Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #197

[TTF14]

If the trial were broadcast, I think it would DECREASE the circus atmosphere as people would be content watching from home. Courtroom management would be easier if cameras were allowed, imo.

jmo

Absolutely. I agree 100%.

As always, JMO.

 

[sunshineray]

We actually don't know that for a fact. The court ruled that way, but it is still just opinion. Going crazy in solitary confinement and/or when given drugs that aren't appropriate is an actual thing. Myriad studies have been done about it, so it's not just a fabrication the defense team came up with. I'm not saying the defense team is right or that it's fact coming from them either, but I think the jury will understand it's possible for RA to have only started exhibiting signs of psychosis/mental illness due to his conditions in the prison he, IMO, never should have been in in the first place.

As always, JMO.

It's much more than just the judge's opinion. It's based in the law so it sets some parameters of the trial. RA was able-minded and voluntarily confessed to killing Libby and Abby. He also told what his motivation was in killing Libby and Abby. He also gave details only the killer knew of how he killed Libby and Abby. That's only a very small amount, that we know right now, of the information ISP Harshman testified to under oath at the pre-trial hearings. It's going to seem like a landslide when he testifies at trial. AJMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

We actually don't know that for a fact. The court ruled that way, but it is still just opinion. Going crazy in solitary confinement and/or when given drugs that aren't appropriate is an actual thing. Myriad studies have been done about it, so it's not just a fabrication the defense team came up with. I'm not saying the defense team is right or that it's fact coming from them either, but I think the jury will understand it's possible for RA to have only started exhibiting signs of psychosis/mental illness due to his conditions in the prison he, IMO, never should have been in in the first place.

As always, JMO.

RA was a productive citizen, held down a steady job, was financially secure with a paid off home, socialized at his favorite local pub and pool hall, enjoyed a long term marriage, traveled, and raised a successful daughter by all accounts.

He seems to have had some depression or anxiety at times in his life like a lot of people, but he still was able to maintain his normal life style prior to and after the murders.

The majority of RA's confessions and acting out of control started after him seeing first hand, with his own eyes in black and white, the State's evidence against him. I'm sure the details of the vicious murders would be enough to send anyone over the edge knowing they would soon be made public. He was seen by Mental and Physical personnel and treated for his safety and welfare during that time.

Even his own Defense commented on how cordial, helpful and engaged RA had been during his incarceration at Westville until April 3rd. I find that to be too coincidental. If they were so gravely concerned about RA's mental health prior, why didn't they order their own psych evaluation? They could/should have at any time.

RA's 'psychosis' started in April through roughly June 15th. I think it was brought on by extreme stress and anxiety over the State's facts and the realization that these horrible details would be made public, especially to his family.

None of this excuses or doesn't mean RA should not be held responsible for what he did to Abby and Libby on Feb 13th, 2017. RA=BG=Killer

#Justice4Abby&Libby

All JMO

 

[sunshineray]

IMO The judge, if it's within her power, will not allow the D to cast doubt. The P uses this often:
The probative value of ___'s testimony would be substantially outweighed by a danger of confusing the issues and misleading the jury. Ind. R. Evid. 403.

I believe the timeline will come into play and maybe Dr. Roland Kohr will be called to testify.
The D may try to impeach DD and ex-warden Galipeau.
The D will force the issue of RA's car being parked at the said place during stated hours.
The D will hammer on RA's imprisonment in Westville and Wabash.
The D may have surprises that we don't know about yet.

Of course, we have to consider what this judge will allow them to do.

Snipped and BBM for focus:

"Of course, we have to consider what this judge will allow them to do."

It's what any judge would allow because of the law. The SCOIN has ruled unanimously that JG is unbiased. I know she will follow the law. MO

 

[FrostedGlass]

If the trial were broadcast, I think it would DECREASE the circus atmosphere as people would be content watching from home. Courtroom management would be easier if cameras were allowed, imo.

jmo

The judge would have full control of the trial if she would live stream. Other counties do it and IMO she could do it, too. Wouldn't that new $72,196 custom-designed multimedia podium with AV equipment that is being used in the Carroll County Circuit Court courtroom where Allen’s hearings and trial take place will be able to handle it?

