Doesitmakesense
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Australia - JS, 32 y.o. man, charged w/ murder of 9 y.o. girl , Mt Wilson, 13 January 2022 #2
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Marg944
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I wonder how JS felt about KM being pregnant??IMO
Also I am trying to understand how CM came to be with JS alone overnight? IMO
Did JS offer this option because he knew KM was going to be wasted/tired etc??? IMO
Or did he want to teach KM a lesson and make her suffer?? JMO
Alleged killer of 9yo girl changed story hours after first police interview, court told
A NSW Supreme Court jury is played the second police interview with Justin Stein that records a key difference from his first.www.abc.net.au
The accused told police Ms Mutten started causing fights as soon as Charlise arrived in Sydney in December, 2021.
"Ever since [Charlise] has come our whole relationship has gone to s***," he said.
Mr Stein denied he was "jealous" of Charlise and had been upset that she was there.
"I have no problem with Charlise ... I look at her like literally my daughter," he said.
Charlise Mutten had an apparently happy Christmas with her mother. Weeks later, she was dead
Justin Stein is on trial accused of murdering the nine-year-old, whose body was found in a barrel in the Blue Mountains. Prosecutors laid out their case to the jury this weekwww.theguardian.com
Mutten and Stein were caught on camera in August 2021, breaking into a house in the Blue Mountains. During the break in they allegedly stole two rifles – a BSA .22 calibre bolt action and Winchester .30 calibre lever action – and one of those is central to the crown case, prosecutor Ken McKay SC said.
I don't understand how this crime didn't affect KM's chance of having special holiday custody of CM when she was involved with JS in this crime together in August way before December school holidays. How was that a good option for CM?? MOO
I also thought it very odd to allow Charlise to stay with the two people in question, but it looks like Kallista and Stein weren’t charged with the break and enter and stealing until LE discovered the hidden guns a few months after Charlise’s death, from this article dated September 2022.
The article states that it was during the investigation into Charlise’s disappearance that they discovered the stolen items (but not the guns) and then charged the two. Which I find confusing, as I thought there was CCTV with audio, of the pair breaking into the property.
“Kallista Mutten, mother of allegedly murdered Charlise, pleads guilty over home invasion
As a result of investigations into Charlise’s death, police “identified several linked offences”.Police charged Stein with aggravated break and enter of a Mount Wilson property on the Blue Mountains, which is alleged to have taken place in late August 2021.
“In July this year, Mutten was also charged with accompanying Stein on the break-in.
Almost five months after the alleged invasion on January 14, Mutten reported Charlise missing to Police.
When officers arrived to the property she was staying at with Stein, also located at Mount Wilson, police searched bushland and found a “buried galvanised toolbox” covered by a blue tarp, dirt and foliage.
“Police located identical clothing, gloves and hiking boots captured in the CCTV...the screwdriver and silverware,” court documents state.
The items were forensically examined, with Stein’s DNA allegedly found on the gloves.
Four days later, Charlise was found dead with a post mortem revealing the cause of death was a gunshot, but police could not find any guns, according to court documents.
A member of the public alerted police to a “suspicious area of disturbed ground” off a fire trail in Mount Wilson on January 30, where police discovered a buried blue tarp with more camouflage, foliage and dirt.
According to court documents, multiple items were found including a BSA .22 calibre bolt action rifle, Winchester Level Action 3030 shotgun, empty magazine clip from the rifle, ammunition, a bag with spent/unused cartridges, and black garbage bags.
Stein’s fingerprints were allegedly found on the rifle, and ballistics examinations of the firearm identified characteristics consistent with the firearm used in the alleged murder, but investigators were unable to make a definitive comparison.”
I'm going with Tuesday 11 January for J & allegedly C departure from the caravan park, because:
He also changed the timeline for the last time he saw Charlise, saying she stayed with her mother on the night of January 11 while he returned to the Mount Wilson property alone.
That was counter to what he initially told police, that Charlise stayed with him alone at the Mount Wilson property that night - making him the last person to have seen her.
Alleged schoolgirl killer blamed lies to police on child's mother
www.9news.com.au
I'm also putting Thursday 13 January as the day he was photographed driving with the barrel.
The jury had previously been shown CCTV footage from January 13, a day before Mr Stein was interviewed by police.
The prosecution allege that footage shows Mr Stein driving to different locations while towing a boat and with the body of Charlise Mutten in a barrel on the tray of his ute.
Crown P[ro]secutor Ken McKay SC said the accused was looking for somewhere to dump the body before eventually landing on pushing it off a ravine near the Colo river.
Alleged killer of 9yo girl changed story hours after first police interview, court told
A NSW Supreme Court jury is played the second police interview with Justin Stein that records a key difference from his first.
www.abc.net.au
Marg944
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I wonder what form of STD JS was brewing….. the common treatment for some STD’s is penicillin injection, which I believe is quite painful… oh well!
