4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #84

[ChatteringBirds]

This tragedy seems to be breaking news:

Police said they responded to King Road for a report of an unconscious person. When officers arrived, they “discovered four individuals who were deceased...”

4 Idaho college students killed in 'targeted attack,' no suspects in custody

Four University of Idaho students were found dead on Sunday, officials said.

abcnews.go.com

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Media Thread/No Discussion

Probable Cause Affidavit

Press photo album (compilation courtesy of WS member cujenn81)

Moscow ID Police Department Facebook page

City of Moscow re King Road Homicide

Media Guide to the Idaho Courts

Detectives are looking to develop context for the events and people involved in the four murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho. Anyone who observed notable behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders:

• Telephone: 208-883-7180
• Email: tipline@ci.moscow.id.us
• Digital Media: fbi.gov/moscowidaho

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[Tricia]

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT ABOUT CHRIS MCDONOUGH AND THE INTERVIEW ROOM

Nothing that Chris M says is allowed on this forum unless it is backed up by law enforcement. ​

Chris has personally lied to me. He accused an innocent man of being Brian Laundry. He lied about being removed from the Crow lawsuit. He was removed but then put back in the lawsuit and lost. Chris told me he was removed from the lawsuit and was not sued. He never told me he was added back into the lawsuit and lost. Chris was sued for getting a false confession in the murder of Stephanie Crow.
I could go on but suffice it to say anything he says is not allowed. Even if it is in mainstream media.

Again only if what he said is backed up by an actual law enforcement source.

Here is the documentation on the Crow lawsuit
The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals Ruling from 2010 which overrules Dougie's decision from 2004.

http://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2010/01/14/05-55467.pdf

Retired judge slams Crowe case

ESCONDIDO: Retired judge slams police conduct in Crowe case

www.courant.com

ESCONDIDO: Crowe family settles civil rights lawsuit for $7.25 million

Nearly 14 years after Stephanie Crowe was stabbed to death inher Escondido bedroom, her family agreed to a $7.25 millionsettlement with the cities of Escondido and Oceanside for what oneappeals cou…

www.sandiegouniontribune.com

"A federal trial judge in San Diego dismissed the bulk of the civil rights suit in 2004. But six years later, the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals revived the lawsuit, finding that Escondido police violated the civil rights of Crowe and his friends during “hours of grueling, psychologically abusive interrogations.”

The above links come from a great YouTube creator called Scientific Skeptic. If you go to this video there are more links describing the interrogation tools used by Chris and others in the Crow case,

Because Chris mistakenly named the wrong man on my YouTube channel and never told me to take down the false information I made this apology video when I discovered what happened,
Here is the apology video I had to make because of what Chris said on my Livestream.

The glove that Chris found was not there on the day of the Moscow Idaho murders

The MOB Crew has a great video showing the ground the day of the killing where the glove was found later in the month. On that day the glove was not there. Go to @2:35 of this video

I am not suggesting Chris did not legitimately find the glove. Just showing you it has nothing to do with the case. I will be shocked if Chris updates the story about the glove.

For those of you who know me this is an extremely unusual step for me to take. This is how strongly I feel. I was lied to but more importantly, because of Chris' actions, people's lives were threatened in the Summer Wells case.

Please do not discuss this post on this thread. If you have any questions please email me at websleuthsvideos@gmail.com
Tricia

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN REMINDER:

It is okay for members to discuss Visual Snow Syndrome because it was referenced by BK himself in his social media. Also, iirc, a BK family member had referred to him having or possibly having OCD. Those two conditions may be discussed because they are sourced to the accused himself and to his family members.

What members can not discuss are other random mental health conditions beyond those specified above. None of us is in a position to diagnose the mental health of a person we have never met. Introducing various and sundry, potential diagnoses only serves to derail the thread with opinions, debate, unrelated personal anecdotes, etc that may end up not being remotely related to this case.

Thank you.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Speculation must be based on some known fact. Posts about a confidential informant are not based on known fact and it is at times being stated as fact.

