Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #19

[nbates]

We don't claim to "know" we're simply surmising. Isn't this the point of the thread? Detectives run through scenarios too to try and get possibilities, it's just they then have to fit facts.

Sent from my SM-G930F using

i thought Detectives released the images in the hope of someone recognizing someone , I do not think for one second they played he said she said based on this picture

Correct. They did release these images to see if anyone in the public recognised him. Unfortunately it was many years after it happened when memories aren't as sharp.

Comments on possibilities of who said what to whom are not meant to be offensive or disrespectful to victim.

I was thinking out loud about MO possibilities and whether he carefully chose his victims or took his chance on random opportunities. Thinking of victim's movements (not leaving with her friends) and surmising about her reaction to the man who approaches in video (amongst other things).

My main interest in cases is on the psychological side - perpetrator profiling (not that I claim to be any good at it). How a predator selects their prey due to both personalities is very much relevant.

No disrespect intended to victim at all from my end, but I can understand how it looks cold or gossipy. Perhaps this is not the forum to post to - ?

 

[no name]

Correct. They did release these images to see if anyone in the public recognised him. Unfortunately it was many years after it happened when memories aren't as sharp.

Recognised him or someone else?
Plenty of examples through this case that have indicated what we were originally told and led to believe for many years, was not the actual police position today. Whos to say "all the other 700 people on the video were identified" has any truth?

 

[Frequant Flyer]

I no longer know what the purpose of this thread is but my reason for being here is this , I have knowledge of people and events that have been raised in this forum , once in a blue moon someone comes along with other factual knowledge which allows me to add to what I know and or add to theirs

The beauty of actually knowing things is it is easy to sort the wheat from the chaff ... Why I get annoyed with a lot of the hypertheticals is it's like Groundhog Day and they do nothing except put a lot of people of contributing

Facts are the only thing that lead anywhere and a lot of the hypertheticals are not even fact based , this forum had potential , but I think those days are long gone

 

[meticulously]

https://youtu.be/hbbg-FVij4c

For those who want to sleuth cctv,
Does anyone recognize R.Zak ?
This is another version of cctv footage,
Flect.

(Rzak deceased R.i.p is Not confirmed to be shown)

 

[meticulously]

We don't claim to "know" we're simply surmising. Isn't this the point of the thread? Detectives run through scenarios too to try and get possibilities, it's just they then have to fit facts.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

"We don't claim to "know" we're simply surmising.
Isn't this the point of the thread?"
"Detectives run through scenarios too to try and get possibilities, it's just they then have to fit facts. "


Detectives [emoji61] yes please .
The young poster is far from a real detectives posting .
It is better for a new poster to bring information rather than re-repeat old commentings imo .
See # frequant flyer above .

 

[MissUnderstood]

As it stands BRE has pled neither guilty or not guilty. At what point does a plea need to be entered? Is there a cut off time since charges were laid or is it a point in the legal process? What is the benefit to entering no plea?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Austom]

As it stands BRE has pled neither guilty or not guilty. At what point does a plea need to be entered? Is there a cut off time since charges were laid or is it a point in the legal process? What is the benefit to entering no plea?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would guess at the next hearing he will be required to plead. If he pleaded guilty then he will be remanded for sentencing however if he pleads not guilty then his defense can and will probable elect a judge only trial and a date will be set for that


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Owlie]

Were the 3 young men on cctv
do we know if they come forward to the police themselves with their info
was there corroboration from others on the street that they were actually there.

It made me wonder what would a person take in, late in the evening after having a few drinks, absorbed in your own conversation.

I am also wondering if the 'items' that Paul Ferguson said were found at the JR site had finally given up the info that caused the SS charge.

