2011.03.30 Officials Believe Hailey Dunn Is Dead; Reward Now For Her Whereabouts

[MsFacetious]

Yes, thanks Pete...

Hailey also "might" never be found.

ONE searcher.

ONE.

http://www.ktxs.com/big_country_news/27403999/detail.html

Now obviously I'm not sure what they thought they were looking for in fields and ditches... but all I know is there was still searches even after this long.

Until there was this "she might be deceased... or she might not..." statement. (Along with the [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131751"]announcement to searchers[/ame] on Monday... which could also factor in here.)


Hailey endured who knows what before her disappearance.

Hailey's abductor/killer is still walking the streets, she has no justice.

Hailey's mother doesn't appear to be capable of caring any less.

Hailey's father is devastated and devoting his life to finding his child.

Hailey's baby sister (her "mini-me") will likely never know her.


All of that is sad enough.


Now, Hailey is probably dead.

AND people aren't even going to look for her anymore?

When my cousin was murdered, her parents were so grateful to have found HER that they didn't even attempt to find her killer(s). Knowing that he/she is STILL out there, very likely having killed many more times... is sickening.

Whether Hailey is dead, alive or "under duress"... she needs to be found.

If she is dead then she needs to be found so her killer(s) can be stopped and her family can know where she is.

Caylee

Kyron

Susan

All volunteer searchers.

All kept searching after it was widely believed that the person was deceased.

I don't know what the purpose of the announcement to searchers and the deceased/duress statement was. I sure hope that the searches stopping was an acceptable outcome. It was certainly a predictable one.

So she might be dead, but she might not be?

She might be under duress, but then again maybe she's not?

Thanks for the update, Pete.

It sounds to me like he's just trying to cover all the bases, so he can somehow be right when all of this ends up getting resolved. Pretty sick if you ask me, but that's just MOO.

 

[tehcloser]

I can't really fault PK with the searchers stopping. Seems to me like it's quite the mess there with them anyway. You have groups fighting each other, locals saying they have destroyed private property, the "warning" from LE. I would imagine if anyone is still searching, you won't hear about it...can't blame them. They are doing it for Hailey, not to get a pat on the back.

Who knows what areas have been searched...it was a fluster cluck from the word go. This group won't search with that group. That group thinks the other group is getting more acknowledgement. pppffftttt. And the best part is all of em' are fighting it out on the social networks...Hailey would be proud. (Insert rollyeyes here.)


* Not ALL of them, a few have their heart in the right place, but enough of them that it is just stoopid.

 

[cluciano63]

Seems as though a whole new cottage industry of searchers will pop up, if the reward now includes finding her deceased...

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I don't understand stopping searches because Hailey might be deceased. Did these searchers think they were going to come across a hut in the middle of the forest where Hailey would be living with her abductor?

 

[southern_comfort]

I don't understand stopping searches because Hailey might be deceased. Did these searchers think they were going to come across a hut in the middle of the forest where Hailey would be living with her abductor?

I agree. It doesn't make sense. It seems like something must have been going on during the searches that LE didn't like and wants to stop. First the cryptic warnings to searchers (paraphrasing): "Know with whom you are searching" and "Personal relationships with persons of interest will not be taken lightly"... and now providing an excuse (though an odd one) for searches to stop altogether.

Seems like something is up.

 

[swedie]

I just want to cry for Hailey and those who love her so much. They may never bring her home if the searches do not continue. Whoever is responsible must have did a bit of studying/homework on "how to hide a body". I cannot fathom the thought of this innocent beautiful little girl (if deceased) not having a proper place to lay to rest. So is it true that the searches are over? Will LE take over now? She has got to be found. Is there plenty of wildlife in Texas that would feed on a body, and if so, what types of animals? I don't mean to be so graphic but in all reality. My apologies.

 

[LisaB]

LE is controling all of the information so if they do not believe she has been seen ,we wont believe it either.

And they believe she is dead.

Out side of Texas She isnt in much danger of being spotted. If she is ,somewhere like Maryland who would notice.

ME! I also keep my eye out for Phylicia Barnes and Brittanee Drexel and Kyron Horman, even though Phylicia is the only one missing from anywhere NEAR Maryland...

 

[LisaB]

Yes, as my Grandma would say, "they aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer"!!

All we have is "a little bit" of information that LE has released. I would really
like to know the people SA called/texted while at his mother's. I think that information helps LE a lot in piecing together their case. And I have always wondered if one of those calls were to BJD at work to let her know that it was time for her to "call DD and then to report Hailey missing". I have never understood why BJD never felt it important to call SA and tell him Hailey was missing. If it was me, my SO would have been the first person I would have called and would have wanted him to go with me to file the missing person report.

