Any Elisa Updates At All?

[eileenhawkeye]

You could be right. This case has been locked down almost from day one. Not much coming out, and to me those kind of situations smell of cover-up. They aren't even willing to talk about whether they searched the tanks the first time they went to the roof when she was a missing person, or what the state of her body was when it was found.

If they can't make it sound like suicide, then someone wants to just suppress all news of the case. And there doesn't appear to be any reporters willing to look deeper into this. Not even a private eye with police department connections is willing to leak info about this case. My sense is that someone just wants this story to disappear. Whether its connected to ritual murder, secret societies, etc... I don't know. Perhaps someone of influence is keeping this case fairly secret.

There are about 13,000 murders every year. I believe about 40% go unsolved. What is so unusual about this particular murder not getting any coverage after the first couple of weeks? There is no news right now.

How do you suppress news of the case? If it was bringing in ratings and ad revenue for the media, wouldn't they report on it? Is someone giving the local LA media $$$ not to talk about the case? Also, no one is going to leak information to the media unless they are being paid for it. You would be putting your career at risk. The media is not interested, so they aren't going to be offering money. I have followed many high-profile cases, and in most of them, almost all information comes out due to press conferences, news releases, interviews, Sunshine Law, etc. This is why so many cases on WS go quiet for weeks/months/years until there is an actual development because no one is leaking anything about the investigation.

As for reporters willing to look deeper into the case...journalists need to get a certain number of stories in every week. With nothing happening in the case, what are they supposed to write/report about? They also have to follow what their boss says. If the story isn't considered lucrative, their boss is not going to want them doing 10 stories a week on it. Not to mention, there is a huge lack of investigative reporters these days. Even the case considered high-profile, most of them do not have one reporter who is digging for the truth. There is nobody like that in the cases of Kyron Horman, Elizabeth and Lyric, Isabel Celis, Baby Lisa. There aren't many cases at all that have that one reporter who is doing his own investigating, constantly putting out stories on the case, etc. Most cases just have random reporters who cover the case when something happens.

 

[findinganatta]

Back to basis: A search warrant has never been obtained by the LAPD for a thorough search of all the hotel rooms, why? The released 4-min video clearly shown that a crime was presented in the place to be searched.

What circumstances would possibility be changed if a Search Warrant has obtained and LAPD do a thorough search of the building, it was highly likely that Elisa Lam's body could be found before it was dumped into the water tank.

One thing I have heard was LAPD clearly told the media at the very beginning that there was a Foul Play in Elisa Lam's case, but later LAPD said they have never said so.

snipped for space

The video did not "clearly" show a crime taking place. It is a highly ambiguous clip, hence the utter lack of consensus by pretty much everyone who watches it. Ten intelligent people can watch that video and come up with ten different interpretations that are equally plausible. Just because someone sneaks a look out of an elevator and then appears to hide doesn't mean anyone was actually after them, and if there was another person or persons, it doesn't prove they were malicious (which is why many people have theorized that Elisa could have been playing around with someone, like a tag or chase game). In fact, her behavior that possibly implies someone was 'after' her is followed by behavior that seems to show her being quite casual in plain view. So it's impossible to know what is happening.

Obtaining a search warrant for every room in the building would not have been legal, and the LAPD stated this. I have never heard of everyone in a hotel (or apartment building, etc) being searched for no other reason that their presence in the hotel when someone disappeared. Also, just to clarify, her body wasn't necessarily kept anywhere else before the cistern--she very likely could have died inside of it.

Finally, the LAPD did not "clearly" state that foul play was involved. They stated that they had reason to believe foul play might have been involved. They also never denied saying that foul play might be involved--quite the opposite: they denied rumors that foul play was NOT involved... they made it quite clear that they had not made a determination, which is still their public stance.

If you have any links to prove your claims, please provide them. Or maybe I'm misinterpreting what you're saying. But it appears to me that you are getting some basic facts incorrect. If you are unclear, just Google the stories about it from the first month or so. There was a pretty limited amount of official info released from the LAPD, so it's easy to find it all and check it out.