Indiana counties that are live streaming at this time:

IN Court Streams - IN Court Streams

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

 

[StarryStarryNight]

At the beginning, I thought this was a crime of opportunity.

Later, I thought it was targeted and BG/RA knew the girls would be there.

Now, I'm waffling between the two. (I do think RA = BG, that part I don't question.)

What does everyone think at this point? Random crime or targeted?

I think RA went there that day looking for an opportunity to play out a sick fantasy.
It wouldn’t surprise me if he had been there multiple times before looking for the same opportunity.
Nothing I’ve read about the girls’ day indicates to me that the trip to the trails was anything other than a spontaneous idea spawned from teen boredom. They did not appear driven and desperate to go there to meet anybody. I also don’t think RA was monitoring or tipped off that they were going to the trails that day.
RA is a predator. I’m thinking for years he visited different places armed and ready but with no real intent. Playing out part of the fantasy was good enough to give him a thrill. Until it wasn’t enough, on February 13, 2017.

 

[somequestions]

The whole trial might be a lot of hype about nothing.

If any of the confessions are that Richard Allen said he is the person in Liberty German's phone video, he is almost certainly going to be found guilty. If any of the confessions are that Richard Allen said he told the girls to go "down the hill", he is probably going to be found guilty. If any of the confessions contain information about the crime scene never released to the public, he is probably going to be found guilty.

I do not like the fact that the confessions came after he was arrested, but LE would still have gotten the right person. The part that would surprise me at trial is if the state has a really strong case against Richard Allen without the confessions. I do not think they do. Richard Allen may have given police the information necessary to make the arrest and also the proof needed at trial for a conviction.

I know we have to wait for trial to find out info. Hopefully they open another courtroom with a video feed so more people can watch this trial unfold and report on it.

I want to know what other pictures and video Libby took of Abby looking back towards the north side of the bridge.

 

[AugustWest]

Snipped and BBM for focus:

"Of course, we have to consider what this judge will allow them to do."

It's what any judge would allow because of the law. The SCOIN has ruled unanimously that JG is unbiased. I know she will follow the law. MO

Rule 403 is always a judgement call made by each particular judge, which is why the rule has the term "may" in it rather than "shall." One judge may find evidence prejudicial while another doesn't. The rule is about prejudicial evidence, not prejudice of a judge.

 

[girlhasnoname]

If the trial were broadcast, I think it would DECREASE the circus atmosphere as people would be content watching from home. Courtroom management would be easier if cameras were allowed, imo.

jmo

I do wish Judge Gull would have allowed at least one pool camera.

 

[tlcya]

I do wish Judge Gull would have allowed at least one pool camera.

as do I. It would have made things so much easier. JMO

 

[katydid23]

I think Harshman said that RA apologised for molesting other victims, besides the girls he is charged with. If that is true, that could open up a can of worms for him. It makes me wonder if any other previous victims may pop in to testify about his behaviour towards them. I think the only way it would be allowed could be if he had confessed to it at same time he was confessing to Abby and Libby?

 

[TTF14]

I think Harshman said that RA apologised for molesting other victims, besides the girls he is charged with. If that is true, that could open up a can of worms for him. It makes me wonder if any other previous victims may pop in to testify about his behaviour towards them. I think the only way it would be allowed could be if he had confessed to it at same time he was confessing to Abby and Libby?

Am I remembering right that JG ruled that no prior bad acts of anyone, including witnesses I assume, would be allowed in? Wasn't that one of NM's motions in limine? If so, I would imagine evidence like that, if it exists, wouldn't be allowed, but IANAL.

As always, JMO.

 

[TTF14]

I do wish Judge Gull would have allowed at least one pool camera.

I think there must be some very good reason she continues to say no. Something way bigger than we know about that would affect the safety of witnesses or something.

As always, JMO.

 

[katydid23]

Am I remembering right that JG ruled that no prior bad acts of anyone, including witnesses I assume, would be allowed in? Wasn't that one of NM's motions in limine? If so, I would imagine evidence like that, if it exists, wouldn't be allowed, but IANAL.

As always, JMO.