Many posts have been removed. Please move on from that discussion.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN REMINDER:

As per TOS, general discussion of the death penalty is one issue that is not allowed. In our experience, it only leads to bickering over personal beliefs. It is a social justice issue that will never be resolved through discussion at Websleuths. Members may discuss it as it relates directly to the potential of it being on the table in this specific case.

Same with politicizing. Political discussion in any fashion is a violation of TOS. IOW, reference to the Dems/Reps, blues/reds, etc has no place in this discussion. Politicizing is one violation that may result in permanent Warning Points being assigned.

Please familiarize yourselves with TOS and post accordingly.

Thanks !!

 

[Sillybilly]

Pappa Rodger has now been mentioned by MSM (Dateline) so I think we can discuss. I have discussed the FB persona quite a bit. There are more articles than just Dateline, I believe.

The account was deleted after BK was arrested, but fell silent when he was arrested. I believe there were interactions between FB and the Latah County investigators.

Pappa Rodger is, I believe, the right spelling. Again, we don't really know, but the MSM is interested in it - and there was interest from LE in the account, as well.

IMO.

We approved discussion of the Pappa Rodger Reddit account back in January. (I'm not aware of a separate FB account.)

Just for the record going forward, it was specifically stated that the Pappa Rodger Reddit account was removed by Reddit prior to BK's arrest:

from: Bryan Kohberger believed to have joined online discussion groups

An admin of the group later clarified that despite Rodgers' apparent authority in the group, he was never an admin or moderator.

Kristine Cameron, wrote: 'He was on her and argued incessantly with people and said some really creepy stuff and posted similar questions to Bryan's crime questions.

'We removed Pappa Rodgers at 7:10 the evening before Bryan's arrest. He created a group page and had 6 people in it.

'No one has heard from Pappa Rodger since the arrest.'

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

For those members who may have forgotten, discussion about the skinned dog is off limits:

ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 10

I know we can’t speculate but the dynamic of K and her ex’s relationship would be interesting to know in more detail. Who broke it off initially, why, was there hesitation from one of them about getting back together? She seemed to be starting a new life so was anyone feeling left behind? Was...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE

This post lands at random.

Okay folks, bleach was speculation so please move on from that discussion.

As for what unsavory types might read here and get hints about, I'm sure there are a zillion other things they would zero in on. We can't control the universe, and we've never yet heard a perp exclaim "I did it because I read it on Websleuths"

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

It says it right on the search warrants which have been unsealed. The search warrants to Amazon, eBay and other retailers were about KB's purchase of that brand/model knife. I'm sure BK regrets leaving that knife sheath on the bed....and leaving a paper trail for its purchase.

JMO

Bryan Kohberger Case: Is This the Weapon Used to Kill Idaho Students?

Over 60 search warrant applications filed by the Moscow Police Department have been unsealed over the past week and obtained by Inside Edition Digital, including six seeking information about the sale of a KA-BAR knife.

www.insideedition.com

The warrants instructed each retailer to provide information about any individual who had purchased a KA-BAR Full Size US Marine Corps Fighting Knife or a KA-BAR 1217S.

The KA-BAR 1217S is a leather sheath for holding the 1217 model, and is stamped with the words "KA-BAR" and "USMC," the abbreviation for the United States Marine Corps.

Investigators did not find a murder weapon when they discovered the bodies of Kaylee Goncalves, Madison Mogen, Xana Kernoddle, and Ethan Chapin.

Cpl. Brett Payne of the Moscow Police Department wrote in his affidavit however that he did find "a tan leather knife sheath laying on the bed" next to one victim.

"The sheath was later processed and had 'Ka-Bar' 'USMC' and the United States Marine Corps eagle globe and anchor insignia stamped on the outside of it," Cpl. Payne stated in that affidavit.

The warrant was dated 11/26. That's before BK was even on their radar, so the warrant actually doesn't say that. The recently unsealed warrant was sealed on 12/14. It doesn't have BK's name anywhere on it.

Additionally, the PCA which was written AFTER the Amazon inventory was collected and entered into evidence, makes no mention of the Amazon purchase.