“The penicillin injections (long-acting benzathine penicillin G) are invariably painful because of the large volume that is injected, the viscosity and possibly the irritant nature of the solution.”
And I wonder if he worried about the fact that he may have passed his disease onto KM and the baby in utero! Mindless!!!
“The penicillin injections (long-acting benzathine penicillin G) are invariably painful because of the large volume that is injected, the viscosity and possibly the irritant nature of the solution.”
And I wonder if he worried about the fact that he may have passed his disease onto KM and the baby in utero! Mindless!!!
11 Jan, Justin leaves caravan park for Mt Wilson, disputedly with Charlise. 8:20pm text from Justin to K saying he was cooking chicken, Charlise watching TV and playing with balloons.
12 Jan, Justin collects K from caravan park, they drive around inner Sydney and buy drugs, and spend the night at Mt Wilson.
13 Jan, Justin & K quarrel, she takes his car to a nearby campsite. Hostile voicemail messages. Also that day, Justin drives around with barrel containing Charlise and ultimately dumps it in a river.
14 Jan, 8:12am K reports Charlise missing.
This means that Charlise's body was on the property or nearby when Justin brought K back to Mt Wilson?
He disposed of Charlise's body after K took his car? Did he get it back, or use a different car? (Answer: she left the home in his red Holden Colorado ute in the early hours of January 13 . . . and had a “bit of a confrontation” with him when she returned, before she “once again took off in his car” later that morning. ‘I’ve got my guns, I’m going to kill you’: Justin Stein’s alleged threat to Charlise’s mother )
(edited for various additions)
12 Jan, Justin collects K from caravan park, they drive around inner Sydney and buy drugs, and spend the night at Mt Wilson.
13 Jan, Justin & K quarrel, she takes his car to a nearby campsite. Hostile voicemail messages. Also that day, Justin drives around with barrel containing Charlise and ultimately dumps it in a river.
14 Jan, 8:12am K reports Charlise missing.
This means that Charlise's body was on the property or nearby when Justin brought K back to Mt Wilson?
He disposed of Charlise's body after K took his car? Did he get it back, or use a different car? (Answer: she left the home in his red Holden Colorado ute in the early hours of January 13 . . . and had a “bit of a confrontation” with him when she returned, before she “once again took off in his car” later that morning. ‘I’ve got my guns, I’m going to kill you’: Justin Stein’s alleged threat to Charlise’s mother )
(edited for various additions)
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Does anyone have a time of day for when Justin was driving around trying to find a disposal site? He's been telling K he's going to tell police she killed her daughter, and that he's going to kill her (K), and a lot of hateful stuff, and the same day he spends hours seeking to dump the barrel. Defence counsel is saying that he disposed of Charlise to protect K. I mean, he was in the reverse of a protective mood that morning.
Marg944
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“Police allege Stein was behind the wheel when the red ute visited the BP service station at Marsden Park, in northwestern Sydney at 5.53pm on Thursday, January 13.
It was then captured driving along Victoria and Bayswater roads at Drummoyne around 7.20pm when Stein allegedly drove it to Five Dock boat ramp.”
Justin Stein accused murderer Charlise Mutten faces new charge
Justin Stein, charged with the alleged murder of nine-year-old girl Charlise Mutten, whose body was found dumped in a barrel, on a Sydney riverbank in January, has faced court on a drug charge.
Thank you. Definitely after the threats then.“Police allege Stein was behind the wheel when the red ute visited the BP service station at Marsden Park, in northwestern Sydney at 5.53pm on Thursday, January 13.
It was then captured driving along Victoria and Bayswater roads at Drummoyne around 7.20pm when Stein allegedly drove it to Five Dock boat ramp.”
Justin Stein accused murderer Charlise Mutten faces new charge
Justin Stein, charged with the alleged murder of nine-year-old girl Charlise Mutten, whose body was found dumped in a barrel, on a Sydney riverbank in January, has faced court on a drug charge.www.dailymail.co.uk
Marg944
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Found this image of Stein’s Ute with the assumed barrel under the blue tarp. This image from Drummoyne has a time stamp.
Marg944
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The wording about telephone conversations has got me very confused. Was JS discussing things with KM?
This is from a news article back in January, 2022.
“Police revealed in a press conference on Wednesday they will allege Stein discussed buying sandbags and boat fuel before later travelling to the riverbed where his stepdaughter's body was later found.
(There were) a number of telephone conversations, to purchase a number of sandbags,' Deputy Police Commissioner David Hudson said.”
www.dailymail.co.uk
And another news article…
Deputy Commissioner Hudson said police pounced after allegedly finding “inconsistencies” in versions of events provided by Stein.