 

[findinganatta]

whoops... double post

 

[BlueShoe]

It seems to me that all of the later updates about this case have been coming through Chinese media. They seem to be able to get a bit more information, even if it is still minimal. The latest wait is just one bit of information. I don't think there is a conspiracy or cover-up, but I do wonder why not U.S. or Canadian media. I don't think it can be lack of interest, just because there has been so much internet interest about this case. Certainly American media are aware of this. It also seems like a perfect case for tabloid coverage, and I haven't seen that either (maybe there has been some wild speculation there?). Very intriguing case, with no information forthcoming just seems odd to me. I know attractive white women get more coverage, but even so.

Why can't a Vanity Fair reporter do a reasonably decent article on the various angles of this odd case? Are they just waiting for autopsy results? Usually those kinds of things don't hold them back that much.

 

[noodled1]

It seems to me that all of the later updates about this case have been coming through Chinese media. They seem to be able to get a bit more information, even if it is still minimal. The latest wait is just one bit of information. I don't think there is a conspiracy or cover-up, but I do wonder why not U.S. or Canadian media. I don't think it can be lack of interest, just because there has been so much internet interest about this case. Certainly American media are aware of this. It also seems like a perfect case for tabloid coverage, and I haven't seen that either (maybe there has been some wild speculation there?). Very intriguing case, with no information forthcoming just seems odd to me. I know attractive white women get more coverage, but even so.

Why can't a Vanity Fair reporter do a reasonably decent article on the various angles of this odd case? Are they just waiting for autopsy results? Usually those kinds of things don't hold them back that much.

To me I'm not seeing anything new from the Chinese media. More recaps than anything new. New articles yes new information no, that one outlet seems facinated with it all. BUT, to be fair that being said... I don't read Chinese so I'm having to read translations which could be throwing me/us off a bit

 

[BlueShoe]

noodled1, wasn't it the Chinese media that reported we would have to wait about another month for autopsy results? I could be wrong, I guess, but one of the translations from Chinese on this site is where I found out.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

It seems to me that all of the later updates about this case have been coming through Chinese media. They seem to be able to get a bit more information, even if it is still minimal. The latest wait is just one bit of information. I don't think there is a conspiracy or cover-up, but I do wonder why not U.S. or Canadian media. I don't think it can be lack of interest, just because there has been so much internet interest about this case. Certainly American media are aware of this. It also seems like a perfect case for tabloid coverage, and I haven't seen that either (maybe there has been some wild speculation there?). Very intriguing case, with no information forthcoming just seems odd to me. I know attractive white women get more coverage, but even so.

Why can't a Vanity Fair reporter do a reasonably decent article on the various angles of this odd case? Are they just waiting for autopsy results? Usually those kinds of things don't hold them back that much.

What exactly is the Internet interest? There's a case of a little baby who was beaten to death, a FB page has 100k+ likes...It has not received ANY national coverage. Dylan Redwine has 25k people on a FB page, very active on FB and on websleuths....Barely any national coverage.

As for Vanity Fair...they never did one article on Baby Lisa, Kyron Horman, Isabel Celis, Elizabeth and Lyric, Jessica Ridgeway, or Haleigh Cummings. And those are just cases I followed so I'm familiar with their media coverage. I never thought they were big on reporting on true crime.

The leaks from the police...the investigative reporters...the tabloid coverage...extensive Vanity Fair article...Posts about what people expect of the media coverage remind me a lot of JonBenet Ramsey, but that case is an extreme oddity. I don't think you can expect Elisa's case (or any case) to resemble JonBenet's case in terms of the media.

 

[Shlock Homes]

There are about 13,000 murders every year. I believe about 40% go unsolved. What is so unusual about this particular murder not getting any coverage after the first couple of weeks? There is no news right now.

How do you suppress news of the case? If it was bringing in ratings and ad revenue for the media, wouldn't they report on it? Is someone giving the local LA media $$$ not to talk about the case? Also, no one is going to leak information to the media unless they are being paid for it. You would be putting your career at risk. The media is not interested, so they aren't going to be offering money. I have followed many high-profile cases, and in most of them, almost all information comes out due to press conferences, news releases, interviews, Sunshine Law, etc. This is why so many cases on WS go quiet for weeks/months/years until there is an actual development because no one is leaking anything about the investigation.

