AK - Samantha Koenig, 18, Anchorage, 01 Feb 2012 - #7

[ryanemsmom]

I wonder if this shed was kept locked.

I have a similar shed in my yard used for storage and it is ALWAYS kept locked, unless I or my husband is in it. The key is on a hook by the door, but we also keep expensive tools in it and wouldn't dream of leaving it unlocked.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

I believe if she was in that shed for any period of time, sadly she was not alive.

 

[907]

Ugggg, I had to take a break after the terrible news yesterday. RIP Samantha.

He could have easily used a chainsaw to cut the ice hole. I'm sure he owned one, and it would be much quicker than an auger to make a big enough hole.

I am very curious about the debit card charges. In the Mindy Schloss case the Federal death penalty was on the table because Wade used her ATM card and stole her car. I'm assuming that since IK did not use Samantha's card there would be no way to apply the death penalty.

1. i don't know if you have ever used a chainsaw to cut ice, but it is NOT faster than an auger. it is also a whole lot more work and messier.
Most people don't have a 3 or 4 ft blade on their chainsaw. Which means that you cut the initial hole shape, then cut it into sections. then you spud it to break those sections. then lift them out one at a time.
Then you saw the rest of the way through the ice. At this point, instead of wood chips, the saw spits out gallons of water, saturating you and everything around you. then you have to either chip apart or move the ice block you just cut out to get access to the hole.

A power auger, in 3 ft of ice, will drill that hole in under a minute, start to finish. and you wont be soaking wet.

2. also we don't know whose card he did or didn't use. we do know that SO FAR only person A's use was reported.

 

[MsFacetious]

I believe if she was in that shed for any period of time, sadly she was not alive.

The thought about her being in the shed was more for cold storage... until he had time to put her in the lake.
I don't think anyone thinks she was held there alive.

No, you cannot see through.

To clarify a bit for the original question poster... It's white, not clear.
It's kind of more like trying to look through snow... because I believe there is actually snow on top of the ice.
(It's been a while.)

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

IMO the shed wouldnt be a good hostage location...
it is made out of "tin".... yelling, screaming, or banging on it would surely wake someone...

heck, even if one was bound (not hog tied) they could almost bust out of a shed like that, or cause so much racket someone would be alerted....

I don't think a pre planned trip out of state for 2 weeks, with a dog sitter(rumor so far, but I beleive it) just to hide something you might not have intended on doing makes any sense.

and even if that theory was correct, then there are alot better, remote, further away places one would have gone. there are lakes everywhere.... and if one had two weeks to hide something here, it would be rather simple to never leave a trace.

BUT, if after he returned he had to hide it in a day, to not arouse suspicion of the SO, then it would have to be a closer spot like chosen....

I was replying to this post when I said I doubt she would have been alive if kept in the shed for any period of time.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

1. i don't know if you have ever used a chainsaw to cut ice, but it is NOT faster than an auger. it is also a whole lot more work and messier.
Most people don't have a 3 or 4 ft blade on their chainsaw. Which means that you cut the initial hole shape, then cut it into sections. then you spud it to break those sections. then lift them out one at a time.
Then you saw the rest of the way through the ice. At this point, instead of wood chips, the saw spits out gallons of water, saturating you and everything around you. then you have to either chip apart or move the ice block you just cut out to get access to the hole.

A power auger, in 3 ft of ice, will drill that hole in under a minute, start to finish. and you wont be soaking wet.

2. also we don't know whose card he did or didn't use. we do know that SO FAR only person A's use was reported.

907, I'm assuming you are a local. Do you think someone would have been alerted if he was out there using an auger in the middle of the night or even in the day time? I can't imagine those are quiet. And do you know if this lake was locked and gated at night?

 

[ConnectedSuitor]

1. i don't know if you have ever used a chainsaw to cut ice, but it is NOT faster than an auger. it is also a whole lot more work and messier.
Most people don't have a 3 or 4 ft blade on their chainsaw. Which means that you cut the initial hole shape, then cut it into sections. then you spud it to break those sections. then lift them out one at a time.
Then you saw the rest of the way through the ice. At this point, instead of wood chips, the saw spits out gallons of water, saturating you and everything around you. then you have to either chip apart or move the ice block you just cut out to get access to the hole.

A power auger, in 3 ft of ice, will drill that hole in under a minute, start to finish. and you wont be soaking wet.

