ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 4

[OneLove]

Welcome!

You bring up good points, there is something odd. I got to the point of just tuning RF out.

According to CJ, the relationship was not as RF was portraying it to be, so we know at least that much, it's too bad she didn't go further but I can understand if maybe she didn't want to air any dirty laundry as it doesn't do anything to find RG now.

This could also be RF's guilty conscience at work, we just don't know.

Of course, it could just as well be that CJ only thinks what Robyn wanted her to believe, maybe Robyn's 'truth of the moment'.

That's a BIG maybe there. There are still a number of possibilities on the table.

MAYBE CJ is protecting her friend or friend's reputation.

MAYBE CJ had wanted Robyn to breakup with RF for a long time, and wants to be clear, since Robyn isn't here to do it herself, that she "intended" to breakup with him.

MAYBE the relationship between Robyn and RF wasn't ever a romantic one. This leaves LOTS of possible interpretations.

Just because we emotionally do not want to believe any one or more of these does not change the fact that they are still on the table, no matter how a "friend" might steer things.

I'm trying to keep in mind that CJ says the relationship wasn't what people think (well, I didn't think anything at that point because I knew nothing) but she has not made one single clarifying statement as to what she meant by that or what their relationship REALLY was, since she "knows".

The innuendo followed by massive silence is, well, enigmatic. I can't put much stock in it until she clarifies. I certainly can't believe it lock, stock, and barrel, just because she said it.

If there's anything we've seen plenty of here at Websleuths, it's people involved in cases who don't always tell the truth, whether by design or not.

One thing that IS true is that things are not always what they seem to be.

 

[JodieSoda]

If they had cell phones on them, you'd think they could narrow down the radius of their travels... and if she had an iphone, better yet: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/apr/20/iphone-tracking-prompts-privacy-fears

 

[Starfish]

Of course, it could just as well be that CJ only thinks what Robyn wanted her to believe, maybe Robyn's 'truth of the moment'.

That's a BIG maybe there. There are still a number of possibilities on the table.

MAYBE CJ is protecting her friend or friend's reputation.

MAYBE CJ had wanted Robyn to breakup with RF for a long time, and wants to be clear, since Robyn isn't here to do it herself, that she "intended" to breakup with him.

MAYBE the relationship between Robyn and RF wasn't ever a romantic one. This leaves LOTS of possible interpretations.

Just because we emotionally do not want to believe any one or more of these does not change the fact that they are still on the table, no matter how a "friend" might steer things.

I'm trying to keep in mind that CJ says the relationship wasn't what people think (well, I didn't think anything at that point because I knew nothing) but she has not made one single clarifying statement as to what she meant by that or what their relationship REALLY was, since she "knows".

The innuendo followed by massive silence is, well, enigmatic. I can't put much stock in it until she clarifies. I certainly can't believe it lock, stock, and barrel, just because she said it.

If there's anything we've seen plenty of here at Websleuths, it's people involved in cases who don't always tell the truth, whether by designnor not.

One thing that IS true is that things are not always what they seem to be.

Everything that you say here about CJ's interpetation of RG & RF's relationship are certainly great possibilities!

I remember when I was going clubbing with a good friend back in our single days, there was this guy that we would always see that was crazy about my friend. She told me over & over that she was not romatically interested in him, that she did not want to date him, heck we would have to sneak out of places if he showed up leaving full drinks & practically crawling out so he didn't see us! This went on for years, then one night, after a few drinks, I told him that he needed to face the music that she was not interested, had never been interested, and would never be interested so move on! A few years later, she ended up marrying him and is still married to him now, 9 years later! So the moral of the story is that you just never know, even though you are the best of friends, share the best of secrets, you never really know what is going through someone else's mind in spite of what they're telling you.