As for reporters willing to look deeper into the case...journalists need to get a certain number of stories in every week. With nothing happening in the case, what are they supposed to write/report about? They also have to follow what their boss says. If the story isn't considered lucrative, their boss is not going to want them doing 10 stories a week on it. Not to mention, there is a huge lack of investigative reporters these days. Even the case considered high-profile, most of them do not have one reporter who is digging for the truth. There is nobody like that in the cases of Kyron Horman, Elizabeth and Lyric, Isabel Celis, Baby Lisa. There aren't many cases at all that have that one reporter who is doing his own investigating, constantly putting out stories on the case, etc. Most cases just have random reporters who cover the case when something happens.

It was pretty sensational, I mean, people drinking the water of a hotel with a corpse floating in it. I think this case stands above your typical murder case, where someone is found shot in a dark alley, or stabbed, or whatever because of the mysterious nature of her disappearance, and the even more bizarre location of her body. Enough fodder there to generate revenue. If there isn't any desire to pay for a leak, even just a glimpse of the autopsy, in this type of case, I think something or someone overseeing things is keeping it quiet. The cases you mention while heartbreaking are children who were murdered by adults, and the situations surrounding their deaths are tragic, but not unusual. They may have even been lured by someone they knew, like a family member or a friend of the family. In the case of Elisa Lam, she's a grown woman, who may have had some street smarts, but for whatever reason, on her last day before she was to head back home, she vanished for weeks, never seen leaving the hotel, then her body is found inside of a water tank on top of the hotel. No witnesses, how does a grown person end up there with nobody seeing it happen.

 

[Shlock Homes]

It seems to me that all of the later updates about this case have been coming through Chinese media. They seem to be able to get a bit more information, even if it is still minimal. The latest wait is just one bit of information. I don't think there is a conspiracy or cover-up, but I do wonder why not U.S. or Canadian media. I don't think it can be lack of interest, just because there has been so much internet interest about this case. Certainly American media are aware of this. It also seems like a perfect case for tabloid coverage, and I haven't seen that either (maybe there has been some wild speculation there?). Very intriguing case, with no information forthcoming just seems odd to me. I know attractive white women get more coverage, but even so.

Why can't a Vanity Fair reporter do a reasonably decent article on the various angles of this odd case? Are they just waiting for autopsy results? Usually those kinds of things don't hold them back that much.

I don't think it has to do with her race or ethnicity that has resulted in the lack of interest. The unusual circumstances surrounding her disappearance and eventual discovery are more than enough reason for some reporter to dig a little more. But Canadian and US media aren't doing it. Someone could at least get a bit of info on the autopsy results without needing the tox reports, but nobody is interested. If her family was influential, then I could see it being because of their privacy and they've put some kind of gag on the media reports. But the silence on this case is deafening. Even if it was the work of some serial killer, they would have come out by now. And if she did commit suicide, and left clues like a note of some sort, I think that would have come out. No explanations or information about her room, which floor she was on, why she was on the 14th floor (or even what floor she was on, and what time it was, when the video was taken). There's a complete lock down as far as I'm concerned.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

It was pretty sensational, I mean, people drinking the water of a hotel with a corpse floating in it. I think this case stands above your typical murder case, where someone is found shot in a dark alley, or stabbed, or whatever because of the mysterious nature of her disappearance, and the even more bizarre location of her body. Enough fodder there to generate revenue. If there isn't any desire to pay for a leak, even just a glimpse of the autopsy, in this type of case, I think something or someone overseeing things is keeping it quiet. The cases you mention while heartbreaking are children who were murdered by adults, and the situations surrounding their deaths are tragic, but not unusual. They may have even been lured by someone they knew, like a family member or a friend of the family. In the case of Elisa Lam, she's a grown woman, who may have had some street smarts, but for whatever reason, on her last day before she was to head back home, she vanished for weeks, never seen leaving the hotel, then her body is found inside of a water tank on top of the hotel. No witnesses, how does a grown person end up there with nobody seeing it happen.

I agree with you that it is a very sensational case. In terms of newsworthiness, it definitely "ranks" higher than most murders. But with 13,000 murders every year, one can assume that there is a decent amount that could be considered sensational yet don't get much coverage at all. Right? Ever watch the show Unsolved Mysteries? The cases on that show were extremely sensational and mysteries; for 98% of them, Unsolved Mysteries was the only coverage they ever got.

