Found Deceased Australia - Gary Tweddle, 23, Blue Mountains NSW, 16 July 2013 - #3
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FigTree
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I am wondering then, what evidence there was to say that Gary took a particular path?
Maybe they have Gary's phone, but aren't saying anything about what they have found.
.
FigTree
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Coroners Report on Sarah Rawson. Read More...
I wonder if they will make Gary's Report a public document at some stage, once the findings are handed down after the Inquest.
SouthAussie
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Thanks FigTree, that was an interesting read. I agree - it would be interesting to see the inquest findings of Gary's death, once it is ready - especially as we have all been so invested in the case, and so hoped for a good outcome for Gary. I wonder if any media will apply for it through the FOI act, seeing as this was such a high-profile case.
Moya Point
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Ref post no.215 from Indigo7 the phone tower locations can be found here - http://maps.spench.net/rf/#=-33.7265937,150.3361619&zoom=14&type=hybrid&auto_fetch=true&clustering=true&cluster_level=17&filter=%5B%7B%22site_desc%22%3A%22mobile%20spectrum%20licensing%22%7D%2C%7B%22client_name%22%3A%22optus%22%7D%2C%7B%22client_name%22%3A%22telstra%22%7D%2C%7B%22client_name%22%3A%22vodafone%22%7D%2C%7B%22client_name%22%3A%22hutchison%22%7D%5D&q=s%20%22mobile%20spectrum%20licensing%22%2C%20c%20optus%2C%20c%20telstra%2C%20c%20vodafone%2C%20c%20hutchison
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I don't think it can and I also don't think suicide can be completely ruled out..
SouthAussie
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Interesting, Moya Point ... that tower in Katoomba could have provided some reception on that side of Sublime Point. Reception may have even extended down the cliff face for a little while, depending which directions the tower is focused on and elevation levels.
Does anyone know if Katoomba sits higher in elevation than Sublime Point, or lower in elevation?
That could change things a bit.
Great link .. thanks!
Moya Point
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Hi SouthAussie, from the attached elevations taken from www.wildwalks.com, if GT's phone was using a plan on Telstra then the towers are located in these locations. Optus is different. IMO assuming he was on Telstra, then Katoomba tower has a street level of approx 1000m + extra height for tower and Sublime Point is approx 910m minus 20m = 890m? Leura is 985 street level + tower height.
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SouthAussie
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Thanks Moya Point. I did a little digging around, and I have a sneaking suspicion that Oracle uses the Vodafone network (Oracle ran a big project with Vodafone Hutchison Australia to upgrade the Oracle Network API Platform last month). Vodafone has a sharing agreement with Optus for 3G/4G services.
So I think we need to look at Optus towers in the area.
The only designated Optus tower (3G/4G) I can see is in Kedumba Park, Wentworth Falls (other side of Great Western Highway) – which I don’t believe would allow any reception where Gary was found down the cliff face. Unless you can find another Optus tower in the area?
We could be back to square one … with Gary falling at around 3am or later. Unless, of course, he lost his phone earlier somewhere else, at a higher unobstructed elevation (mobile-wise). In which case, would he leave that spot without his phone?
http://maps.spench.net/rf/#=-33.720...dafone,&tiles=[{"t":"u/black"},{"t":"s/all"}]
http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/1998897
So I think we need to look at Optus towers in the area.
The only designated Optus tower (3G/4G) I can see is in Kedumba Park, Wentworth Falls (other side of Great Western Highway) – which I don’t believe would allow any reception where Gary was found down the cliff face. Unless you can find another Optus tower in the area?
We could be back to square one … with Gary falling at around 3am or later. Unless, of course, he lost his phone earlier somewhere else, at a higher unobstructed elevation (mobile-wise). In which case, would he leave that spot without his phone?
http://maps.spench.net/rf/#=-33.720...dafone,&tiles=[{"t":"u/black"},{"t":"s/all"}]
http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/1998897
SouthAussie
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Amazing that they can pour big money into sponsoring their contender in the America's Cup, but they won't pay their employee's huge strip club bill that was charged on their credit card during the time of their corporate event.
May be an unauthorised 'purchase' .. but you'd think they would want the negative publicity to go away.
Hi, new user here.
I'm a Leura local, hence interest in this case.
The discussion on mobiles is interesting. The map up thread doesn't have the latest info, which is a tower on top of the Spires development next to Leura train station. That tower serves Optus and Vodafone. Across the road is a Telstra tower on top of the Hillcrest Coachman. Both locations would have close to line of site to where Gary was found less than 1km as the crow flies.
Coverage for all carriers would be very good in that area.
I also believe Oracle staff phones are on Vodafone as part of a global deal, but there was no mention of whether his phone was work supplied or personal.
Since iphones will track the users location while they are active unless you turn the feature off, I am very interested to find out what it says happened.
Also, the phone networks are able to triangulate individual phone subscribers to give their locations as long as the phone is powered, regardless of the device settings, so the phone company involved should be able to also supply some info.
Whether this will have the granularity to show Gary's movements I don't know. It may be the case that his signal was only coming from one tower, and it requires more than one to accurately locate the handset position.
And a final comment on the idea that there are bodies out in the bush.
I am sure there are, it is a really, really huge expanse, with very, very few pathways.