IMO, this warrant was before the cops had even heard BK's name and IF it had returned evidence of BK having purchased this knife, it would have been in the PCA.

 

[MyBelle]

The warrant was dated 11/26. That's before BK was even on their radar, so the warrant actually doesn't say that. The recently unsealed warrant was sealed on 12/14. It doesn't have BK's name anywhere on it.

Additionally, the PCA which was written AFTER the Amazon inventory was collected and entered into evidence, makes no mention of the Amazon purchase.

IMO, this warrant was before the cops had even heard BK's name and IF it had returned evidence of BK having purchased this knife, it would have been in the PCA.

LE had a description of the suspect very early on as well as a description of the car.
That's how criminal investigations work.

JMO

Shocking court documents reveal police began suspecting Kohberger less than 2 weeks after Idaho murders

Newly obtained court documents reveal that authorities investigating the University of Idaho student killings had been keeping a close eye on suspect Bryan Kohberger well before his identity was released to the public.

www.fox13seattle.com

According to court documents unsealed on Jan. 5, authorities had a suspect description quite early in the investigation, and Kohberger matched it on Nov. 29 – more than a month before the nation knew his identity.

 

[schooling]

LE had a description of the suspect very early on as well as a description of the car.
That's how criminal investigations work.

JMO

Shocking court documents reveal police began suspecting Kohberger less than 2 weeks after Idaho murders

Newly obtained court documents reveal that authorities investigating the University of Idaho student killings had been keeping a close eye on suspect Bryan Kohberger well before his identity was released to the public.

www.fox13seattle.com

According to court documents unsealed on Jan. 5, authorities had a suspect description quite early in the investigation, and Kohberger matched it on Nov. 29 – more than a month before the nation knew his identity.

Exactly!

Plus, this is how investigations work. You have a hypothesis. You attempt to prove it. If the path leads to a dead end you pursue another avenue. And most of the time that's all happening simultaneously.

Some folks want to chastise the prosecution for not overturning every stone as a miscarriage of justice (not thorough enough) WHILE simultaneously pointing to examples of prosecutors turning over too many stones as a sign of a weak case (too thorough).

You can't have it both ways.

The Sentra is a perfect example. BK defenders are currently pointing to LEs (reportedly) initial interest in a Sentra as a sign of reasonable doubt (nonsense IMO). But If LE had a cause to but had not looked into a Sentra...BK's defense team would still be pointing to that as part of a case for reasonable doubt.

You're damned if you do, youre damned if you don't.

It's classic misdirection and noise. Look everywhere but here.

MOO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

LE had a description of the suspect very early on as well as a description of the car.
That's how criminal investigations work.

JMO

Shocking court documents reveal police began suspecting Kohberger less than 2 weeks after Idaho murders

Newly obtained court documents reveal that authorities investigating the University of Idaho student killings had been keeping a close eye on suspect Bryan Kohberger well before his identity was released to the public.

www.fox13seattle.com

According to court documents unsealed on Jan. 5, authorities had a suspect description quite early in the investigation, and Kohberger matched it on Nov. 29 – more than a month before the nation knew his identity.

That still doesn't mean that it's proof that BK bought a knife from Amazon. That hasn't been proven or confirmed.

IMO, there's a lot more here that we don't know, which is why that warrant was sealed in the first place. I'm actually not convinced it was BK. I think if it was, we'd know about it by now. It was sealed (and remained sealed) for a reason, IMO.

 

[wary]

That still doesn't mean that it's proof that BK bought a knife from Amazon. That hasn't been proven or confirmed.

IMO, there's a lot more here that we don't know, which is why that warrant was sealed in the first place. I'm actually not convinced it was BK. I think if it was, we'd know about it by now. It was sealed (and remained sealed) for a reason, IMO.




Huh? I'm not seeing anyone saying prosecutors turning over too many stones as a sign of a weak case. I'm not sure how that would even make sense.

I agree that it doesn’t make sense—but I believe we’ve seen it a lot.

MOO

 

[maconrich]

I'll admit that I've relied on others to do deep dives into the search warrants, but going thru them again (now), I'm not seeing anything that catches my eye as different / new or as something I've not already seen (when going thru them before). Am I completely missing new information that was released??