I mentioned the cases that I did because they all considered high-profile, got a lot of local coverage, and a decent amount of national coverage yet there were no investigative reporters, not many leaks, no Vanity Fair exposes, etc. There was more media interest in those cases than Elisa's, so how could anyone expect the media to do more digging in Elisa's case than they did in those cases?

I assume that for the media to get the autopsy report to leak, they would need to have a pretty high interest in the case. But they don't have much interest...so why would they go out of their way to get the autopsy? Maybe filing some motion...but paying money for it to leak?

Julia Niswender was found drowned in the bathtub of her apartment. There are about 10 people murdered every year by drowning, so it is extraordinarily rare. Zero national coverage.

 

[jetsetsam]

I find it very surprising that nobody from the fire department has blabbed.

When the body was first discovered in the tank, the firemen were taking turns looking down into the tank. On camera. "Hey Buff, come and take a look at this".

And then look at how many firemen it took to cut the hole in the tank, put the body in a bag and bring it down.

More than it takes to put in a new light bulb at the fire hall. And certainly more firemen than it takes to drive the fire truck to the dry cleaners to pick up clean uniforms.

And nothing. Not one slip from any of them.

And all it would take would be a good looking newswoman to jiggle a bit in front of them, or offer to polish their nozzle, and they'd spill everything.

But nothing. Very surprising.

 

[Sillybilly]

There was more media interest in those cases than Elisa's, so how could anyone expect the media to do more digging in Elisa's case than they did in those cases?

<rsbm>

But when CBC tried to dig, their interview was cancelled with orders from higher ups not to discuss the case, and even Conducter's link to the CBC video where Reshmi Nair mentions the cancelled interview is now defunct:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9173859&postcount=478"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Elisa Lam - What Happened?[/ame]


Canada doesn't have a lot of murders. She was Canadian, Canadians are interested, Canadian media is interested ... but nada. For CBC to pull a news video .. IMO, this is highly unusual.

 

[findinganatta]

As for the Canadian and American news, there have been some much higher-profile cases dominating the crime news, for instance Jodi Arias, TJ Lane, and Luka Magnotta. So that probably plays some role in the media's lack of intensity over EL's case. But also, this has never even been confirmed as a murder case (not even close, really). And even if it was, there is so little info to go on that they pretty much exhausted that after the first few weeks.

It's impossible to know why the LE has been so quiet. I'm on the fence about whether it's fairly typical LAPD behavior combined with an actual lack of new evidence, or part of an investigation strategy that we don't even know about yet, or possibly something a little nefarious--like some outside influence, or an attempt to cover their own butts for some reason. But the former of those three options makes the most sense to me.

And the more I think about it, it seems like those of us who read sites like this one can get a little skewed in our perspectives about things like degree of public interest.

As for the Chinese news, they're probably just rehashing and reanalyzing the same old info due to the greater level of interest there (partially because she was of Chinese decent, and also probably due to the specific cultural touchstones involved for tabloidy Chinese media--the elevator video relating to 'ghosts' and the cistern relating to Dark Water). If they were uncovering any new info, we would undoubtedly know about it... either through a translator on this site, or just the info making its way around the English-speaking web. Other than the news about the tox results taking longer, I'm unaware of any new information they've reported.

I find it very surprising that nobody from the fire department has blabbed.

When the body was first discovered in the tank, the firemen were taking turns looking down into the tank. On camera. "Hey Buff, come and take a look at this".

And then look at how many firemen it took to cut the hole in the tank, put the body in a bag and bring it down.

More than it takes to put in a new light bulb at the fire hall. And certainly more firemen than it takes to drive the fire truck to the dry cleaners to pick up clean uniforms.

And nothing. Not one slip from any of them.

And all it would take would be a good looking newswoman to jiggle a bit in front of them, or offer to polish their nozzle, and they'd spill everything.

But nothing. Very surprising.

Ah, I think you're making a lot of negative assumptions about the firemen : / I don't think they were necessarily taking turns looking in the tank for insensitive reasons... I would be more inclined to think they were trying to figure out how to approach the body removal given the weird circumstances. But even if some of them looked in out of curiosity, I wouldn't hold that against them. They do enough good for society that there is no reason to condemn them for being human like the rest of us (hell, I don't know anyone who doesn't stare when they pass a violent car wreck with a bloody person laying on the road).

