Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #193

[sunshineray]

Seems Wala wanted RA sent to a correctional facility in New Castle that had Psychiatric care - her request was denied.

Didn't she also say on the stand, during the hearings, that she thought a few times that RA was faking his symptoms?

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I don't know what they do with alibis that they can't prove.

Alibis that can’t be proven are legally referred to as “not having an alibi”.

 

[Arkay]

Could have been part of staging the scene/murder. The killer(s) wanted evidence on there to be found?

IMO MOO theory

I admit I don’t know how murderers think, but I am unsure as to why a killer would intentionally want evidence to be found that would likely reveal his identity, or at the minimum provide many clues that would unravel the crime?

I don’t think the killer “suddenly remembered” LG had a phone. Possibly he did not realize she got any video? After the 18 minutes of movement post video, he took it from her and shut it down, never knowing that she captured a video of him, or an accomplice. I definitely do not believe he didn’t know she had one and therefore there was no overlooking it. The killer was likely well aware that these kids don’t go anywhere without their phone. JMHO

Oh, we agree, actually. I also am certain he knew they had phones.

What I find incredulous is that having located the phone, he would then leave it behind for LE to find. He would have to know a phone provides evidence of all kinds. Even had Libby not recorded his voice and moving image. Our phones are an ocean of information on everything we do.

JMO

 

[susiQ]

Could have been part of staging the scene/murder. The killer(s) wanted evidence on there to be found?

IMO MOO theory

My thoughts as well. I believe this murderer is a lot more cunning than most give him credit for. I believe there are accomplices, and that the one who orchestrated this may not have been on the bridge when they were taken DTH to wherever. It seems likely Libby died first with a horrific wound. Bled out very quickly. I wonder how long Abby lived thereafter. It has been said, her death came slowly. Sorry I don’t have a link, so MOO.

 

[sunshineray]

But that is @FrostedGlass ‘s point. There isn’t a witness. How can one prove an alibi if there is NO witness. He was home alone. KA at work. Maybe he didn’t have the phone he had in 2017 in 2022? Are there any phone records available? If not, they cannot prove his alibi. The question is, can the P disprove what RA has said, that he returned home after leaving the trails at 1:30 pm. Can the P put him at the trails during the alleged time of the murders? JMO

He instigated putting himself on the trails from 1:30 to 3:30 with his original interview shortly after the murders when it was very fresh in his memory. Why is this being challenged?

 

[Salah11]

Alibis that can’t be proven are legally referred to as “not having an alibi”.

That makes a lot of sense when you explain it like that

 

[StarryStarryNight]

He instigated putting himself on the trails from 1:30 to 3:30 with his original interview shortly after the murders when it was very fresh in his memory. Why is this being challenged?

If the defense can’t get RA off the bridge(which they can’t), they have to evoke time travel and change the timeline. That can’t be done either.

 

[sunshineray]

I don’t think the killer “suddenly remembered” LG had a phone. Possibly he did not realize she got any video? After the 18 minutes of movement post video, he took it from her and shut it down, never knowing that she captured a video of him, or an accomplice. I definitely do not believe he didn’t know she had one and therefore there was no overlooking it. The killer was likely well aware that these kids don’t go anywhere without their phone. JMHO

I think he heard it but couldn't tell where it was because it was under a body, muffled. He may even have pushed some leaves around looking for it, who knows? MO

 

[FrostedGlass]

Alibis that can’t be proven are legally referred to as “not having an alibi”.

It's been a long day.

 

[Salah11]

If the defense can’t get RA off the bridge(which they can’t), they have to evoke time travel and change the timeline. That can’t be done either.

Let’s not be hasty though, because a deer could have found an ejected bullet in RA’s rubbish and then wondered for a few miles and buried it in between two dead bodies for the police to find at a later date. I don’t understand why it then took another 5 years to arrest him and frame him when the Deer had done all the hard work but that’s just a minor quibble.


Does this not sound really plausible?!