 

[Dymphna]

No worries- I completely understood where you were coming from.. I'm a recovering drug addict and can get rather preachy myself in some areas of discussion lol- ask anyone here. :crazy:

Your post gave me pause, I haven't stopped thinking about it and have decided it's probably the right thing for me not to discuss whatever possible issues she has anyway because really, like you say- that's not what's gonna find her. I just hope she's found safe and sound. Thank you for your post. :blowkiss:

OT/ but I just want to tell you how much I have always respected your thoughts, posts and honesty. As a person who lives with a Serious Mental Illness (if my user name doesn't give that away...lol), I feel so connected to you and the experiences that you share so openly here. I really appreciate your input, and I think you add so much insight to the discussions on every thread you contribute to. Thank you! :blowkiss:

 

[Dushi]

I have followed this from the beginning and I have no idea who is telling the truth and who isn't
Seems there has been some whitewashing of character once again.
Which IMO is not needed

Not real concerned about what robyns character was all about, At this point she still seems to be a victim

On the other hand, I do not think she is all innocent... knew who she was with, knew the deal
I do not think she was naive at all
Knew her role, knew the man

No game, no tricks, I think she was a happy participant until the end
What ever went wrong... don't know

Still not sure...

 

[belimom]

Here's more...

Investigators in the case of a missing American woman in Aruba said the suspect told them hours after the woman disappeared that “she’s probably dead now.”

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/0...tery-missing-american-woman-in/#ixzz1WZOrnwwE

 

[Kiln Wood]

Everything that you say here about CJ's interpetation of RG & RF's relationship are certainly great possibilities!

I remember when I was going clubbing with a good friend back in our single days, there was this guy that we would always see that was crazy about my friend. She told me over & over that she was not romatically interested in him, that she did not want to date him, heck we would have to sneak out of places if he showed up leaving full drinks & practically crawling out so he didn't see us! This went on for years, then one night, after a few drinks, I told him that he needed to face the music that she was not interested, had never been interested, and would never be interested so move on! A few years later, she ended up marrying him and is still married to him now, 9 years later! So the moral of the story is that you just never know, even though you are the best of friends, share the best of secrets, you never really know what is going through someone else's mind in spite of what they're telling you.

BBM

And so it appears he chased her until she married him.....Thank you for sharing this ironic story: Live and learn!

P.S. I share your unbridled enthusiasm for Bonaire (about which most people I meet in daily life or travelling the world have never even heard). Just "discovered" Bonaire myself in 2004--and wish I had years before; I didn't know what I had been missing!!

 

[JodieSoda]

I have followed this from the beginning and I have no idea who is telling the truth and who isn't
Seems there has been some whitewashing of character once again.
Which IMO is not needed

Not real concerned about what robyns character was all about, At this point she still seems to be a victim

On the other hand, I do not think she is all innocent... knew who she was with, knew the deal
I do not think she was naive at all
Knew her role, knew the man

No game, no tricks, I think she was a happy participant until the end
What ever went wrong... don't know

Still not sure...

It's not necessarily about "whitewashing character" as it is uncovering the truth. Assuming her complete honesty would lend no continuity to this whole case; it doesn't even make sense. Everything so far leads me to believe she lived a double life and kept things private from everyone. So presuming what her friends and supposed "bf" have to say only creates more confusion as it contradicts the actions partaken in her life. I didn't mean it to offend and it shouldn't be taken personally; the whole objective is to find truth, not denigrate character. She is a victim no matter what.

 

[Salem]

REMINDER:

Victim Friendly

Websleuths is a victim friendly forum. Attacking or bashing a victim is not allowed. Discussing victim behavior, good or bad is fine, but do so in a civl and constructive way and ONLY IF IT IS RELEVANT TO THE CASE. Additionally,sleuthing family members that are not suspected of being involved in the crime or disappearance is not allowed. Don't make random accusations or post personal information (even if it is public) like parking tickets, address, or first and last names of all their relatives and their neighbors. Also, never "bash" or attack them, or accuse them of involvement. However that does not mean that family members cannot come into discussion as the facts and issues of the case are discussed.

-------------------------
Please provide links in your posts when you are discussing less than positive aspects of the victim's personality, so that the statements can be verified.

Thanks,

Salem

 

[HatesSociopaths]

Of course, it could just as well be that CJ only thinks what Robyn wanted her to believe, maybe Robyn's 'truth of the moment'.

That's a BIG maybe there. There are still a number of possibilities on the table.

