Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #183

[layer]

That round is so mysterious!

It is! That's why I got excited. Doh
I'm still digging, I wish all the documents came with markups, highlights and color-codes.

 

[Salah11]

I believe RA has alcohol and anger management issues. JMO

Yes I wonder if we will hear that he was abusive in the marriage as from the little I have heard so far he seems to have a big drink problem imo

 

[snooptroop88]

Can you help me out with this?
What are you referring to as far as matching the bullet in the wooden keepsake box to the bullet recovered at the scene? Matched how? Were they somehow traced to the same mfg lot number? Or both had some unusual primer sealant? Do you know what brand of ammo the recovered round was? I spent over an hour trying to get this stuff straight and it's still an enigma to me, any help is appreciated.

They match?? I've looked all over for that, but not that recently, I never saw they actually matched. That's pretty big imo.

(snipped)
The problem here is that the studies which have been used to peer review comparisons of these striations (often called toolmarks) have used spent cartridges, as opposed to unfired, as in RA's case. The chamber striations change and become more pronounced when the pressure within the firing chamber rises as a gun is fired. Thus, the comparison becomes less reliable. Further, most comparisons use not one type of striation mark for identification, such as some combination of the four types mentioned above, which also increases the reliability of the comparison.

I get what you're saying here, and agreed this makes the evidence seem weaker if they had only the single bullet from the scene. But if there were any doubt about the evidentiary strength of the markings, it's dispelled in my mind by the fact that the bullet at the scene matches a bullet actually in RA's possession. If that "keepsake" bullet matches in any meaningful way at all (meaning it doesn't just "look the same," "same size," something ridiculously vague), that's pretty significant, MOO. And I see people discussing this a lot & trying to follow. I still don't understand why someone who's not a diehard hunter has a "keepsake bullet." In a wooden box. In a dresser drawer. In the master bedroom?? If it matches to the one at the CS in any meaningful way, that's a "whoa." MOO.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Interview with Deputy public Defender for Tippecanoe County, Shay Hughes.

Deputy Public Defender Previews Upcoming Richard Allen Hearing

Deputy public Defender for Tippecanoe County says what to expect for Delphi Double homicide suspect, Richard Allen's upcoming hearing.

www.wlfi.com

(snips)
Depending on which way Special Judge Fran Gull rules in the hearing, Hughes says it could have a massive impact on the upcoming trial scheduled to start May 13. He says her ruling could possibly delay it.
...
"If the state's motion in Limine is granted in full, that really limits the defense that Richard Allen can put. I don't know what he would intend on doing, if he'd seek an interlocutory appeal," he said. "Based on the courts ruling, it would have a tremendous impact."
...
"Motive has always been found to be relevant. If he can provide a motive for these individuals, I think it should be fair game that he gets to present it," Hughes said.
...

 

[AugustWest]

They match?? I've looked all over for that, but not that recently, I never saw they actually matched. That's pretty big imo.

I get what you're saying here, and agreed this makes the evidence seem weaker if they had only the single bullet from the scene. But if there were any doubt about the evidentiary strength of the markings, it's dispelled in my mind by the fact that the bullet at the scene matches a bullet actually in RA's possession. If that "keepsake" bullet matches in any meaningful way at all (meaning it doesn't just "look the same," "same size," something ridiculously vague), that's pretty significant, MOO. And I see people discussing this a lot & trying to follow. I still don't understand why someone who's not a diehard hunter has a "keepsake bullet." In a wooden box. In a dresser drawer. In the master bedroom?? If it matches to the one at the CS in any meaningful way, that's a "whoa." MOO.

If the round at the scene matches any ammunition that was in his possession, that would be strong evidence. If the prosecution could show that the round matched the same batch as that found at his home, along with chain of custody, then yeah, he's cooked.

The "keepsake bullet" doesn't mean much to me. Why does anyone do strange things? Why did my mother decide to make four trillion quilts in her life? Why can't my buddy go to sleep at night without putting his shoes on the left side of the bed? The only answer I have come up with yet is that we humans are weird.

 

[layer]

Why did my mother decide to make four trillion quilts in her life?