JMO

BBM

Billie didn't call DD to check on Hailey until the following day.

It is my feeling that BD sent the text to MB that day too probably using SA's phone.

Can you send a text from your phone if it is not in your possession? Billie was at work at the hospital in Snyder Mon. and the phone was at home with Hailey.

The text was sent from Billie's phone. We may not know the specifics of the exact time, etc., but that much we do know. LE would know if it was sent from a computer or another phone using a spoof app because the record of the message would (or would not) be among the calling records for the account.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I don't understand stopping searches because Hailey might be deceased. Did these searchers think they were going to come across a hut in the middle of the forest where Hailey would be living with her abductor?

You are so right, eileenhawkeye, and thinking so logically. But I believe, within the heart of each searcher, there is this small hope (even if it's illogical) that the person they are searching for will be found alive. . . or a trace of something that will lead to them. Hope for the best result is what keeps searchers going so I can kinda understand that when a presser is put out that basically says the person is dead that it would have a devastating effect.

What I really don't understand is why, even though the majority of the searchers for Caylee Anthony realized they should probably be looking for tiny bones, it didn't stop them anyway. We're they more incensed by what might have happened than what's going on here? What is the difference? If I were in driving distance, I'd be out there looking . . . unless I felt I wasn't really welcomed. Is that what it is?

This is just a snarley old mess, isn't it?

 

[LisaB]

I don't understand stopping searches because Hailey might be deceased. Did these searchers think they were going to come across a hut in the middle of the forest where Hailey would be living with her abductor?

I agree. It doesn't make sense. It seems like something must have been going on during the searches that LE didn't like and wants to stop. First the cryptic warnings to searchers (paraphrasing): "Know with whom you are searching" and "Personal relationships with persons of interest will not be taken lightly"... and now providing an excuse (though an odd one) for searches to stop altogether.

Seems like something is up.

And who is MORE likely to want to search for this child than people who were friendly with her family? I understand the reasoning, but it sure eliminates a lot of searchers when the town has a relatively small population to start off with.

PERHAPS LE really does have compelling evidence that she is dead. Finding something like her clothing would be reason to think so, unless she ditched her clothes in an effort to alter her appearance. I am thinking more though of the case of the airline pilot who killed his wife and put her through a wood-chipper. They found bits of fingernail and a tooth and he was convicted.

I'd say a tooth would be a pretty good indication that the owner was dead, and there are probably other things they could find to leave them with that impression. Without coming right out and tipping their hand, they may be TRYING to discourage people "wasting their time searching" if they believe the change in terms of the reward is more likely to bring results.

JMO

 

[Soulmagent]

And who is MORE likely to want to search for this child than people who were friendly with her family? I understand the reasoning, but it sure eliminates a lot of searchers when the town has a relatively small population to start off with.

PERHAPS LE really does have compelling evidence that she is dead. Finding something like her clothing would be reason to think so, unless she ditched her clothes in an effort to alter her appearance. I am thinking more though of the case of the airline pilot who killed his wife and put her through a wood-chipper. They found bits of fingernail and a tooth and he was convicted.

I'd say a tooth would be a pretty good indication that the owner was dead, and there are probably other things they could find to leave them with that impression. Without coming right out and tipping their hand, they may be TRYING to discourage people "wasting their time searching" if they believe the change in terms of the reward is more likely to bring results.

JMO

They also had a witness who saw him with a woodchipper at the location to help ensure that conviction.

If they think Hailey is deceased then it seems they would want to locate her remains. Without the searchers that lessens the chances of her being found.

I never thought LE thought the searchers would find Hailey. I feel like they think the searchers were something they had to put up with.

The change in terms of the reward is interesting but I think it is because SA is locked in a timeline and the timeline still for LE is not matching up. Either they think someone is covering for him or they think he had help. IMO they have a reason to believe at some point during the crime he is presumed to have commited he could not have done it without help ,maybe someone had his phone. Other wise I dont see how it would make sence for them to think he could not have done this alone. All speculation of course but clearly there are mixed messages with the discouragement the searches and increasing the reward.

 

[NSS]

I am sure that searchers are becoming weary, it's been a long time and the same people stomping the same fields must become soul destroying at some point.

I would love for her to be found and given a proper burial, if she is no longer alive.
I also understand how locals have become disheartened. Should HD be found, she will be returned to BD (as the custodial parent), and I doubt that a decent burial will be top of her list of priorities.
There'll be new clothes, covering up any further incriminating evidence, and a zillion other ungrateful comments.
I know we all like to imagine that we're doing it for Hailey, but Hailey no longer cares about her earthly remains. The ceremonies are for those of us left behind.