Moo

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I know that we all have our opinions, and that's just the way it is...

But, Dr Wala was someone that RA confessed to.

At one point, RA asked Dr. Wala to phone his wife. During the phone call he told her that he killed the girls.
He even requested for the doctor to stay so that she could hear it. ( Something to that wording) KA apparently hung up on him.

He told the doctor, "She doesn't believe me."

His mom told him that he was being brainwashed and to stop.

This guy had accepted his savior and wanted to be cleansed from his sins. He had come to realize that this lifetime would not reunite him with his family. He wants to have the peace of mind that he will spend eternity with them.

Can anyone imagine the feeling that comes with wanting to come clean to the people that you have let down, that have supported you and be told that you are not believed?

That is probably a big part of his breakdown.

The testimony from Dr Wala is covered in MS coverage of the 3 days of hearings.

I could certainly see where that could cause someone to breakdown, with or without prior mental health issues. Will his lawyer not allow him to go ahead and plead guilty? I know the defense is charged with providing him with a vigorous defense. But at what point, is his right to plea infringed upon? I mean to ask, who is preventing him from pleading guilty? Is that state not satisfied that he's mentally stable?

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I also don't see any resemblance between RA and BG.

Adding to my own post that the sketches and video just seemed to muck up the whole thing... ok, the sketches. I still don't understand.

 

[Ravenmoon]

I could certainly see where that could cause someone to breakdown, with or without prior mental health issues. Will his lawyer not allow him to go ahead and plead guilty? I know the defense is charged with providing him with a vigorous defense. But at what point, is his right to plea infringed upon? I mean to ask, who is preventing him from pleading guilty? Is that state not satisfied that he's mentally stable?

I wish that I could answer that.
I honestly don't know.

 

[Salah11]

Adding to my own post that the sketches and video just seemed to muck up the whole thing... ok, the sketches. I still don't understand.

The Video is bad quality but it certainly doesn’t rule out RA as same height and fatness. He also has the short legs with the hanging bottoms and not forgetting he admits what he wore that day which was similar to BG.

 

[Cyber sleuth]

Here's the timeline for "Ricky's" meds. I sure hope there was some psych evaluation before they gave him involuntary injections of psychotropic medication.
(SNIP)
March 23, 2023: Allen was depressed and withdrawn and said he “was not straight in the head."
April 4, 2023: Allen suffered from insomnia, hopelessness, was suicidal, and stated “death would bring relief to him."
April 13, 2023: Allen was exhibiting “bizarre” behavior, including consuming his own feces, and was suffering from a “grave disability.” The prison psychologist ordered Allen receive an involuntary injection of psychotropic medication.
April 21, 2023: Allen’s thoughts were disjointed and he was saying “strange things.” Wala discussed that he might be considered incompetent to stand trial.
May 3, 2023: Allen said he wanted to confess details of the crime.
May 18, 2023: Allen receives another dose of psychotropic medication.
May 23, 2023: Allen diagnosed as suffering from stress-induced psychosis.
June 8, 2023: Allen’s depression “at its peak,” noted trembling, knees buckling.
June 16, 2023: Allen receives another dose of psychotropic medication.
Late June, 2023: Allen’s mental health improving.
October 2023: Allen was proclaiming his innocence.
Allen’s defense team claims the confessions fall within the timeframe of Allen’s severe psychosis diagnosed by prison psychologists.

Judge rules Delphi murders suspect Richard Allen to be moved to county jail

It is not yet known where Allen will be housed or when he will be moved to a new jail.

www.wthr.com

Just wanted to add that RA had a mental assessment scheduled at 10am on April 14th 2023 if you want to add that to the proposed timeline.

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

It’s on page 7 section 28 in States Response to Defense’s Emergency Motion to Modify Safekeeping order.

It also spells out his conditions if he were moved to Cass County in section 13 which may be of interest to some IMO.

Edit: had wrong year

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Do you have a link to where he's expressed a wish to plead guilty to his lawyers??

