2015.10.20 Elizabeth Parker - Defense Attorney representing CWW

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I'm guessing chefs because they get to be in charge of a big operation. Kind of like being the CEO especially if it's a popular and high end restaurant. I don't know what the statistics are, but surely the majority of the people doing those jobs aren't psychopaths :scared:

I worked for some school principals who were definite possible candidates.

It does sound like CWW has a lot of the traits though, especially overinflated ego.
 
Matlacha said:
I was going to post very much the same sentiment. Prosecutors should be interested in justice, but most, it seems, just want a high conviction rate. The ability to buy tainted testimony by making deals with other inmates is just one example of prosecutorial abuse. Still, I don't believe taxpayers should be on the hook for the defense of sociopaths, or even the innocent. The right to a fair trial is guaranteed; the right to have someone else foot the bill is not. If you want more of something, they say, subsidize it. By subsidizing free legal defense, we arguably get more crime than we'd have otherwise, not to mention clearly guilty sociopaths hanging on for decades until (in PA, at least) a squishy soft governor comes along to stay the execution of a white murderer/rapist of a 16-year-old girl because blacks are over-represented in death penalty cases.
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I totally understand where you are coming from, but the right to a fair trial would not be guaranteed if an indigent defendant wasn't entitled to counsel simply because they can't afford the fee. Many poor criminals see their court appointed defense attorney as an extension of the state, it takes time to build trust - in other words, I highly doubt people commit crimes with the mindset that hey, I'll get a free legal defense. CWW is a perfect example, he clearly thinks private defense counsel is superior than court appointed defense counsel.

FelicityLemon said:
Of course, everyone deserves the right to be represented in court. Innocent people get arrested, charged, tried and convicted, too. My *sigh* is for people who are caught dead to rights, sometimes confess with excruciating detail, and then recant even in the face of hard evidence and are still are granted time and expense for a "defense". Some guilty people get convicted only to be rewarded with a retrial due to a technicality. But, the technicality also helps when an innocent person is convicted.

Absolutely putting forth a theory or motive that 1) is a LIE or (abused woman, domestic violence), or 2) makes no sense (self-defense?) is a game - you know it's baloney, your client pulled it out of her hat, but you try to do the best with it - that's a game. The trial of Travis Alexander's murderer is an excellent example of throw it against the wall and see what sticks.

Pffft! The OJ trial and resulting verdict was... I don't even know what to say about that fiasco without spewing, so I'll stick with pffft!

Fun and games - absolutely. Not for all attorneys, of course. I was making a generalization to make a point. Watch some trials of showboating attorneys. To call it a game was not meant to diminish the gravity. Maybe I should have used the word strategize, challenge, competition.

And yes, there are sociopathic attorneys both defense and prosecution, judges, bailiffs, doctors, window washers, etc. Somewhere I saw a breakdown among professions. CEO - 1, Lawyer - 2. :D

If no one is outsmarted, how can there be such a thing as wrongful conviction?

The goal is to win. For some attorneys it's to win for their client whether innocent or guilty (or for the people - the state), and for others it's a win for themselves.

Public defenders are salaried and make peanuts compared to what private defense attorneys can charge. I have no idea what the court pays private attorneys who are court ordered to defend someone. Anybody know? I remember one begging to be let off and being very anxious to get back to his private practice.
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BBM. ITA, innocent people are convicted and innocent people also confess to crimes they didn't commit in the face of unfair interrogation tactics. Rare, but it happens more often than I believed at one time. Just as it has been discussed here, lots of people aren't aware they have a choice to not speak to police. Some people genuinely believe if they confess, they can go home. With regard to technicalities, speaking generally, I'd blame the judge.

Jodi Arias, what a case. IIRC, at least one of her lawyers tried multiple times to get off the case - I'm guessing those requests were made because the lawyer was uncomfortable ethically or with JA's plan to testify (and lie). As a defense attorney you can't keep your client from testifying, you can only advise them. The theory that JA was abused wasn't just floated out there because JA said it was true, they had evidence to present. IMO, based on the evidence of "abuse" in that trial, it was clear she was not a victim. But, it is up to the jurors to evaluate the evidence.

In the case of a wrongful conviction, I don't think the jury or defense were outsmarted by the prosecution. Rather, the evidence allowed in and presented to the jury proved beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant was guilty.

The nature of 'winning' is inherent in any adversarial system, but this is quite different from winning at any cost, even disbarment. If it was all about the win, then practicing in areas like divorce, civil litigation or even prosecution would produce more 'wins'. Public defenders and private practice defense attorneys appointed by the state are paid an hourly rate set by the state. Most of the time, there is plea deal and no trial to win. Just based off what I have seen, the hourly rate is equivalent to 50% or less than the private hourly rate, depending on the charges, the court.

Its not just criminals who are afforded lawyers at no charge. Guardianship and family law cases involve court appointments. For example, if someone petitions the court for guardianship over you, alleging that you're mentally incompetent, the court will appoint a lawyer to represent your interests. In contentious child custody proceedings, the judge will appoint an attorney to represent the child's interests. Its more about making sure everyone is on an even playing field before negatively affecting their rights than it is about winning. JMO.
 
CreepingSkills,

Take what I said with a grain of salt. There's evils in both sides of legal representation. I was speaking specifically to this case and cww/ms in general. I obviously get it-was just venting. Chill.
 