MAYBE CJ is protecting her friend or friend's reputation.

MAYBE CJ had wanted Robyn to breakup with RF for a long time, and wants to be clear, since Robyn isn't here to do it herself, that she "intended" to breakup with him.

MAYBE the relationship between Robyn and RF wasn't ever a romantic one. This leaves LOTS of possible interpretations.

Just because we emotionally do not want to believe any one or more of these does not change the fact that they are still on the table, no matter how a "friend" might steer things.

I'm trying to keep in mind that CJ says the relationship wasn't what people think (well, I didn't think anything at that point because I knew nothing) but she has not made one single clarifying statement as to what she meant by that or what their relationship REALLY was, since she "knows".

The innuendo followed by massive silence is, well, enigmatic. I can't put much stock in it until she clarifies. I certainly can't believe it lock, stock, and barrel, just because she said it.

If there's anything we've seen plenty of here at Websleuths, it's people involved in cases who don't always tell the truth, whether by design or not.

One thing that IS true is that things are not always what they seem to be.

This is an interview transcript that CJ did with Dr Drew. It may be helpful. It was on Aug 17:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1108/17/ddhln.01.html

PINSKY: Now, Christina, you`re I guess one of the people that has informed me that Gary knew Robyn for a year and a half. Did you ever come in contact with him during that time?

CHRISTINA JONES, ROBYN GARDNER`S ROOMMATE: No. I have just only heard about Gary.

PINSKY: You only heard about him. Is that what you said?

I mean --

PINSKY: Listen. Christina, listen. I`ve talked to some of Robyn`s girlfriends, and they were very vague about who Gary was in her life. Can you help me understand who he was to her?

JONES: Well, of course, because the girlfriends that you have spoken, I know them very clearly and very well. And they did not know Robyn the way I know her.

And she spoke about Gary in passing. I know that he came into her life over a year and a half ago.

I know that he was very emotional. He did have an anger problem. He wasn`t passive.

He was threatening towards her. One minute he was nice, the next minute he wasn`t very nice.

PINSKY: Why was she with this guy? Didn`t she have a -- I know she had a boyfriend. I`ve talked to him.

Do you understand, Christina, why we are all confused? It`s like she was carrying on a clandestine relationship with a guy that was kind of aggressive and violent towards her?

JONES: No. I don`t think it was --

PINSKY: Even if it was a friendship -- Christina, even if it was a friendship, it was still kind of clandestine. Why was she with a guy that mistreated her?

JONES: I think a lot of women are with men that mistreat them, Dr. Drew. I think that she had some issues with Richard.

Richard is a friend of mine, so I`m not throwing him under the bus. She had kind of a roller-coaster relationship with both of them.

And when things weren`t so good with Richard, maybe she would spend more attention to Gary. And Gary was always there ready and waiting, always ready when she was having a weak moment to kind of prey on her. He always sugarcoated things to make her feel better about herself in a down time.

PINSKY: OK. But Christina, you used a very powerful word there. You said he was there to prey upon her. Did you mean that?

JONES: Of course. Yes.

I think that this guy, he finds a female that is going through a rough time. And I don`t think it`s just a matter of -- I truthfully feel that she was going through a low, and he knew about that, and that he offered her to go away, knowing that she would go.

She just lost her job. She`s going through a not-so-great relationship, you know, another hiccup with Richard. And she wanted to go away to rest, to come back, to look for a new job. She is very resilient.
...
PINSKY: Again, thank you for sort of clarifying what that relationship was all about. I think you understand why this is kind of confusing to us. I mean, we hear about this boyfriend, and then there`s this guy that is mistreating her.

Would it be safe to say that Gary was sort of her bullpen? She really didn`t have any kind of romantic relationship with him, but he was just somebody supportive that she went to in time of need.

JONES: I think that -- who knows what happened between Gary and Robyn, but Gary and Robyn? I can only tell you that as someone that knows her really well, I live with her, I`m her stylist.

I can speak on her behalf to say that they were definitely friends. It probably could have been more at one time. But as she got to learn about him, I know that things became rocky, and she was kind of second- guessing herself about their friendship.