So, whilst I don't agree with giving up on searching, I can understand why they have......and PK is just the latest in a long list of demoralizing events.

 

[grandmaj]

I don't think that LE is trying to discourage people from searching as a general rule.

I believe that the statement is meant to keep people with motives that are not pure from searching. We heard a local tell us about a searcher last week that kicked the door in to a private office after the homeowner had given them permission to search his property. WHY? What gave anyone the right to kick a door in? There is something wrong when you cause damage and go into the property of others. This is what LE is trying to stop. Because if you cannot follow the basic rules of search and follow the law, what if these searchers did find Hailey? Or evidence? What would they do?

I believe there is some type of evidence that came very early on in the investigation. Phone pings, phone records between Shawn and Billie or something in this regards that led the investigation where it is going.

As far as the search dwindling? It appears there are many egos out there and if anything, that is affecting the searches. It could be the fear that people are violating the rules of searching, that people are doing this for the wrong reason and that people just are afraid to get involved.

Or people may feel that she is so well hidden, buried etc., that after 3 months they have to go back to their own lives and let professionals take over.

I think the reward was changed in order to get a tip as to where Hailey is so that professional searchers would have some clue as to where to start looking. That is allot of country out there and it is needle in a hay stack. 3 months into the investigation, the fires, weather changes, people tromping around out there, changes in the topography now with grasses and crops, it is a needle in the haystack.

 

[scorekeeper]

BBM

Billie didn't call DD to check on Hailey until the following day.




The text was sent from Billie's phone. We may not know the specifics of the exact time, etc., but that much we do know. LE would know if it was sent from a computer or another phone using a spoof app because the record of the message would (or would not) be among the calling records for the account.

I guess I didn't word my post real well. Let me re-write what I meant to relay:

1. LE hasn't released the phone calls/text that SA made on Monday. This is the day he was at his mother. Hopefully it wasn't released because the information is beneficial to the investigation.

2. Tuesday, the day Hailey was reported missing, I wondered if SA texted BJD (to have her start her part of reporting Hailey missing) then she called David to check on Hailey. But I can't find anything that says where SA was on Tuesday or any mention of his phone pings.

:waitasec:

 

[Soulmagent]

I guess I didn't word my post real well. Let me re-write what I meant to relay:

1. LE hasn't released the phone calls/text that SA made on Monday. This is the day he was at his mother. Hopefully it wasn't released because the information is beneficial to the investigation.

2. Tuesday, the day Hailey was reported missing, I wondered if SA texted BJD (to have her start her part of reporting Hailey missing) then she called David to check on Hailey. But I can't find anything that says where SA was on Tuesday or any mention of his phone pings.

:waitasec:

BD didnt have her phone to get a text at work on tues. It was left at her house that day and she talked to DD. She was using her work phone on tues.

 

[Jo in Calif]

I guess I didn't word my post real well. Let me re-write what I meant to relay:

1. LE hasn't released the phone calls/text that SA made on Monday. This is the day he was at his mother. Hopefully it wasn't released because the information is beneficial to the investigation.

2. Tuesday, the day Hailey was reported missing, I wondered if SA texted BJD (to have her start her part of reporting Hailey missing) then she called David to check on Hailey. But I can't find anything that says where SA was on Tuesday or any mention of his phone pings.

:waitasec:

We don't have his phone pings for Tue. we have a limited amount of his pings on Mon.
LE won't release his phone records.
Shawn was said to have been at his mothers on Tue.

 

[scorekeeper]

BD didnt have her phone to get a text at work on tues. It was left at her house that day and she talked to DD. She was using her work phone on tues.

:truce: Oh, my gosh, I need to get some sleep........text/call is what I meant.
I guess is what i'm trying to figure out is where SA was on Tuesday and if he had contact with BJA before she called DD......

sorry.....

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

They also had a witness who saw him with a woodchipper at the location to help ensure that conviction.

If they think Hailey is deceased then it seems they would want to locate her remains. Without the searchers that lessens the chances of her being found.

I never thought LE thought the searchers would find Hailey. I feel like they think the searchers were something they had to put up with. The change in terms of the reward is interesting but I think it is because SA is locked in a timeline and the timeline still for LE is not matching up. Either they think someone is covering for him or they think he had help. IMO they have a reason to believe at some point during the crime he is presumed to have commited he could not have done it without help ,maybe someone had his phone. Other wise I dont see how it would make sence for them to think he could not have done this alone. All speculation of course but clearly there are mixed messages with the discouragement the searches and increasing the reward.