Edited to add: meaning new information unsealed / unredacted from search warrants

And Edited again (because I love to edit!) I didn't see any names listed or associated with any of the knife or sheath warrants. Not even with Amazon.

 

[katydid23]

Those links are irrelevant to what we're talking about. We're not talking about ancient undisturbed DNA nor blood DNA. We're talking about DNA of people in a party house. When you have people constantly coming in and out of your home, the chances DNA left by some visitor on a table or on a lamp survives 6 months and hundreds of party-goers later is very unlikely, IMO.

Why do you keep saying 6 months? Are you saying they hadn't had parties there more recently than 6 months previously?

Many were saying there were parties continuously, and quite recently.

 

[MyBelle]

Exactly!

Plus, this is how investigations work. You have a hypothesis. You attempt to prove it. If the path leads to a dead end you pursue another avenue. And most of the time that's all happening simultaneously.

Some folks want to chastise the prosecution for not overturning every stone as a miscarriage of justice (not thorough enough) WHILE simultaneously pointing to examples of prosecutors turning over too many stones as a sign of a weak case (too thorough).

You can't have it both ways.

The Sentra is a perfect example. BK defenders are currently pointing to LEs (reportedly) initial interest in a Sentra as a sign of reasonable doubt (nonsense IMO). But If LE had a cause to but had not looked into a Sentra...BK's defense team would still be pointing to that as part of a case for reasonable doubt.

You're damned if you do, youre damned if you don't.

It's classic misdirection and noise. Look everywhere but here.

MOO

BBM. Absolutely true!

I remember when this case first happened and LE really weren't saying anything publicly because they didn't want to jeopardize the investigation. I know it was frustrating for the victim families and the University students who were terrified for their own safety.

This was an incredibly heinous crime and BK is right where he belongs. LE and the DA have done an excellent job!!!

JMO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Exactly!

Plus, this is how investigations work. You have a hypothesis. You attempt to prove it. If the path leads to a dead end you pursue another avenue. And most of the time that's all happening simultaneously.

Some folks want to chastise the prosecution for not overturning every stone as a miscarriage of justice (not thorough enough) WHILE simultaneously pointing to examples of prosecutors turning over too many stones as a sign of a weak case (too thorough).

You can't have it both ways.

The Sentra is a perfect example. BK defenders are currently pointing to LEs (reportedly) initial interest in a Sentra as a sign of reasonable doubt (nonsense IMO). But If LE had a cause to but had not looked into a Sentra...BK's defense team would still be pointing to that as part of a case for reasonable doubt.

You're damned if you do, youre damned if you don't.

It's classic misdirection and noise. Look everywhere but here.

Since you edited your post with more info, I'll address the point you brought up.

The Sentra: it isn't that LE looked into "a" Sentra. That would have been fine. It's that LE thought the car WAS a Sentra. There's a big difference in those two things. A Sentra and an Elantra have way too many differences to be mistaken for one another. So the only way they could mistake an Elantra for a Sentra, IMO, is if they didn't have clear video. And if they didn't have clear video, then a case can be made that they don't know if it's an Elantra after all that's on that video. "If you initially thought it was a Sentra, what makes you so sure it's an Elantra? Or did you settle on an Elantra after you knew that's what Kohberger drove?" I also added the caveat in the earlier post that if they determined it was an Elantra based on OTHER video, that was fine. But if they use the same exact video and say Sentra first, then change to Elantra, I can absolutely see room for doubt.


MOO.

 

[Ksfarmer8]

The warrant was dated 11/26. That's before BK was even on their radar, so the warrant actually doesn't say that. The recently unsealed warrant was sealed on 12/14. It doesn't have BK's name anywhere on it.

Additionally, the PCA which was written AFTER the Amazon inventory was collected and entered into evidence, makes no mention of the Amazon purchase.

IMO, this warrant was before the cops had even heard BK's name and IF it had returned evidence of BK having purchased this knife, it would have been in the PCA.

