not even to say "thank you." That MC had never been to his home before he took groceries to TH and that actually MC no doubt had to use a map to find the house because KH never invited them there not even while working on Kyron materials.

Get MC on the stand and KH is at big, big, big risk. IMHO.

Right now the prosecution & LE are just trying to throw anything at the GG in hopes of getting an indictment. Even if they drop some witnesses later on. They just want an indictment--along with the headlines.