2011.02.21: Elisa Baker indicted for 2nd degree murder!!

[WhyaDuck?]

Will there be a separate thread dedicated to the presser? That might be a good idea since it will likely discuss these charges but also may include ME report, COD info etc.

I didn't see anyone open one, so I went ahead and did it:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6143190"]2011.02.21: HPD Press Conference, 3pm Feb 21, 2011 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[6angels]

Sweet precious Zahra. We all promised you that justice was coming. Though I'd love to see a harsher charge, I understand the second degree charge. Rest easy, precious child.

Zahra, my gs was born sleeping this morning. Please watch over him, and give him all the love I had so wanted to. :blowkiss:

I would of liked M1 .

I am so very sorry for the passing of your grandson. big hugs to you and your family expecially your child that has lost an angel today.

 

[Melanie]

WOW - the indictment states:

3. The defendant desecrated the victim's body to hinder detection, investigation and prosecution of the offense.

So the bigamist did the dismemberment? They obviously have some evidence to state this.

wow!

Mel

http://images.bimedia.net/documents/022111+baker+indictment.pdf

 

[Melanie]

I, too, wonder why they went with 2nd degree.

Second-degree murder is ordinarily defined as 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion" or 2) a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life. Second-degree murder may best be viewed as the middle ground between first-degree murder and voluntary manslaughter.

Is EB screaming "accident"?

MOO

Mel

 

[WhyaDuck?]

I, too, wonder why they went with 2nd degree.

Second-degree murder is ordinarily defined as 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion" or 2) a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life. Second-degree murder may best be viewed as the middle ground between first-degree murder and voluntary manslaughter.

Is EB screaming "accident"?

MOO

Mel

IIRC, her position was not accident so much as not seeking medical care for a serious illness, which would fall under this, I think.

 

[FaerieB]

I, too, wonder why they went with 2nd degree.

Second-degree murder is ordinarily defined as 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion" or 2) a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life. Second-degree murder may best be viewed as the middle ground between first-degree murder and voluntary manslaughter.

Is EB screaming "accident"?

MOO

Mel

My understanding, and I'm hoping one of our fantastic lawyers on WS will correct me if I'm wrong, is if Zahra died as a result of abuse, that no one sought medical aid for, EB would be charged with 2nd degree.

ETA: And of course, Duck hit send before I did.

 

[tlcya]

WOW - the indictment states:

3. The defendant desecrated the victim's body to hinder detection, investigation and prosecution of the offense.

So the bigamist did the dismemberment? They obviously have some evidence to state this.

wow!

Mel

http://images.bimedia.net/documents/022111+baker+indictment.pdf

yeah, that would seem to fly in the face of the letters to the internet ghoul pushing the story that AB was responsible for that. Apparently the GJ wasn't buying it. There must have been some sort of evidence to refute her story for them to charge with that. I am betting witnesses etc, have placed AB somewhere far from where and when EB claims the dismemberment happened.

ETA which may in part explain why no charges have been leveled upon him as yet. Methinks the GJ heard quite a bit of evidence that we have not yet seen, such as evidence gleaned from search warrants.

 

[Achristmas1J]

I think that LE probably took 1st degree off the table to get her to tell them where Zahra was, then added aggravating circumstances to get the maximum. Does anyone know what the penalties are for 2nd degree with aggravating circs?

 

[Mountain_Kat]

THAT shakes things up quite a bit doesn't it? Kinda makes *last* Tuesday or Thursday as the last time AB saw Zahra.. um..not very viable...

Maybe he meant he saw her on any Tuesday. Or Weds. Or Thurs. Or Friday. In which case, he isn't lying, is he? I mean, surely he saw Zahra at some point over the course of 10 years. :banghead:

 

[Melanie]

Just thinking. How could AB not know his very own daughter is missing? In the indictment it states the murder happened on 9/24, yet Zahra was reported missing on Oct. 9 by her father, Adam Baker, and her stepmother, Elisa Baker.