But somehow that guy always kind of weaseled his way back in there with her, where one minute she wasn`t sure about him, and the next she`d say that, you know, it was OK. You know, it`s OK to get on a plane to go to Aruba, she was going to be fine. She would have never gotten on that plane if she thought she couldn`t handle it.

PINSKY: And, Christina, let me just say, I`m asking you tough questions, but it`s incumbent upon me to say I`m sorry. This is a really sad time for you, and I know this is a close friend of yours.

Yes. I`m sorry. And you`re having to face lots of tough questions and defend your friend, and we`re all just trying to make sense of this. And it`s a terribly, terribly sad story.

And please, our hearts go out to you. And thanks for helping us try to understand this. OK?
...

For me reading this interview again gave me more certainty that RG would never have knowingly signed a document making GG the beneficiary in the event of her death. I believe RG knew that GG was a dangerous man to one degree or another, enough to know that signing him over as beneficiary was the equivalent of possible suicide.

I think that his computer at home will show research on forging signatures, other incriminating google searches, perhaps scraps of paper practicing RG's signature, and that combined with testimony from an expert on forgery should be plenty to get a murder conviction, body or not.

 

[MicciStella]

Here's more...

Thank you Belimom..

I just tried to remember who posted almost the same thing a little further back...... it said that GG, while being questioned, looked down at his watch and said that she probably is dead by now.... (sorry don't remember who posted it...)

But it actually bothered me that there wasn't a whole lot of answers to that...

IMO that should be enough to keep this guy looked up till they have more evidence.... doesn't it almost sound like a confession?


hmmmmm...... Ok .. somehow it didn't take the whole quote over ... sorry .... hope I will do it better next time......

 

[Money Girl]

GG was not trying to "collect" on the insurance. He called the company to see if they would pay for the search efforts.

Will try to post the link.

 

[Money Girl]

IMO, GG should be allowed to return to the U.S. at this time. The FBI is already involved, so it's not like he is going to go anywhere and not be found.

 

[HatesSociopaths]

GG was not trying to "collect" on the insurance. He called the company to see if they would pay for the search efforts.

Will try to post the link.

Here is the info I have on that, with link:

The person with knowledge of the policy told the AP that Giordano purchased a $1.5 million American Express Travel Insurance policy shortly before he left for Aruba and that the accidental-death benefit covered only the length of their short trip.

The source told the AP that Giordano called the insurance company on Aug. 4, while the search for Gardner was still going on. He sought to confirm that the documents listing him as the insurance beneficiary had been received and wanted to begin redeeming the policy.

This person also said that records indicate Giordano asked whether any search costs would be covered by the policy.

The source did not have authorization to publicly release the information and agreed to speak with the AP only on condition of anonymity.

A spokeswoman for American Express, Gail Wasserman, said the company could not comment on any individual policies for privacy reasons.

http://www.wral.com/news/national_world/world/story/10014477/


Another interesting tidbit from that article is that it alleges that GG inquired into whether the beneficiary form had been received. If true, that answers a question earlier being discussed as to whether or not GG and RG filled out the documents at an AMEX office. I had suspected he mailed it in and this appears to confirm that.

What's particularly intriguing to me about this beneficiary form is that it supposedly has a witness signature on it as well. Wouldn't it be handy if that is a complete fabrication of a person by GG? It's very possible that witness will not be able to be tracked down, as it doesn't exist.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I find it interesting that nobody is covering this story in the news anymore. What's the deal?

 

[HatesSociopaths]

I find it interesting that nobody is covering this story in the news anymore. What's the deal?

It was on HLN tonight with JVV. Here is a link to transcript and clip from it:

Now joining me tonight, Tom Murphy, he`s the lawyer who represented the company Giordano actually sued; very happy to have you here. His dad is going all over the place saying my son is a man of good character. What do you know about Gary Giordano`s character and his relationship with money?

TOM MURPHY, ATTORNEY FOR COMPANY GIORDANO SUED: Well, when I was hired to represent the company that had been sued, I investigated it thoroughly and I learned and determined that Gary Giordano had fabricated a contract, had forged a signature of the alleged executive that was supposed to have signed it, fabricated another contract and basically made up a lie without the slightest foundation or substance to it.