Imagine standing on a headland looking out to sea with nothing in view as far as the eye can see. That is what it is like looking out over the bush here, at an area of wilderness almost as big as Sydney. There is no way a search could ever hope to cover even a tiny fraction of this landscape.
I think the local setup is hard for some non-locals to understand. The town is really set up like a suburb in the city. Houses are on generous blocks, but very few get bigger than half an acre. The built up area is surrounded by dense bush, often with a cliff edge.
It isn't the case that the houses peter out as you get further away from town, with a very few exceptions it is normal suburbia until you hit bush.
The lookout where Gary was found is a 5min drive from Woolworths, very much not some remote place.
The road to the lookout does have some vacant lots that are still bushland, and a stretch near the end of bush, but I find it hard to credit anybody walking it would feel they were not very near a built up area.
It seems to me the inquest (do we know when it is scheduled?) must attempt to address why Gary left the hotel, his movements afterward, and a plausible explanation for why he left the road to enter bushland before his fall.
I'm a Leura local, hence interest in this case.
The discussion on mobiles is interesting. The map up thread doesn't have the latest info, which is a tower on top of the Spires development next to Leura train station. That tower serves Optus and Vodafone. Across the road is a Telstra tower on top of the Hillcrest Coachman. Both locations would have close to line of site to where Gary was found less than 1km as the crow flies.
Coverage for all carriers would be very good in that area.
I also believe Oracle staff phones are on Vodafone as part of a global deal, but there was no mention of whether his phone was work supplied or personal.
Since iphones will track the users location while they are active unless you turn the feature off, I am very interested to find out what it says happened.
Also, the phone networks are able to triangulate individual phone subscribers to give their locations as long as the phone is powered, regardless of the device settings, so the phone company involved should be able to also supply some info.
Whether this will have the granularity to show Gary's movements I don't know. It may be the case that his signal was only coming from one tower, and it requires more than one to accurately locate the handset position.
And a final comment on the idea that there are bodies out in the bush.
I am sure there are, it is a really, really huge expanse, with very, very few pathways.
Imagine standing on a headland looking out to sea with nothing in view as far as the eye can see. That is what it is like looking out over the bush here, at an area of wilderness almost as big as Sydney. There is no way a search could ever hope to cover even a tiny fraction of this landscape.
I think the local setup is hard for some non-locals to understand. The town is really set up like a suburb in the city. Houses are on generous blocks, but very few get bigger than half an acre. The built up area is surrounded by dense bush, often with a cliff edge.
It isn't the case that the houses peter out as you get further away from town, with a very few exceptions it is normal suburbia until you hit bush.
The lookout where Gary was found is a 5min drive from Woolworths, very much not some remote place.
The road to the lookout does have some vacant lots that are still bushland, and a stretch near the end of bush, but I find it hard to credit anybody walking it would feel they were not very near a built up area.
It seems to me the inquest (do we know when it is scheduled?) must attempt to address why Gary left the hotel, his movements afterward, and a plausible explanation for why he left the road to enter bushland before his fall.
SouthAussie
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Welcome Werkal .. thanks for the local info!
There is a media thread for articles pertaining to Gary (address in FigTree's signature). Somewhere in there it says that Apple were unable to help with GPS tracking data for Gary. It also says the carrier was unable to triangulate the signal - they could only say the pings came from an area 4-10km from a tower, and ceased around 3am.
I think we are presuming that Gary's phone was a work phone, as he was on a work function held during the week, and may have needed client data, access to Oracle systems, etc while away.
Inquest is 22nd Nov, I believe.
(And as an aside .. I see this morning that Oracle won the America's Cup)
There is a media thread for articles pertaining to Gary (address in FigTree's signature). Somewhere in there it says that Apple were unable to help with GPS tracking data for Gary. It also says the carrier was unable to triangulate the signal - they could only say the pings came from an area 4-10km from a tower, and ceased around 3am.
I think we are presuming that Gary's phone was a work phone, as he was on a work function held during the week, and may have needed client data, access to Oracle systems, etc while away.
Inquest is 22nd Nov, I believe.
(And as an aside .. I see this morning that Oracle won the America's Cup)
To me the article says a lot about the company in many regards.....
"The five-day conference is the most important educational and networking event of the year for Oracle technologists, customers, and partners."
And it's held at a strip club? Not exactly a family orientated five day conference but maybe I am old fashioned. Wonder how the female employees responded to the venue choice?
Leads me to think that drgs wouldn't not be at least thought about in the psyche of the company's upper echelon?
Wonder what entertainment was provided for the boys in Leura?
Humdinger
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I think the strip club was next to the conference venue.
lease:
bearbear
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the "american" team had only one token american crew member the majority were nzers and australians!
With regard to Apple not being able to track his phone, that is true, but the device will have logged location information while it was powered. So assuming the phone has been recovered, it should be able to show a log of some of his movements, for example the time he passed any houses with wi-fi routers or which cell towers he was in range of. This data is not available to Apple, but is stored on the phone for the previous 7 days.
See the links below for details:
http://www.dailytech.com/Apple+is+T...+Easily+Mapped+With+OS+X+App/article21429.htm
and:
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/04/27Apple-Q-A-on-Location-Data.html
See the links below for details:
http://www.dailytech.com/Apple+is+T...+Easily+Mapped+With+OS+X+App/article21429.htm
and:
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/04/27Apple-Q-A-on-Location-Data.html