If he called his wife in the presence of Dr. W and confessed, who or what could be preventing him from pleading? As a defendant, that would be maddening not to have family believe you, and if the 'experts' don't either...

 

[sunshineray]

The Video is bad quality but it certainly doesn’t rule out RA as same height and fatness. He also has the short legs with the hanging bottoms and not forgetting he admits what he wore that day which was similar to BG.

I honestly think it does look like RA...for the things you mention and the angle of his shoulders too. It's his build to a tee, IMO

 

[GoBuckeyes]

The Video is bad quality but it certainly doesn’t rule out RA as same height and fatness. He also has the short legs with the hanging bottoms and not forgetting he admits what he wore that day which was similar to BG.

That's true. He did admit he wore something similar to BG. But I do wonder how many men of his age group wore something similar anytime they were outside in February? But now that I read about his confessions, it all seems moot, as long as he was sane when he confessed.

 

[Vern]

Can LE prove they were dead by 3:30? That is the question? JMO

Have they said this?

I'm sure they can IMO. The Sherriff has clearly stated that that is based on "evidence".
From the Sherriff's Presser (he's LE):

County Sheriff answers double homicide questions from readers - Carroll County Comet

It was announced there would be no press conference on the fourth anniversary of the murders of Liberty German and Abigail William, the two middle school students who went for a hike on the Monon High Bridge Trail in 2017 and did not return alive. Questions about the case from both the local...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

Q. It has been stated in a press conference that “it was all over by 3:30 on Feb 13.” This statement was based on what information?
A. Evidence. I do not recall a specific time though but rather a time line.

The timeline of course being the previous, "the girls were killed somewhere between 2:30 and 3:30pm on 13th February" from the 3 Day Hearings. And, IMO we now know that it is more likely very close to 18 minutes after they were abducted from the bridge based upon the "cease of all movement" of their cell phone.

During the Three Day hearings came this testimony on the "timeline" of the murders:

Terrifying new evidence on Delphi victim's last moments pins trial on phone

A CELL phone belonging to one of the Delphi murder victims will likely play a key role in their accused killer’s forthcoming trial, two experts say. Richard Allen, a 51-year-old married fathe…

www.the-sun.com

But during a three-day pretrial hearing last week, an abundance of new evidence and shocking details were shared for the first time.
Investigators shared their belief that Libby and Abby were abducted at 2:14 pm on February 13, 2017, and killed somewhere between 2:30 pm and 3:30 pm.
The timeline, in part, was put together by data gleaned from Libby's iPhone 6s – the same device she used to capture the chilling footage of her killer.

IMO, we'll get all the deets on that "evidence" at the trial. No wonder the Defence needs to move that timeline to the 14th. No alibi for their client who has admitted being at the place, at the time, in clothing very similar to the video and witnesses. I suspect they'd better button up his whereabouts at 0433hrs too if they want to try to go that route, just in case he returned to the scene to turn the cell pone "back on" (IMO - no one turned the cell phone back on).

Edited to add additional MSM refs for the "killed between 2:30 and 3:30pm on the 13th" timeline:

Judge again denies Delphi suspect Richard Allen's motion to dismiss

Special Judge Frances Gull says there's no evidence that prosecutors "acted in bad faith."

www.jconline.com

Delphi murders: What we know and don't know 5 years after Abby and Libby were killed

The Delphi murders of Abby Williams and Liberty German are unsolved. From Kegan Kline to Ron Logan , here are the latest Delphi murders updates.

www.indystar.com

 

[sunshineray]

If he called his wife in the presence of Dr. W and confessed, who or what could be preventing him from pleading? As a defendant, that would be maddening not to have family believe you, and is the 'experts' don't either...

And I believe, from Dr. W's testimony, that was when she referred him to his lawyers. It's only logical he probably did talk to them about wanting to confess. We know also from the hearings (IIRC it was ISP Harshman) that KA told him to stop talking and said she was calling his lawyers. MO