2. also we don't know whose card he did or didn't use. we do know that SO FAR only person A's use was reported.

I have been dragged on ice fishing trips and have seen both augers and chainsaws but of course I've never seen anyone make a wide hole with an auger because it wasn't necessary. Would you just auger the holes super close together or how would that work?

JK did make a statement that the card did not belong to him or anyone he knows so I guess its possible that he was speaking only to Person A's card.

 

[907]

I have been dragged on ice fishing trips and have seen both augers and chainsaws but of course I've never seen anyone make a wide hole with an auger because it wasn't necessary. Would you just auger the holes super close together or how would that work?

JK did make a statement that the card did not belong to him or anyone he knows so I guess its possible that he was speaking only to Person A's card.

That area, from my knowledge and past use is locked at a certain time at night.
The neighbor said that he has lived there only a month, but become familiar with sounds of people cutting holes, ice fishing, that he didn't really take notice until he saw all the tents and people. (or something like that, i am surmising based on crappy recollection)

Augers come in 2 standard sizes, 8" and 10".... a circle 10" across is pretty big.
two next to each other like a figure 8 is IMo big enough to put an average person through... i wrote above how to do it with a smaller one.
you can't make them touching, because the auger won't drill right, it will catch and bind on the other hole.. you have to leave and inch or two between them, then simply break that piece.
So, even if he had to drill 4 holes, it would take 5 mins MAX......

Drilling more than 1 hole is common. Most places you can use 2 lines, some up to 5, depending on reg's. But i drill several in several likely areas to hold fish. I like to do them all at once, so that it calms down quicker. To be drilling a new hole to fish in or try to every 15 mins, is going to work against you trying to catch fish. I will drill 4 -5 holes for myself when ice fishing, when i start, so i have options to move around.

the last time you drove by a local lake, did you even look to see or notice if anyone or how many people were ice fishing? people become unaware of their surroundings when stuff isnt out of the ordinary. also, you can't see that lake from the road, nor can you see if or how many vehicles may be in the parking lot, passing by at 60mph either. It is set back in from the road.

IMO a chainsaw is the worst way to make a hole for ice fishing.....(unless you dont have an auger)..... If you are making a big ol hole like the fbi did, then it is a necessity....but it is messy..... and the best way to do it, would be to start a hole with an auger first...( i have sawed and drilled my share of ice....) alternatively, they make hand ice saws. they are IMO just as fast as a chainsaw, and are quiet... they are designed to cut ice, whereas a chainsaw is not. It works, but it isn't the right tool for the job.

 

[cluciano63]

I am so curious about how Samantha was located, even if IK confessed....unless they took him out there with them and he pointed out the spot?

 

[Whisperer]

Why would any person take the chance that they will be killed if they resist, rather than do as the kidnapper says, with the possibility that they will live a little while longer or manage to escape or be rescued?
I'm sorry, but 9 out of 10 people are not going to stand their ground with a gun pointed at them, especially young women. Survival is an instinct and everyone is going to fight to survive. Sometimes a victim has no choice. If the guy is bigger and stronger and has a gun, you think a young woman or a child could manage to stand in one spot while he's forcing them to walk? The best they could do is scream as loud as they can, which would probably get them clobbered on the head or a knife in their back.

From my experience and working with perps, they usually will not fight it out. Of course there is the slim chance they will but most of the time, the perp runs. It is better to take the bullet at the spot (extremely rare when rape is goal) than suffer what he has in store for you by going with him. If you are out in the open, your screams may be heard which is the last thing a self-serving perp wants you to do.

Unless his goal was to kill for the thrill on the spot, he wants something else first. His goal oftentimes is rape and he doesn't want to do it in a public arena or near a camera. If you fight, run, scream, He will usually get out quickly...and later go for an easier victim.

 

[Whisperer]

Why would any person take the chance that they will be killed if they resist, rather than do as the kidnapper says, with the possibility that they will live a little while longer or manage to escape or be rescued?
I'm sorry, but 9 out of 10 people are not going to stand their ground with a gun pointed at them, especially young women. Survival is an instinct and everyone is going to fight to survive. Sometimes a victim has no choice. If the guy is bigger and stronger and has a gun, you think a young woman or a child could manage to stand in one spot while he's forcing them to walk? The best they could do is scream as loud as they can, which would probably get them clobbered on the head or a knife in their back.