RagingClue said:
CreepingSkills,

Take what I said with a grain of salt. There's evils in both sides of legal representation. I was speaking specifically to this case and cww/ms in general. I obviously get it-was just venting. Chill.
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I did take your post with a grain of salt, and my response was chill or at least intended to be. I wasn't upset because you feel one way, in general or specific to this case. Your vent was okay with me, I'm here for discussion, to consider other opinions. Like I said, I understand why defense attorneys are vilified. I'm sure many people agreed with you, my reply was not personal...just offering an alternative view point, explaining or reminding why we need defense attorneys.
 
Riversinthedesert said:
Where on earth did CWW get the funds to pay for a private defense counsel? Shocking imo.
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Just catching up (story of my life)
I did see on Nancy Grace (Sept. 3, NO transcripts) that CWW has 3 vehicles. Two vans, red and white and a silver sedan.
He could:
1. Sell two
2. Refinance his Trailer :giggle:

All kidding aside, I have wondered the same. Plus all the evidence his lawyer is requesting, including the names and address of witnesses and any statements they have made??
Perhaps that's exactly why people really want to help, but are AFRAID for their safety. None of them wants their names out there. (snitch?) Probably too scared to come forward and definitely don't want to testify against CWW if this goes to trial. And it will.
 
I believe they also requested any comments made by CWW- talk about wanting to ensure you are consistent about lies! I will go back to the discovery document to ensure this is what I recall. It just totally stood out to me.


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observation said:
I believe they also requested any comments made by CWW- talk about wanting to ensure you are consistent about lies! I will go back to the discovery document to ensure this is what I recall. It just totally stood out to me.


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Yep- Again I do not know if this is a standard form or customized per client BUT- per the discovery document:
They request- "Any written or recorded statements and the substance of any oral statements made by the ACCUSED including a copy in police reports or report summaries together with the name and address of each witness to the statements."
I am interpreting this to mean the accused is CWW. Really, you want a review of what you said for the record????


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Dmacky said:
Just catching up (story of my life)
I did see on Nancy Grace (Sept. 3, NO transcripts) that CWW has 3 vehicles. Two vans, red and white and a silver sedan.
He could:
1. Sell two
2. Refinance his Trailer :giggle:

All kidding aside, I have wondered the same. Plus all the evidence his lawyer is requesting, including the names and address of witnesses and any statements they have made??
Perhaps that's exactly why people really want to help, but are AFRAID for their safety. None of them wants their names out there. (snitch?) Probably too scared to come forward and definitely don't want to testify against CWW if this goes to trial. And it will.
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Great info on CWW's vehicles!

I was just thinking... what if CWW lucked out with this firm and his defense will be free? The Florida Bar encourages at least 20 hours of pro bono work per year, and requires annual reporting.

"The reporting requirement is designed to provide a sound basis for evaluating the results achieved by this rule, reveal the strengths and weaknesses of the pro bono plan, and to remind lawyers of their professional responsibility under this rule. The fourth alternative of the reporting requirements allows members to indicate that they have fulfilled their service in some manner not specifically envisioned by the plan.

The 20-hour standard for the provision of pro bono legal service to the poor is a minimum. Additional hours of service are to be encouraged. Many lawyers will, as they have before the adoption of this rule, contribute many more hours than the minimum. To ensure that a lawyer receives credit for the time required to handle a particularly involved matter, this rule provides that the lawyer may carry forward, over the next 2 successive years, any time expended in excess of 20 hours in any 1 year."​
https://www.floridabar.org/divexe/rrtfb.nsf/FV/BF60AF4C185D99D085256BBC00533761

JMO the firm sees representing CWW pro bono as a brilliant opportunity to generate business, talking head gigs, and credit from the bar for giving away legal services to the poor. :angel2::oddsmiley:
 
observation said:
Yep- Again I do not know if this is a standard form or customized per client BUT- per the discovery document:
They request- "Any written or recorded statements and the substance of any oral statements made by the ACCUSED including a copy in police reports or report summaries together with the name and address of each witness to the statements."
I am interpreting this to mean the accused is CWW. Really, you want a review of what you said for the record????


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JMO standard general discovery request, a form template. Defense counsel is always going to request any and all statements made by the defendant, written and oral. CWWs attorney will want to review all the evidence against him well before trial.
 
Well per his mother in law, his new wife also took a waitressing job- perhaps her nightly tips could pay for this top notch lawyer as well Dmac. Sorry, my attempt to add a little humor.


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creepingskills said:
JMO standard general discovery request, a form template. Defense counsel is always going to request any and all statements made by the defendant, written and oral. CWWs attorney will want to review all the evidence against him well before trial.
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Appreciate your knowledge here cs!!


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Interesting... Garson & Wright (no relation to CWW), the PR & management firm that represented Parker in connection with her 2014 book, also managed Jose Baez in connection with his book.
 
creepingskills said:
Interesting... Garson & Wright (no relation to CWW), the PR & management firm that represented Parker in connection with her 2014 book, also managed Jose Baez in connection with his book.
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Only five-degrees-of-separation from CWW to CA.
 
observation said:
Yep- Again I do not know if this is a standard form or customized per client BUT- per the discovery document:
They request- "Any written or recorded statements and the substance of any oral statements made by the ACCUSED including a copy in police reports or report summaries together with the name and address of each witness to the statements."
I am interpreting this to mean the accused is CWW. Really, you want a review of what you said for the record????


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Of course he does, they need to know what the prosecution is going to use against him.
 
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