He revealed the accused murderer held phone conversations with the child’s mother on Thursday, days before her body was found.
“(There were) a number of telephone conversations with the girl’s mother, to purchase a number of sandbags - 20 kilo sandbags from the hardware store - to fuel a boat and then try and float that boat on the water at one of the one of the docks in inner Sydney,” he said.”
This is from a news article back in January, 2022.
“Police revealed in a press conference on Wednesday they will allege Stein discussed buying sandbags and boat fuel before later travelling to the riverbed where his stepdaughter's body was later found.
(There were) a number of telephone conversations, to purchase a number of sandbags,' Deputy Police Commissioner David Hudson said.”
Charlise Mutten: Stepdad allegedly drove for hours with her body
The nine-year-old's body was found on Tuesday night in scrub near the Colo River - an hour from where she disappeared on a private property in Mount Wilson, in the NSW Blue Mountains.
And another news article…
Deputy Commissioner Hudson said police pounced after allegedly finding “inconsistencies” in versions of events provided by Stein.
He revealed the accused murderer held phone conversations with the child’s mother on Thursday, days before her body was found.
“(There were) a number of telephone conversations with the girl’s mother, to purchase a number of sandbags - 20 kilo sandbags from the hardware store - to fuel a boat and then try and float that boat on the water at one of the one of the docks in inner Sydney,” he said.”
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nightrider17
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Do you think that maybe KM was told about CM's death and that JS would take care of it by buying sandbags etc??
www.abc.net.au
The court heard Kallista Mutten drove off with Mr Stein's ute the next morning to a nearby camp site after the couple had an argument, where she texted him saying "you're a liar, cheat and now lost my daughter".
The court heard some of her other messages included "I'm not losing her over you" and I "I just want my daughter".
I just can't help thinking she must have become aware during that period of taking the car several times. IMO
If she thought her daughter ran away into the bush - then eventually it becomes untenable to just hope her daughter turns up surely??? IMO
Surely KM is aware of something the next day when JS is doing all they driving around and not helping to locate her daughter???. IMO
The jury has also been shown CCTV footage from the next day, January 13, which the prosecution allege shows Mr Stein driving to different locations with the body of Charlise Mutten in a barrel on the tray of his ute.
I wonder where CM's body was stored that night of 12th JAN ?? horrible thought of where she was?? MOO
Could it have been in the back of the car when KM took JS's car?? Surely not yet?? Is that why JS went off his brain?? MOO
'I'm the worst father': Text messages from man accused of killing 9yo stepdaughter revealed
Justin Stein, the man accused of killing Charlise Mutten, texted the nine-year-old's mother than he was "the worst father" on day police believe he murdered her.
www.abc.net.au
The court heard Kallista Mutten drove off with Mr Stein's ute the next morning to a nearby camp site after the couple had an argument, where she texted him saying "you're a liar, cheat and now lost my daughter".
The court heard some of her other messages included "I'm not losing her over you" and I "I just want my daughter".
I just can't help thinking she must have become aware during that period of taking the car several times. IMO
If she thought her daughter ran away into the bush - then eventually it becomes untenable to just hope her daughter turns up surely??? IMO
Surely KM is aware of something the next day when JS is doing all they driving around and not helping to locate her daughter???. IMO
The jury has also been shown CCTV footage from the next day, January 13, which the prosecution allege shows Mr Stein driving to different locations with the body of Charlise Mutten in a barrel on the tray of his ute.
I wonder where CM's body was stored that night of 12th JAN ?? horrible thought of where she was?? MOO
Could it have been in the back of the car when KM took JS's car?? Surely not yet?? Is that why JS went off his brain?? MOO
I think Justin was trying to tell K from almost the beginning--"I'm a terrible father" etc. He wanted her to take over the cover-up, at least the thinking part. I wonder if the fight on the morning of the 13th wasn't over his 'cheating' but because he said Charlise was lost in the woods or else admitted she'd died and he had her out there somewhere, he wasn't telling K where. And then he absolutely, urgently did need his car, to move the body before K inevitably called the police. I find it a bit suss that she didn't call the police for two nights and a day and then after the body was dumped on the evening/night of the 13th she promptly called police the next morning. Did he give her permission at last, or did they come to an understanding after the fight and before he drove off on his disposal mission?Do you think that maybe KM was told about CM's death and that JS would take care of it by buying sandbags etc??
'I'm the worst father': Text messages from man accused of killing 9yo stepdaughter revealed
Justin Stein, the man accused of killing Charlise Mutten, texted the nine-year-old's mother than he was "the worst father" on day police believe he murdered her.
The court heard Kallista Mutten drove off with Mr Stein's ute the next morning to a nearby camp site after the couple had an argument, where she texted him saying "you're a liar, cheat and now lost my daughter".