Do you mean the guys outside hungry jacks who saw Ciara? If so, isn’t Frankie one of them, that’s why he’s not allowed to discuss the case anymore?
If not, which guys do you mean?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[meticulously]

I no longer know what the purpose of this thread is but my reason for being here is this , I have knowledge of people and events that have been raised in this forum , once in a blue moon someone comes along with other factual knowledge which allows me to add to what I know and or add to theirs

The beauty of actually knowing things is it is easy to sort the wheat from the chaff ... Why I get annoyed with a lot of the hypertheticals is it's like Groundhog Day and they do nothing except put a lot of people of contributing

Facts are the only thing that lead anywhere and a lot of the hypertheticals are not even fact based , this forum had potential , but I think those days are long gone

"Why I get annoyed with a lot of the hypertheticals is it's like Groundhog Day"

Apologies to all , for the multiple low level time wasting posts .
Hopefully the once in a blue moon moment comes soon .
Remember over a year ago when the alleged CSK BRE was arrested , this forum went from quiet to loud and large ?
Nothing will ever come close to matching that .
The regular sleuths were forced out while hundreds of new posters rediscussed the last 20yrs of the case day by day for months. It took a while to settle down and sleuths could then discuss one topic at a time rather than face chaotic post bombarding.
Many people start and learn to sleuth and they get better at it. Many of us rookies to start off .
Perseverance is the key .
Keep at it you genuine folk [emoji111]

JmO

 

[Frequant Flyer]

"We don't claim to "know" we're simply surmising.
Isn't this the point of the thread?"
"Detectives run through scenarios too to try and get possibilities, it's just they then have to fit facts. "


Detectives [emoji61] yes please .
The young poster is far from a real detectives posting .
It is better for a new poster to bring information rather than re-repeat old commentings imo .
See # frequant flyer above .

I have always discounted the photos entirely , they are poor quality and the purpose was for identification , nothing else , I did not know anyone to identify them , so forget about it ... The amount of time wasted on these photos and mystery men who nobody knows is rediculous

Because of ignoring things like this my eyes have been open to things a lot of others missed ... This is the problem with theories , people only see things that suit their agenda ... I am not alone in my way of doing things , there are a others who do the same

Following facts actually leads you to places where you find more of them .... I thought I had run out of ways of following the people I am interested in ... One tiny little fact on here led me find years worth of information I would have missed entirely , and that info confirmed even more what was already known

 

[Owlie]

Everyone is entitled to post and discuss and voice their opinions on whatever part of the topic they want, as long as they don’t breach the terms of reference and in my opinion they don’t hurt anyone else.
I personally enjoy reading the posts that theorise and try to understand different scenarios. If you don’t, don’t read them. I get annoyed by posts that are judgmental and critical of other posters. If you have something that you think is better to offer, then just post it, don’t criticise other people. If you’re annoyed, stop reading the posts. Everyone is entitled to post their opinions. No-one owns this thread except the mods and the owner of Websleuths. MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Akai]

I don't see why there would be any problem with people analyzing what may or may not have been said or done in any context of this case.

The fact is that it is unsolved, even by police, after 20 years. An apparent breakthrough only came after going through old evidence of other cases to look at DNA with updated testing procedures. They may still have it wrong. Heck, pulling random names out of a hat for all that time may have been more effective.

Moreover, not one person (that we know of), has had enough "inside" information to figure out what has happened. Any one of us could have spent time with the CSK (because we still don't know who that is) and not had a clue. Any one of us could still be spending time with the CSK and not have a clue.

So how can anyone know what's relevant or what isn't? The only person who could say that is someone who knows who the CSK is for certain.

It was a big question for police whether these women were lured by someone they knew, lured by a smart-talking stranger, or whether they were taken by blitz attacks. They may have evidence, or they may still just have theories.

Profilers do spend a lot of time assessing the psychology of these cases - looking at patterns and body language and personalities. Figuring out the interaction between people does lead to lines of inquiry. Cases have been solved this way. Wasn't it profilers who linked the KK matter to the killings, and this was then dismissed by police?

JMO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Canning Vale]

With regard to the use of hypotheticals. Due to legalities, forum members have taken much care in broaching various conversations - sometimes using hypotheticals. Forum members have needed to be very tactful with what they’ve posted.

Most people from Perth have either been told or are aware of various snippets of information or knowledge. A few forum members are originally from Huntingdale and the neighbouring suburbs of Gosnells, Thornlie and Canning Vale - BRE has distinctive characteristics and known to the locals - one forum member had kids who went to the same high school and knew him and one of his siblings personally.

If anyone had expansive knowledge of the CSK's events he would have been caught much sooner. Perhaps we’ll be surprised how many people have had an incident – and incidents dating back to when he was quite young.

Hopefully those of you with personal knowledge have already notified Crime Stoppers as well as the media. Any people with worthwhile information will possibly be approached by an author.