And I don't have any reason to assume they would leak info just because a pretty reporter asked them. Men aren't that idiotic in the face of some woman who is simply asking them something. I give them more credit than that, at least the majority of them. They were probably given strict instructions not to give out details, especially given that it's an unsolved case with very little info, and the LE was likely being very careful with what information was given to the media. Personally, I haven't witnessed a lot of firemen (or police, for that matter) going on the news and haphazardly giving out details from a fresh case of potential murder... not without repercussions. And contrary to popular opinion, a "jiggling" woman is nowhere near enough to convince most professional men to risk their jobs or a serious reprimanding. It seems that you have a really low opinion of those firemen (or men in general), as well as newswomen and their proclivity to act like prostitutes.

I think we all need to keep our own assumptions in perspective and realize that we only know what we're seeing from a distance through the media. I can be a fairly cynical person at times, but it's just as important to have a healthy cynicism toward your own opinions and assumptions, especially when so little information is known.

 

[jetsetsam]

They are not assumptions.

I have worked around firemen quite a bit.

I have managed the construction of new fire halls, repairs to fire halls, and been involved in assessments of service delivery by fire departments.

They're more like a sports team or boys club. Ask a police officer what they think of firemen.

The smart ones have two jobs because their primary job doesn't demand much of them.

"not without repercussions"

What repercussions?

They're all in a union that would protect them, even if the source could be traced. And this isn't a murder investigation.

"Men aren't that idiotic in the face of some woman who is simply asking them something"

Thanks for the laugh. You have to get out more.

 

[Jessica222]

http://www.examiner.com/missing-persons-in-national/isabelle-zehnder

According to CBS Los Angeles, KNX 1070's Claudia Peschiutta reported guests were disturbed to learn Lam's nude body was found inside one of the four large water tanks.

Isabelle Zehnder, columnist and newsperson, reports on missing persons, top news, and family issues. Isabelle has worked as an investigative reporter for over six years extensively reporting on missing persons, children and teens abused in boot-camp type programs, and other pressing issues. She has a legal background, has worked as a child and family advocate, and is a Certified Family Coach. Have a story to share? Send an email to isabellenicole@gmail.com.

It was confirmed here the body was nude when the body was found.

 

[jetsetsam]

"According to CBS Los Angeles, KNX 1070's Claudia Peschiutta reported guests were disturbed to learn Lam's nude body was found inside one of the four large water tanks."

I wouldn't call that confirmation from a credible source.

Unless Claudia obtained the information from a fireman she chatted up.

 

[Jessica222]

Jetsetsam,

When we read newspapers, we believed what the reporters wrote on the newspapers were according to the fact and their investigations, in the end, this is all about their professionalism and once they put their name on their articles, it initially became their assets, I am not sure whether there are reporters whom would risks their reputations to write something irresponsible or unreliable. I really don't know. However, I came across some articles, if the reporters are yet to confirm whether it was true or false, they will put wordings like, 'comments or information have not been obtained or verified by *advertiser censored*.'

 

[jetsetsam]

I don't know if Claudia would have been allowed to climb up and look at the nude body floating in the tank, so most likely she obtained the information from someone at the scene who did look at it.

Like a fireman who wasn't afraid of being disciplined for talking to a female reporter.

He was probably shaking in his rubber boots about losing his job.

But keep in mind that sensational news sells, and nude is more sensational than no comment. Other news sources didn't report on the clothed/unclothed nature of the body.

And neither did the police spokepersons.

 

[Sillybilly]

But keep in mind that sensational news sells, and nude is more sensational than no comment. Other news sources didn't report on the clothed/unclothed nature of the body.

And neither did the police spokepersons.

FWIW, Claudia wasn't the only reporter ... KFI Crime and Court Reporter, Leonard Files, had also tweeted the same info Feb 19 after firefighters arrived around 1:00 pm and prior to The Cheese posting it here at 2:57 on Feb 19

https://twitter.com/LeonardFiles

[ame="http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8888778&postcount=349"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013[/ame]

 

[jetsetsam]

Maybe Leonard has a way of getting firemen to talk.

Or maybe Leonard was the source for Claudia.