The remarkable thing that I discovered is that Gary Giordano was prepared and did continue his lie all the way through to the court. He only dropped the case when faced with overwhelming evidence that he was going to lose. So it was just a remarkable story and one of the strangest cases I`ve ever been involved in.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1108/30/ijvm.01.html

 

[Overanalyst]

It's not necessarily about "whitewashing character" as it is uncovering the truth. Assuming her complete honesty would lend no continuity to this whole case; it doesn't even make sense. Everything so far leads me to believe she lived a double life and kept things private from everyone. So presuming what her friends and supposed "bf" have to say only creates more confusion as it contradicts the actions partaken in her life. I didn't mean it to offend and it shouldn't be taken personally; the whole objective is to find truth, not denigrate character. She is a victim no matter what.

Well spoken. I get butterflies when I see a slandering of one party vs. another.... let's not forget that everyone involved in this drama has a habit of filing/involvement in domestic situations of one type or another.... I'd venture to guess that many of the WS posters also have a story or two to tell... I have a problem with the 'presumption of guilt' attitude toward the accused without solid evidence. Is he creepy? No doubt. Is the presumed 'victim' of questionable character as well? Yes. Are her 'loved ones' the type that raise eyebrows? Yes. Recall that the condom and blood-spattered rock were false reports. I still maintain as I described in earlier posts that (MY OPINION ONLY) RG and GG were daywalking on ambien, drinking heavily, and something went wrong. Did they fight? I don't know. Pure speculation to date. I'm excited for the coming week to see what turns up. The case is weird....

 

[HatesSociopaths]

I found an earlier similar case, does not involve any people in RG case. Terry Sullivan murder. Sounds like detectives botched the criminal investigation. Wife cashed in on life insurance, see second link for full story, its interesting and from a family member.

http://www.spartaexpositor.com/articles/2010/01/28/news/doc4b61b36420048319973616.txt

http://www.insurance-forums.net/forum/life-insurance-forum/forgery-policy-t23796.html

 

[Overanalyst]

Of course, it could just as well be that CJ only thinks what Robyn wanted her to believe, maybe Robyn's 'truth of the moment'.

That's a BIG maybe there. There are still a number of possibilities on the table.

MAYBE CJ is protecting her friend or friend's reputation.

MAYBE CJ had wanted Robyn to breakup with RF for a long time, and wants to be clear, since Robyn isn't here to do it herself, that she "intended" to breakup with him.

MAYBE the relationship between Robyn and RF wasn't ever a romantic one. This leaves LOTS of possible interpretations.

Just because we emotionally do not want to believe any one or more of these does not change the fact that they are still on the table, no matter how a "friend" might steer things.

I'm trying to keep in mind that CJ says the relationship wasn't what people think (well, I didn't think anything at that point because I knew nothing) but she has not made one single clarifying statement as to what she meant by that or what their relationship REALLY was, since she "knows".

The innuendo followed by massive silence is, well, enigmatic. I can't put much stock in it until she clarifies. I certainly can't believe it lock, stock, and barrel, just because she said it.

If there's anything we've seen plenty of here at Websleuths, it's people involved in cases who don't always tell the truth, whether by design or not.

One thing that IS true is that things are not always what they seem to be.

A person, in their own opinion, may even glean from the vague and wildly speculative interviews given in full makeup and splendor that the friend is plugging for her own interests. I will always stand up for a best friend. But then again, I'm a guy, and I don't consider my best friends to be my barber or hair-extentionists (what is that about anyway???), unless I go missing in a semi-high-profile media case, and then I'm fair game to anyone who ever shook my hand. MY OPINION ONLY.

 

[Dushi]

Suspect in case of woman missing in Aruba to be in courtBy the CNN Wire Staff
August 31, 2011 5:47 a.m. EDT

Oranjestad, Aruba (CNN) -- A Maryland man held in Aruba in connection with the disappearance of an American woman could learn during a court hearing Wednesday if he will continue to be detained.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/08/31/aruba.missing.woman/index.html?eref=rss_topstories