 

[janwa]

I've never felt sure that MM is CSK, but every time I recall that everyone in the video has been identified or come forward except for MM, it does makes you wonder. As has been speculated before, unless MM was from interstate / overseas, died etc., why would he have not come forward? The very fact that anyone would have been in the area on the night should have been enough to pique their interest on the investigation, or at least talking about it with family / friends which it felt like just about everyone in Perth did especially at the time.

There are many possibilities as to why MM didn't come forward 2 others being.

Connection to CSK

Connection to another serious crime

 

[Credulious]

With regard to the use of hypotheticals. Due to legalities, forum members have taken much care in broaching various conversations - sometimes using hypotheticals. Forum members have needed to be very tactful with what they’ve posted.

Most people from Perth have either been told or are aware of various snippets of information or knowledge. A few forum members are originally from Huntingdale and the neighbouring suburbs of Gosnells, Thornlie and Canning Vale - BRE has distinctive characteristics and known to the locals - one forum members had kids who went to the same high school and knew him and sibling personally.

In all honesty, if anyone did have any knowledge of the CSK events he would have been caught much sooner. Perhaps we’ll be surprised how many people have had an incident – and incidents dating back to when he was quite young.

Hopefully those of you with personal knowledge have already notified Crime Stoppers as well as the media. Any people with worthwhile information will possibly be approached by an author.

To be honst, most people dont give a crap.

Many dont want media attention

Some went to police ending up in the heat

Many $1 million dollar rewards now are indicitive of society

There was that much info that police were turning away information.

One police officer had a guy in a Commodore with a fully lined boot.

Even he was turned away

 

[meticulously]

Claremont serial killings: Murder suspect Bradley Robert Edwards in Perth court
Elle Farcic | PerthNow
February 28, 2018 9:25AM

"Mr Edwards is allegedly the man behind the abduction and degrading rape of a 17-year-old girl who was walking through Rowe Park in Claremont in February 1995."

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/cr...bert-edwards-in-perth-court-ng-b88759381z.amp

 

[janwa]

I would guess at the next hearing he will be required to plead. If he pleaded guilty then he will be remanded for sentencing however if he pleads not guilty then his defense can and will probable elect a judge only trial and a date will be set for that Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He was ready to plead then

Lawyers for the prosecution Carmel Barbagallo argued the case needed to be adjourned so that documents relating to the murder charge for Ms Spiers and previous information could be collated and made available to all parties.
Mr Edwards’ defence lawyer Genevieve Cleary agreed adjournment until July 25 was “eminently suitable” so they could go over all the relevant information.

 

[meticulously]

Claremont serial killings: no plea from Bradley Robert Edwards; case adjourned for committal hearing
February 28th, 2018, 09:34AMWritten by Jon Bassett*Western Suburbs Weekly

"A commital mention is a preliminary hearing prior to the full committal hearing. Permission to cross-examine witnesses may be given, matters in dispute will be discussed and a date for the committal hearing can be set at this stage.
The Court may also hear and determine some charges if the accused pleads guilty."

https://www.communitynews.com.au/we...ert-edwards-case-adjourned-committal-hearing/

 

[Frequant Flyer]

Claremont serial killings: no plea from Bradley Robert Edwards; case adjourned for committal hearing
February 28th, 2018, 09:34AMWritten by Jon Bassett*Western Suburbs Weekly

"A commital mention is a preliminary hearing prior to the full committal hearing. Permission to cross-examine witnesses may be given, matters in dispute will be discussed and a date for the committal hearing can be set at this stage.
The Court may also hear and determine some charges if the accused pleads guilty."

https://www.communitynews.com.au/we...ert-edwards-case-adjourned-committal-hearing/

Here is is away that could have led to his arrest , his photo appears in the local paper and he is recognized by a former victim , this is just a fact based hypothetical of course

 

[Credulious]

Here is is away that could have led to his arrest , his photo appears in the local paper and he is recognized by a former victim , this is just a fact based hypothetical of course

I reckon you would be struggling to relate that image to an assault that happened 20 years ago.

The physical appearance through age and excessive weight gain has left him looking not even remotely like his mid 20s

Look at the fat around the face.

Most people wouldn't recognise him IMHO