The court heard some of her other messages included "I'm not losing her over you" and I "I just want my daughter".
I just can't help thinking she must have become aware during that period of taking the car several times. IMO
If she thought her daughter ran away into the bush - then eventually it becomes untenable to just hope her daughter turns up surely??? IMO
Surely KM is aware of something the next day when JS is doing all they driving around and not helping to locate her daughter???. IMO
The jury has also been shown CCTV footage from the next day, January 13, which the prosecution allege shows Mr Stein driving to different locations with the body of Charlise Mutten in a barrel on the tray of his ute.
I wonder where CM's body was stored that night of 12th JAN ?? horrible thought of where she was?? MOO
Could it have been in the back of the car when KM took JS's car?? Surely not yet?? Is that why JS went off his brain?? MOO
nightrider17
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I think JLZ that what you propose seems really likely.
That at some point - during those 2 days and nights KM came to know the likely fate of her daughter (I mean where was she and with whom she's only 9?? what would you be telling yourself to not be worried??) and reality of what would happen next for her and him made her hesitate in actually doing the right thing for her daughter. IMO
I think her taking his car - at 2 different times - makes me think that's when she knew at that point it most likely was a fatal incident not just vomitting.MOO
I seem to remember she didn't talk to the police for ages after she made the 000 call and they came to investigate. She had a breakdown and went to a facility. IMO
www.dailymail.co.uk
Ms Mutten only moved into the building this week following a lengthy stint in hospital under medical supervision after she suffered an 'episode' in the hours after reporting Charlise missing.
The charity-run building houses single parents, pregnant women and vulnerable people needing urgent temporary accommodation.
The neighbour said she then heard another woman in the building comfort Ms Mutten, who then tearfully revealed she was pregnant.
'I heard her say she's pregnant,' the neighbour said.
So why should she get a lot of leniency because of this?? Yes JS is obviously volatile and impulsive and possibly violent??
But she could have driven his car all the way to a police station. I mean that was a bold move by her taking his car in the first place - and she apparently took it twice.
She could have got some assistance at that point. Especially if she thought CM was still alive. But if she already knew she wasn't - then what would be the point?? She would be in trouble too?? IMO
I wonder if she didn't want her dream of marrying JS and living this illusion to end and that was more important to her than to own up to her addiction which was still current and active and likely led to her making decisions that contributed to putting CM in harms way.IMO
That at some point - during those 2 days and nights KM came to know the likely fate of her daughter (I mean where was she and with whom she's only 9?? what would you be telling yourself to not be worried??) and reality of what would happen next for her and him made her hesitate in actually doing the right thing for her daughter. IMO
I think her taking his car - at 2 different times - makes me think that's when she knew at that point it most likely was a fatal incident not just vomitting.MOO
I seem to remember she didn't talk to the police for ages after she made the 000 call and they came to investigate. She had a breakdown and went to a facility. IMO
PICTURED: Kallista Mutten after learning her daughter was shot dead
Nine-year-old Charlise was allegedly shot once before her body was stuffed into a barrel and dumped in scrub near the Colo River Mutten's fiancé Justin Stein remains in jail accused of her murder..
Ms Mutten only moved into the building this week following a lengthy stint in hospital under medical supervision after she suffered an 'episode' in the hours after reporting Charlise missing.
The charity-run building houses single parents, pregnant women and vulnerable people needing urgent temporary accommodation.
The neighbour said she then heard another woman in the building comfort Ms Mutten, who then tearfully revealed she was pregnant.
'I heard her say she's pregnant,' the neighbour said.
So why should she get a lot of leniency because of this?? Yes JS is obviously volatile and impulsive and possibly violent??
But she could have driven his car all the way to a police station. I mean that was a bold move by her taking his car in the first place - and she apparently took it twice.
She could have got some assistance at that point. Especially if she thought CM was still alive. But if she already knew she wasn't - then what would be the point?? She would be in trouble too?? IMO
I wonder if she didn't want her dream of marrying JS and living this illusion to end and that was more important to her than to own up to her addiction which was still current and active and likely led to her making decisions that contributed to putting CM in harms way.IMO
katydid23
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I'm not sure if K had independent transport. She might have insisted, but if Justin was the one with the car, and not persuadable, her options were to go along with him and eventually get back to Charlise, or remain at the caravan park, a couple of hours' drive away.
Yes, supposedly that's (12 Jan) when Justin told K that Charlise was supervised by his mother's friend the real estate lady who was . . . something about an auction. Then he said he didn't tell K that, but that that was a silly story she foisted on him. I think it's a bit too specific to Justin's family to be entirely K's invention; and her calling the hospitals looks like she genuinely believed it.
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