Clearly because she was AWESOME!

 

[WildHuncher]

I only really comment about evidentiary rulings, because I like that stuff and encounter a ton of them in my area of practice. I seriously have zero input on RA's guilt or innocence. Of course I have heard "facts" of the case, but until they pass the reliability test to be admitted as evidence, I take them all with heavy skepticism. Others don't and it doesn't bother me at all. It's never an argument in here for me; I have enough argument in my daily life to get my fill. I just want to see a fair trial with a fair outcome. That, to me, is justice.

I get all the differing viewpoints. We are all ready for trial to get underway, and many have information overload at this point.

I have really enjoyed discussing these issues with you @WildHuncher, as I have with everyone else here.

Your input is much appreciated.

It’s also useful to see the arguments from people with (seemingly) very high thresholds for “beyond reasonable.”

The whole thing gives some insight into what happens in a jury room, where I have actually been but once. (I have seen Twelve Angry Men, though. And the Archie Bunker episode variation with Edith as Henry Fonda.).

 

[layer]

Yes I wonder if we will hear that he was abusive in the marriage as from the little I have heard so far he seems to have a big drink problem imo

Everybody has anger/marital/substance problems; I'm most interested in RA's computer history. If he did this it didn't come out of nowhere, and it likely didn't end there.

 

[layer]

If it matches to the one at the CS in any meaningful way, that's a "whoa."

100%
And there are several ways that could happen, some that aren't obvious. For example, let's say RA used some hand lotion. His nicely moisturized hands handled ammo in a box he just opened, maybe he had special plans for this ammo. Maybe he was even smart, he donned gloves to avoid fingerprints and DNA.
The odds of 2 bullets that look identical, same mfg, same primers, same projectile choices, with the same odd hand lotion residue would have to be astronomical. If you find the same lotion at RA's house you might just toss it aside because he's already done. Plenty of other things leave chemical residue, that was just an example but you get the idea.

 

[layer]

I have promised to eat my favorite pink golf visor if that happens. Hope it doesn't come to that.

Poor visor, go Nick!

 

[mickey2942]

I am waiting for his "incompetence" declaration. No trial until he gets "better'.

 

[FromGermany1]

All this article says is < The Carroll County Sheriff’s Office confirmed that deputies were sent>

Did the reaction to the Sulfites cause you to lash out to the point that the SO could have been called out for a “domestic incident”?

RA had CCSO response to his home which there was a need to “keep the peace”.

RA may have resisted his wife’s intent to take him to the hospital if she was possibly fearing alcohol poisoning from excessive drinking considering the 3 am time of the SO response thus the need to “keep the peace” imo. Alcohol Poisoning: Get Emergency Room Help Immediately

I’m familiar with wine and sulfites but the only possibility of “bad juice” in US I’ve ever heard of is from illegally produced moonshine.

[...]
Richard Allen’s home in 2015 for a “domestic” incident.
[…]
Sheriff Leazenby said no law enforcement action was involved other than responding to “keep the peace.”
[...]
Deputies responded to Delphi suspect’s home for domestic issue to ‘keep the peace’



all imo

What if he in 2015 in a very drunk condition suddenly confessed to a double murder of 2 little girls, then was eating some news magazine. Something crazy like that because of his guilty conscience (Iowa??). - Of course only wild speculation.
It wasn't said, police met the ambulance or emergency doctor at RA's home, as if KA had called someone like that before and RA had refused the treatment. The sequence was: first call to 911 police, then mental hospital - afaik.
In case of alcohol poisoning I don't see a reason to have police at the home.

 

[CCJD]

What if he in 2015 in a very drunk condition suddenly confessed to a double murder of 2 little girls, then was eating some news magazine. Something crazy like that because of his guilty conscience (Iowa??). - Of course only wild speculation.
It wasn't said, police met the ambulance or emergency doctor at RA's home, as if KA had called someone like that before and RA had refused the treatment. The sequence was: first call to 911 police, then mental hospital - afaik.
In case of alcohol poisoning I don't see a reason to have police at the home.

BBM

The sheriff said Allen was allegedly drunk and his wife took him to a Lafayette-area hospital for a medical evaluation.