BBM- I too had this feeling/idea...that LE was not all that keen on folks searching for Hailey. For one, LE did very, very little actual searching for Hailey and did not encourage nor organize/authorize any official searches. 2, major missing children organizations went to CCity to coordinate efforts and train search teams that was comprised of civilian searchers. I'm guessing they, LE know a whole lot more than we do at this point.

 

[Soulmagent]

I don't think that LE is trying to discourage people from searching as a general rule.

I believe that the statement is meant to keep people with motives that are not pure from searching. We heard a local tell us about a searcher last week that kicked the door in to a private office after the homeowner had given them permission to search his property. WHY? What gave anyone the right to kick a door in? There is something wrong when you cause damage and go into the property of others. This is what LE is trying to stop. Because if you cannot follow the basic rules of search and follow the law, what if these searchers did find Hailey? Or evidence? What would they do?

I believe there is some type of evidence that came very early on in the investigation. Phone pings, phone records between Shawn and Billie or something in this regards that led the investigation where it is going.

As far as the search dwindling? It appears there are many egos out there and if anything, that is affecting the searches. It could be the fear that people are violating the rules of searching, that people are doing this for the wrong reason and that people just are afraid to get involved.

Or people may feel that she is so well hidden, buried etc., that after 3 months they have to go back to their own lives and let professionals take over.

I think the reward was changed in order to get a tip as to where Hailey is so that professional searchers would have some clue as to where to start looking. That is allot of country out there and it is needle in a hay stack. 3 months into the investigation, the fires, weather changes, people tromping around out there, changes in the topography now with grasses and crops, it is a needle in the haystack.

Grandmaj

LE has never been interested in the public searching nor have the cared if the public was interested in this case. They seemed bothered by the whole thing. Now they are ready to arrest people for searching for Hailey instead of setting up areas for people to search and encourging a healthy public /searcher /LE relationship.

The statement to the searchers was interesting as it almost seemed to want to bring attention that it might not be safe to search, (that cuts off the general do gooders. Who wants to be scared it is an investigation)

Then for people who are friends and family it seems to be worded in a way that it would imply guilt or tarnish someones image to the public to be searching when you were or are a friend or family member.

Then back to the them telling BTH not to allow Billie on their show.

That makes it appear they are trying to remove attention and focus off the case in the public aspect.

Locking Clint up before the traffic 911 thing and then releasing the CP information.
The dog got a hit and then it was all a mistake or misunderstanding.

The witness who went on TV and said she saw Hailey. They say it was falso she was confused etc.. (that woman didnt sound confused to me)

The land fill evidence and non evidence.

The spokeperson says stuff in the presence of the LE investigater and they deny it ,say it was a mistake or cannot confirm it. It doesnt reflect the feelings of the dept. etc.


I am sorry , I just do not see where they are bringing Justice to Hailey or intergrity to her case. Not to be harsh or anything of the sort but if we were to rewind this case and play it over from start until now I dont think we can find one single thing they have been consistant with at all.
Nor will we find they have answered any questions. Explained anything even stuff they retracted and should have explained in the media to prevent false information from speading.

Dont forgot sparky's little smirk on one of the very first pressers and then compare that to the sheriff on Zarha bakers case before they knew what happened.

I know they could have some evidence. That still doesnt explain why they have been so unprofessional , such as telling the media about her and shawn being spotted together, and even going back to the way this LE dept handled the famous 911 call.

I am not trying to be harsh on them but I cant condone the way they have handled themselves even if they do have evidence. It is not a reason to play with words and media statements and confuse the public on purpose. No they dont have to tell us anything but if they do say something that does tell us anything it should be consistant information, indicating it could be true instead of telling us two different things,of which one is true the other isnt.
I am not bashing them either I just question the reasons behind the unproffessional attitude.

I also think they as LE officers should have directed and screened those searchers so they could have prevented alot of the issues that occured leading to the statement about the searchers.

I have LE in my family and respect them very much.

I just think I should not put blind faith into this dept. IMO.

 

[Tugela]

...snipped...

I disagree with this statement. SA did say he went to his mother's house, but he said he went there straight from work, not via CC. BD admitted that it made no sense for him to go back through CC to get to Big Spring from his job. Going through CC is the long way. There's a shorter direct route he would normally have taken.

He went there in order to use the computer. Since we now know that he used both the computer at the mothers house AND the grandmother's house, it would make more sense to have gone to the house closest to him first. That would have been the grandmothers, and that is where he said he went first. No one was there so he then proceeded to the other computer that was available, which was the mothers. The most direct route from there would have been through CC. In other words his account is reasonable.