Your point is well taken. That is why they are victims The rest is addressed in my previous post.

 

[ConnectedSuitor]

From my experience and working with perps, they usually will not fight it out. Of course there is the slim chance they will but most of the time, the perp runs. It is better to take the bullet at the spot (extremely rare) than suffer what he has in store for you by going with him. If you are out in the open, your screams may be heard which is the last thing a self-serving perp wants you to do.

I still can't get over how brazen it is to abduct her from this location, even at night. The Alaska Club was open with many cars in the parking lot and Tudor Road is one of the busiest roads in Anchorage. The poor girl had to be too scared to resist because someone would have noticed if she made a scene.

 

[No Stone Unturned]

Would using an auger be noisy? I'm unfamiliar with it. Chainsaws, however, are very loud.
I would think that sound would carry very far and maybe even echo with the frozen lake. I think he wouldn't want to draw that kind of attention.

Thank you to the posters who gave description about the shed. I have envisioned something much more sturdy. Around my area, they are sometimes made of concrete.

 

[Whisperer]

I still can't get over how brazen it is to abduct her from this location, even at night. The Alaska Club was open with many cars in the parking lot and Tudor Road is one of the busiest roads in Anchorage. The poor girl had to be too scared to resist because someone would have noticed if she made a scene.

Oftentimes, robbery is akin to rape, personal and brazen. In the system, many robbers are rapists. This is a known fact inside. It came about because robbery used to (and still may) get you more time than rape. So the State would drop the rape and the perp does time on the robbery. These deals drive me crazy.

A Warden wrote in his book, "If they rob you, they may rape you". I have suspected in this case, IK did both. Keep in mind robbery and burglary are two entirely different crimes. Robbery is very personal, as the perp looks at you directly...he is brazen and could rape you if he gets you alone.

 

[907]

Would using an auger be noisy? I'm unfamiliar with it. Chainsaws, however, are very loud.
I would think that sound would carry very far and maybe even echo with the frozen lake. I think he wouldn't want to draw that kind of attention.

Thank you to the posters who gave description about the shed. I have envisioned something much more sturdy. Around my area, they are sometimes made of concrete.

Yeah an auger makes noise. But if you are ice fishing, or in a spot that alot of people commonly do then it isn't unusual.

I doubt he dragged her down there by a leg, in the open and then dug a hole. A sled, covered up with ice fishing gear, or whatever wouldn't even draw a glance from someone as unsual.

Not to mention, that lake is not visible from the road. So it almost comes back to the question " if an auger is running and there is no one around to hear it, does it make noise?"

 

[amber1]

Body of Missing Barista AK girl found in Icy Lake. God Bless her and the family, my heart is with you all<3
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...icy-lake-is-missing-alaska-barista-police-say

 

[Whisperer]

No Death Penalty in Alaska? WTH? :thud:

 

[amber1]

I watched a video on abc news.com about her father saying she had a restraining order she wanted to files against a man she didn't even know, but was to afraid to go through with it in court, perhaps frightened the notion may infuriate him?
Does anyone have more info on this, such as is this man IK?

 

[ryanemsmom]

I watched a video on abc news.com about her father saying she had a restraining order she wanted to files against a man she didn't even know, but was to afraid to go through with it in court, perhaps frightened the notion may infuriate him?
Does anyone have more info on this, such as is this man IK?

This man was not IK. He is an unrelated person.

 

[BrownRice]

From my experience and working with perps, they usually will not fight it out. Of course there is the slim chance they will but most of the time, the perp runs. It is better to take the bullet at the spot (extremely rare when rape is goal) than suffer what he has in store for you by going with him. If you are out in the open, your screams may be heard which is the last thing a self-serving perp wants you to do.

Unless his goal was to kill for the thrill on the spot, he wants something else first. His goal oftentimes is rape and he doesn't want to do it in a public arena or near a camera. If you fight, run, scream, He will usually get out quickly...and later go for an easier victim.

Yes, I completely agree with this. I hopefully will never be in this position, but hope if I am, I will be calm and brave enough to remember this. I would rather be shot AND killed on the street than taken anywhere, because the odds are truly against you. However, I think this is a very hard talk to have with your kids w/out scaring the heck out of them (even following the stranger danger tips).