Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #179

[katydid23]

You're worried the defense is being clever?

'Clever' as in finding a loophole in order to feed misleading and distorted info to their jury pool.

 

[Boxer]

What I was wondering is this - how could anyone have records of when a device was turned on and off, into and out of airplane mode, date and time specific... from 7 years ago, no less? What method would be used to store such device usage info, where would it be stored, for what purpose, and by whom?

All phone data must have been saved from the geofence - 5 miles in all directions IIRC.

The nearest tower is just on the other side of Ron L.'s property.

 

[sunshineray]

Just a recap on Liggett and Holeman’s depositions, FM Pg 129

BBM

“Part V- Richard Allen has no ties to Odinism or any Religious Cult and has no ties to the crime scene.”

“Tony Liggett has testified under oath that there is no DNA linking Richard Allen to the crime scene.184 Liggett further has testified that he is unaware of anything that links Richard to the crime through his phone, computers or electronics.185
Liggett has further testified that he is unaware of any evidence that links Richard Allen to any weird religious cult group.186

Jerry Holeman has testified to the following: There is no DNA linking Richard Allen to the crime scene.187
No data extracted from Richard Allen’s phone connects him to the murders.188 No data extracted from Libby’s phone connected Richard the murders. 189 There is no evidence that Richard Allen is or was connected to any other suspects in the case.190 There is no evidence found on social media that connects Richard Allen to the murders.191
There is no evidence extracted from Richard Allen’s computers that connects him to the murders. 192
There is no fingerprint evidence that connects Richard Allen to the murders.193”

Since it is a crime for LE to lie in a deposition, and we are LE friendly here, shouldn’t we believe them?? JMO

FINAL DRAFT - 9.17 at 6.30 pm - Delphi Franks brief.pdf | PDF Host

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There are many deceptions in the defense's FM as well as untruths. It's kind of like a witness that gets on the stand and lies. After that it's hard to believe anything they say because who knows what's the truth or fabrications and spin. I'd caution everyone that taking the defense's words at face value is risky. We've not read the depositions they've cited. AJMO

 

[rogue ant]

Yes well maybe not his main number but there will be stuff on one or more burners. MOO

Is there evidence that RA was using burner phone(s) ?

 

[katydid23]

Is that really either's job, though? I thought the P's job was to prove RA did it, the D's job is to make them do that. Overly simplistic, sure. Like me.

Technically the prosecution's job is to find the TRUTH.

IF in the process of trying to prove RA's guilt, they find solid evidence of his innocence, they MUST say so to the court.

However, if the defense finds solid evidence of his guilt, they don't need to say anything to anyone about that.

 

[Boxer]

Still looking for the 2017 photos of him with poofy hair, eyes that are definitely not blue, and no facial hair.

What photos? Missed any that were in the inmediate time frame.

 

[Boxer]

Technically the prosecution's job is to find the TRUTH.

IF in the process of trying to prove RA's guilt, they find solid evidence of his innocence, they MUST say so to the court.

However, if the defense finds solid evidence of his guilt, they don't need to say anything to anyone about that.

MOO They do, and elaborate evasive techniques are used for them to "not know."

 

[susiQ]

However, if the defense finds solid evidence of his guilt, they don't need to say anything to anyone about that.

RSABBM
Although this may be true, you would think that everything they are having to deal with, such as having all their filings denied without a hearing, no funds for experts while the P has the mother load, you would think they would have gladly encouraged RA to cut himself a deal, roll on anyone else involved and get this mess over with. But that’s not what they are doing. They continue to put forward a defence because they believe he is innocent. Two alternate attorneys too! They strongly feel RA made a false confession due to the circumstances he found himself in at Westville, likely in a poor mental state and wanting the abuse (tasing) to stop. Thankfully, he was eventually moved (although not technically where he should be) and appears to look and feel somewhat better.

It is odd to me that so many believe the D are unscrupulous cads cashing in on all that money (a measley $100 per hr) they have to fight to even get JG to release! If I were RA’s attorney and this is what I had to go through, I would gladly have been disqualified and called it a day IF I KNEW my client was guilty of brutally murdering two young girls.
ed:sp
JMHO

 

[katydid23]

RSABBM
Although this may be true, you would think that everything they are having to deal with, such as having all their filings denied without a hearing,

If the courts had a hearing for EVERY motion filed, we would be even more behind than ever. It doesn't work like that.

no funds for experts while the P has the mother load,

The P does not have a motherload. Carroll County is a relatively poor area. Here is a City Council meeting that was called in order to budget some of the high expenses needed for the upcoming trial:

They seemed like they were just eeking out some meager payments, not at all throwing generous amounts to the prosecution.

you would think they would have gladly encouraged RA to cut himself a deal, roll on anyone else involved and get this mess over with. But that’s not what they are doing. They continue to put forward a defence because they believe he is innocent.

We don't KNOW that for sure. ALL defense attorneys say that.

Two alternate attorneys too! They strongly feel RA made a false confession due to the circumstances he found himself in at Westville, likely in a poor mental state and wanting the abuse (tasing) to stop. Thankfully, he was eventually moved (although not technically where he should be) and appears to look and feel somewhat better.