Deputies responded to Delphi suspect’s home for domestic issue to ‘keep the peace’

MEXICO, Ind. — The Carroll County Sheriff’s Office confirmed that deputies were sent to Delphi murder suspect Richard Allen’s home in 2015 for a “domestic” incident. The she…

fox59.com

 

[FromGermany1]

'bullet matching unspent round found in wooden keepsake box located on dresser in between closet of the MBR'

Makes sense, if there had been another crime before 2017, where RA had intimidated with a gun but murdered with sharp objects. Maybe, he stored a souvenir.
If RA is BG and the killer of the Delphi girls, we agree (I think at least), that it wasn't his first "rodeo".

 

[Salah11]

Everybody has anger/marital/substance problems; I'm most interested in RA's computer history. If he did this it didn't come out of nowhere, and it likely didn't end there.

I obviously know very different people

That’s quite a broad statement and certainly isn’t what I have experienced in life.

The problem is we have so many years that passed between the murders and him being caught stuff like that could of been deleted long again and he could of had multiple computers in that time.

 

[photographer4]

BBM

The sheriff said Allen was allegedly drunk and his wife took him to a Lafayette-area hospital for a medical evaluation.

Deputies responded to Delphi suspect’s home for domestic issue to ‘keep the peace’

MEXICO, Ind. — The Carroll County Sheriff’s Office confirmed that deputies were sent to Delphi murder suspect Richard Allen’s home in 2015 for a “domestic” incident. The she…

fox59.com

If he didn’t need to be restrained and or transported by Le in a squad car or taken by ambulance and she was able to get him there herself - then he couldn’t have been that wildly out of hand in his behavior in my view. I wonder if he was threatening suicide maybe? Or having some issues with paranoia? Of course we don’t know what went on or even if he actually DID attend hospital. All we know is police attended and she told them she would have him seen at the hospital.

 

[girlhasnoname]

It's very likely I might not be fully understanding what NMcL is wanting eliminated, too. Here's from his Motion in Limine:

View attachment 501176

So perhaps this doesn't encompass all the phone data that's available. I just hope the judge allows the geofencing and any other phone evidence in. I really want to know where RA's phone was and if it was on during the time of the crimes!

Which phone though is the question I have, who is to say that the info given to DD was the correct phone? RA had over a dozen, also 2 pagers which were recovered during the SW. The State now knows what phones were pinging where.

If I were meeting up with the CO outside the local grocery store for providing information to rule me out as a suspect, I would definitely not have brought any phone that could be tied to the crimes. I do believe RA was smart enough to figure that out. He's sly like a fox, at least in his own mind.

All JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Honestly, given the stringent time limit on this trial it kind of makes sense to limit wild goose chases, hopefully they're cooking the right one.

The stringent timeline caused by the Defense pulling the trigger on the Motion for Speedy Trial might I add.

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

Everybody has anger/marital/substance problems; I'm most interested in RA's computer history. If he did this it didn't come out of nowhere, and it likely didn't end there.

That's a broad stroke you're painting by. Everybody does not have anger, marital or substance problems. I've never had to call LE on my hubs in a DV type situation or of feeling unsafe.

If RA had one call made to LE about his behavior, I'd bet there are many more than went unreported.

I am also interested in RA's computer history, but he had time to destroy the most incriminating IMO.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

One problem with that is you and I aren't actually experts, so how would we know the difference? What if the CS bullet juxtaposed with a test-fed round from another gun of same make and model are also exact matches? What about the same with a gun from a different make and model? The problem with the method is the control and the worry that bias will influence our decision. I don't have the answer obviously.

I believe the COC and rumors of the bullet being found days later, etc. were started on SM. I have no doubt those rumors will be put to rest in the State's case during trial, which is where it should be addressed IMO.

I do have to hand to NMcL and the State for not responding to all the accusations made by the Defense in this case. The State has remained professional and kept their information close. I'm sure it's been hard not to unleash their findings in response to these accusations, insinuations and some all out untruths alleged by the Defense.

We don't have much longer to find out thankfully.

JMO