I think there would be a chance that a prior bad act that was connected to this bad act, could possibly be admitted.

If he had confessed to molesting young girls, for example. I think the P would fight hard to show that was relevant. Especially if he had confessed to it at the same time that he was confessing to the Delphi murders.

If any of his victims came forward, that could prove his confessions about the molestations were truthful. That seems relevant to this case, IMO.

 

[MassGuy]

I think the progression of RA's confessions and hearing the words from his own mouth will be the most powerful to the jury. I don't see the defense being able to overcome that, tied into everything else with details, powerful stuff. JMO

Oh yeah, I’m not saying they can win, just looking at how they can attempt that. Some things will be easier than others to spin.

 

[Willow Knight]

Also, Dan Dulin's "from memory" report of what RA told him when he was there could be faulty since he stood up there on stage (at the press conference) just days later, saw the "BG" pic and didn't recognize it as being RA, who he had just talked to and learned he'd been there that day. So, was RA even there after 1:30, and, if so, why didn't Dan Dulin make that connection? It's odd.

Respectfully SBM

The image of BG doesn't clearly define the face. IMO For me what it mostly clarifies is that is the same person that entered the trails as the group of girls were leaving. As BG continues his path, it is verified by witnesses seeing the same image up to where BG, Libby, and Abby would cross paths.

I don't think any witness will state they recognize the image as Richard Allen, simply they recognize the image as BG. IMO, it will be on the prosecutor to prove BG is RA.

Dan D would have recognized the image as BG. IMO DD did an interview with RA and turned in his notes. DD would not have known the details of the investigation at that time. There were several people on the trails that day that gave interviews. Richard Allen was one of many on the trail. I'm not sure anyone recognized Bridge Guy as being the employee at a drug store pharmacy.

It will be interesting to hear how LE circled back to all the tips and discovered a misfile. My opinion is evidence put Richard Allen on LE's radar. This evidence lead to the identity of BG. All my opinion.

 

[sunshineray]

Rule 403 is always a judgement call made by each particular judge, which is why the rule has the term "may" in it rather than "shall." One judge may find evidence prejudicial while another doesn't. The rule is about prejudicial evidence, not prejudice of a judge.

And this judge made those decision using their education, career experience and the law...not on personal bias. MO

 

[sunshineray]

The judge would have full control of the trial if she would live stream. Other counties do it and IMO she could do it, too. Wouldn't that new $72,196 custom-designed multimedia podium with AV equipment that is being used in the Carroll County Circuit Court courtroom where Allen’s hearings and trial take place will be able to handle it?

Indiana counties that are live streaming at this time:

IN Court Streams - IN Court Streams

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

Obviously if the RA is innocent fanatic youtubers had respected the courthouse, the Court and it's rules, there would be a televised trial for us all to watch. It's the out of control SM actors that have caused this camera blackout. Shame on them and their backers...ie The Due Process Gang and those that they have worked for, in the past.
AJMO

 

[tlcya]

Yet the arrest of Richard Allen in the killings only marked the beginning of a series of chaotic developments — including a defense theory about a pagan cult, a man’s suicide and arguments about whether Allen was of sound mind when he allegedly confessed 61 times — that many feel have subsumed the victims and what happened to them. On Oct. 14, the highly anticipated trial begins, and prosecutors, who have been largely silent on even basic facts of the case, will finally outline the evidence against the 52-year-old.
[snip]
It’s a decision that “The Murder Sheet” podcast co-host Cain understands but said she disagrees with.

“I do wish it was being broadcast because I feel it’s engendered such enormous public interest,” Cain told HuffPost. “I think that part of the reason that conspiracy theories form is when things are perceived to be in darkness, and sunlight is the cure.”
Mysteries Remain In Horrific Killings Of 2 Girls As Trial Is Set To Begin

 

[FrostedGlass]

Obviously if the RA is innocent fanatic youtubers had respected the courthouse, the Court and it's rules, there would be a televised trial for us all to watch. It's the out of control SM actors that have caused this camera blackout. Shame on them and their backers...ie The Due Process Gang and those that they have worked for, in the past.
AJMO

I strongly disagree with you. She could live stream and not have to worry about disruptive people.