Police said she has not been seen by anyone outside of her family since Sept. 25.

Why did AB call on 10/9? I would certainly notice if my son was missing within hours!

What in God's good name did AB think was going on between 9/24 and 10/9?? He needs to face charges as well, IMHO.

MOO

Mel

 

[Mountain_Kat]

yeah, that would seem to fly in the face of the letters to the internet ghoul pushing the story that AB was responsible for that. Apparently the GJ wasn't buying it. There must have been some sort of evidence to refute her story for them to charge with that. I am betting witnesses etc, have placed AB somewhere far from where and when EB claims the dismemberment happened.

ETA which may in part explain why no charges have been leveled upon him as yet. Methinks the GJ heard quite a bit of evidence that we have not yet seen, such as evidence gleaned from search warrants.

I'm assuming though, that if she had assistance in any part of this crime, the indictment wouldn't state that, since these are soley HER charges. KWIM?

 

[Hopeful One]

What does #2 in the pdf mean: the victim was secreted away from family PRIOR to the offence? Was Zahra killed elsewhere???

I think that means EB kept Zahra away from family before she was killed. MOO.

 

[WhyaDuck?]

These threads might be of interest:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119031"]Why is Adam Baker not in jail? - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120774"]AB's Involvement ptII - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[panthera]

IIRC, her position was not accident so much as not seeking medical care for a serious illness, which would fall under this, I think.

I believe it's not so much EB's claim what happened but what the DA will be able to prove in court and secure a conviction on. They also may have made a deal in order to get her to disclose where Zahra's remains were. MOO

 

[tlcya]

Wondering about the TOD listed in indictment, that is why I am anxiously hoping that ME report will be released today. The "on or about" portion of indicment makes me wonder if exact date of death was not determinable but rather a window of time. Maybe the TOD in the indictment is based off of EB's own statement that that was the time of death. Lacking any physical evidence to prove that untrue, if there is only a window on ME report, they have to put down some date. Or they may have heard specific evidence pointing to an exact day.

Pins and needles

Pins and needles

 

[passionflower]

ah, FairieB ((((HUGS)))) I am so very sorry for your loss.

 

[KathrynL]

On the way to justice for this precious girl. This case just broke my heart, and I'm relieved that the wheels of justice have started to turn. Will be tuned into the presser this afternoon.

 

[Melanie]

I think that LE probably took 1st degree off the table to get her to tell them where Zahra was, then added aggravating circumstances to get the maximum. Does anyone know what the penalties are for 2nd degree with aggravating circs?

Per Wiki:

Murder with specified aggravating circumstances is often punished more harshly. Depending on the jurisdiction, such circumstances may include:

1. Premeditation
2. Poisoning
3. Murder of a police officer, judge, fireman or witness to a crime
4. Where the victim was a pregnant woman
5. Committed for pay or other reward
6. Exceptional brutality or cruelty

(My bet is #6)

As far as time, I believe it's 30 years to life. Maybe one of our experts can chime in.

MOO

Mel

 

[LaLaw2000]

THAT shakes things up quite a bit doesn't it? Kinda makes *last* Tuesday or Thursday as the last time AB saw Zahra.. um..not very viable...

Exactly! So how is it AB is not charged as well????? Where in heck did he think little Zahra was? It is pretty clear that AB has lied and those lies did impede the investigation. I do not understand unless there will be another inditement issued.

*Wish it could be First Degree Murder, but at least she has now been charged!

 

[panthera]

Per Wiki:

Murder with specified aggravating circumstances is often punished more harshly. Depending on the jurisdiction, such circumstances may include:

1. Premeditation
2. Poisoning
3. Murder of a police officer, judge, fireman or witness to a crime
4. Where the victim was a pregnant woman
5. Committed for pay or other reward
6. Exceptional brutality or cruelty

(My bet is #6)

As far as time, I believe it's 30 years to life. Maybe one of our experts can chime in.

MOO

Mel

I also am curious if #2 is applicable. MOO