The so called "proof" for the knife purchase from Amazon comes from the May 19 Dateline program about 30 minutes in. Dateline mentions the purchase and says that Kohberger took the knife with him when he went to WA. I am not aware of any documents "proof" stating about the knife purchase, just the Dateline reporting.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

The so called "proof" for the knife purchase from Amazon comes from the May 19 Dateline program about 30 minutes in. Dateline mentions the purchase and says that Kohberger took the knife with him when he went to WA. I am not aware of any documents "proof" stating about the knife purchase, just the Dateline reporting.

That's what I'm familiar with too, and I don't buy anything the media puts out about this case without confirmation from LE. But the poster above said added this link to one of their posts.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/022823%20Order%20to%20Seal%20and%20Redact%20-%20Amazon.pdf

 

[jepop]

They do seem opposite and confusing.

The initial motion to compel IMO has dragged on too long. Nice to see that the second one is being dealt with quickly by JJJ.

The motion to stay was a request for a temporary stay.

From the motion:
Mr. Kohberger’s request to stay proceedings until the grand jury record is prepared and he has adequate time to contest the indictment should be granted.

The Judge has already ordered extra time for the D to respond once they receive the GJ materials. When that was ordered I thought that meant the judge agreed with the D getting the GJ "materials" not just the proceedings.

View attachment 430637

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051923%20Order%20to%20Enlarge%20Time%20to%20File%20Pretrial%20Motions.pdf

I agree Tuesday will be interesting:

Grand Jury proceedings
Grand Jury Materials
Motion to Compel
Motion to compel 2

The D also wanted the Motion to Stay on Jan 27th.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/061323%20Notice%20of%20Hearing%20-%20Def%20Motion%20for%20an%20Exception%20or%20In%20Alternative%20to%20Extend%20Time%20for%20Compliance.pdf

I don't think the motion for exception or extension of time to comply with alibi demand is on the docket yet either.

There hasn't been a ruling on the nondissemination order yet. They had a pool camera at the other hearings. Hoping that this hearing will be handled the same.

MOO

RBBM: I was curious about Motion to Compel timing and perception of a delay or it being otherwise addressed in a sluggish fashion. I went through the docs and did not find any untimely delays by any parties but rather what appears to be a confluence of circumstances. Added to this we don't know what items have indeed been handed over by the State since the initial Motion to Compel. Moo

*4th May: Initial Motion to Compel.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/050423%20Motion%20to%20Compel%20Discovery.pdf

*11th May: Notice of Remote Hearing re Motion to Compel - for 22nd May.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051123%20Notice%20of%20Remote%20Hearing%20CR.pdf

*12th May: State's Detailed Response to Motion to Compel.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051223%20States%20Response%20to%20Defendants%20Motion%20to%20Compel%20Discovery.pdf

*19th May: Defense Motion for Enlargement of Time to File
".. pretrial motions of at least twentyeight days from the receipt of the requested
grand jury materials and other discovery materials previously requested."

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051923%20Motion%20to%20Enlarge%20Time%20to%20File%20Pretrial%20Motions%20and%20Memorandum%20in%20Support.pdf

*19th May: Order to Enlarge Time to File Pre-trial Motions.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051923%20Order%20to%20Enlarge%20Time%20to%20File%20Pretrial%20Motions.pdf

*23rd May: Minutes from Motion to Compel/scheduling hearing held on 22nd May

p3 https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/052323 Court Minutes - Scheduling Conference.pdf

"10:50 Court addressed the Defendant's Motion to Compel, as well as Defendant's Motion Requesting Release of Grand Jury Materials Under Qualified Protective Order and Motion to Make Available the Record of All Proceedings of the Grand Jury Pursuant to I.C.R.6.2. Court noted it granted Defendant's Motion to Enlarge Time to File Pretrial Motions and Memorandum in Support.
10:51 Ms. Taylor moved to set a hearing on Motion to Compel and subsequent motions for the week of June 26th. There being no objection, Court set a Motion to Compel hearing for June 27,2023, at 1:30 p.m.10:52 Mr. Thompson noted it had not received copies of the other two motions, but will be prepared to address them on June 27, 2023."