It is odd to me that so many believe the D are unscrupulous cads cashing in on all that money (a measley $100 per hr)

According to the video above , the prosecution also makes a measly 100 bucks an hour.

The D may be cashing in, but not from the 100 bucks an hour. They may be expecting to make a name for themselves from the visibility of this hifi profile case. If they succeed in getting RA freed, they can expect to rake in top dollar in future cases.

they have to fight to even get JG to release! If I were RA’s attorney and this is what I had to go through, I would gladly have been disqualified and called it a day IF I KNEW my client was guilty of brutally murdering to young girls.

Defense attorneys CANNOT 'call it a day' and walk away, even if they knew the client was guilty. Guilt or innocence has no bearing on their duties as a defense attorney. Our Justice System is based upon ALL defendants receiving a vigorous defense.

JMHO

 

[Caylee Advocate]

@TL4S So much all of this!

It is a fundamental principle of our justice system that we are innocent until proven guilty. I'm not talking about people discussing this; I have zero problem with people debating one's culpability. But as a civilized society, we are above throwing people in cages indefinitely prior to a trial (I would hope). Time is one of those things in life you don't get back (life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness). Taking it from someone shouldn't be a trivial matter.

As far as criticism of the defense, well, it is what it is. Most persons don't have a job where you can have your life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness removed from you for a mistake on the job. These attorneys, on both sides, can lose their ability to practice their profession permanently and be thrown in jail. It's not a game to them. They take pride in their work and really believe in what they are doing.

Spoken like a true professional. Thank goodness for our constitution!

 

[susiQ]

According to the video above , the prosecution also makes a measly 100 bucks an hour.

At least NM knows he’s getting a paycheck at the end of the week without having to wait for JG to grant it. And, lots of buckso deluxos for his experts. His paycheck likely comes automatic deposit. No waiting for him to pay his mortgage. The D should be so lucky.

Defense attorneys CANNOT 'call it a day' and walk away, even if they knew the client was guilty.

Well, these defence attorneys could have called it a day, courtesy of JG had they accepted her disqualification without a proper hearing. They didn’t. They fought back. They had to go to SCOIN to be reinstated as RA’s attorneys. Good on them!
JMO

 

[Boxer]

At least NM knows he’s getting a paycheck at the end of the week without having to wait for JG to grant it. And, lots of buckso deluxos for his experts. His paycheck likely comes automatic deposit. No waiting for him to pay his mortgage. The D should be so lucky.

Well, these defence attorneys could have called it a day, courtesy of JG had they accepted her disqualification without a proper hearing. They didn’t. They fought back. They had to go to SCOIN to be reinstated as RA’s attorneys. Good on them!
JMO

They will write a book win or lose

 

[snooptroop88]

At least NM knows he’s getting a paycheck at the end of the week without having to wait for JG to grant it. And, lots of buckso deluxos for his experts. His paycheck likely comes automatic deposit. No waiting for him to pay his mortgage. The D should be so lucky.

Well, these defence attorneys could have called it a day, courtesy of JG had they accepted her disqualification without a proper hearing. They didn’t. They fought back. They had to go to SCOIN to be reinstated as RA’s attorneys. Good on them!
JMO

What's the basis for her denying them/D? Does anyone know?

 

[susiQ]

They will write a book win or lose

I hope they do!

 

[Caylee Advocate]

What about the victims families and friends do they not also have rights to be allowed the freedom of knowing that the man accused of killing their daughters is locked up and not a threat to them?

Or should a man accused of killing 2 teenage girls still be around children and working in the local CVS?!!

The threshold to charge him and stick him on trial must of been met so he is in the right place until trial. He is deemed a danger to society.



You mean in the same way he stole Libby and Abby’s entire life’s ?

Mooo

I would also think that the families of these girls would want the right person/persons to be convicted. We can't know their thoughts on RA=BG= ACCUSED/NOT CONVICTED.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

I hope they do!

Of course - they cant let go of the big one of their careers.

 

[Boxer]

I would also think that the families of these girls would want the right person/persons to be convicted. We can't know their thoughts on RA=BG= ACCUSED/NOT CONVICTED.

JMO

MOO RA is BG. He killed the girls.
Is currently benefiting from a movement among defense attorneys who are mounting defenses everywhere based in attacking process.

 

[susiQ]

What's the basis for her denying them/D? Does anyone know?

Good question! Why indeed?? She “feels” it’s unnecessary? I mean, why should the D have experts just because the P can have them? That would make it a fair playing field and we couldn’t have that now, could we?

 

[susiQ]

Of course - they cant let go of the big one of their careers.

They didn’t ask to be picked for this case, just in case people have forgotten that fact. I for one am glad they were. RA deserves a robust defence. JMO

 

[Boxer]

Good question! Why indeed?? She “feels” it’s unnecessary? I mean, why should the D have experts just because the P can have them? That would make it a fair playing field and we couldn’t have that now, could we?

Would need to see their request details. These are unethical attorneys.