Australia - JS, 32 y.o. man, charged w/ murder of 9 y.o. girl , Mt Wilson, 13 January 2022

[Marg944]

Yes, well I have seen it said (here) that he wasn't at the estate that morning. But I haven't seen an MSM link. I don't know if that is true. I think it is speculation because some were wondering why he wasn't interviewed at the estate.

He did drive himself to Penrith for a formal interview ... and then his ute was impounded.

I just found it...... but then this article states that KM rang Triple 0.... when other media states it was JS. Hard to know who to believe! But, for our purposes, we aren't going crazy, we did in fact read that KM was not with JS at Wildenstein on the Friday morning when Police first arrived.

"Around 4.30am on Friday, Mount Wilson resident CH was reading a book in bed when she heard the sound of a vehicle on the driveway of the neighbouring property, Wildenstein.

She got out of bed and went to the window from which she could see the shadow of a vehicle without its headlights on moving along the driveway.

Almost four hours later a person, believed to be KM, dialled Triple-0 to report that CM was missing from the Wildenstein property.

When police arrived, KM was present at the estate without the company of her fiance and during an informal round of police questions she had 'a medical episode' and was taken to Blue Mountains Hospital at Katoomba.

Police began to search Wildenstein and then a wider search of the Mount Wilson and Mount Irvine areas was initiated, with SES and RFS volunteers calling in to participate.

On Friday afternoon, JS drove his ute to High Street, Penrith and entered Penrith Police station and spoke with detectives.

Police seized his parked ute and impounded it, towing it away to a location for forensic examination; officers also seized the motor boat from Wildenstein estate."


JS not interviewed at Wildenstein

 

[Warshawski]

Hoping someone here can help.. I'm so confused about this 'sub judice' that people here have been talking about.. I am seeing everyone's name splattered all over MSM, including the accused, the victim, the relatives, etc. I believe what I've been reading in MSM includes Australian media which would be available in NSW. WS has a rule for this case that the names of certain individuals cannot be mentioned, even in a link address.. but yet the link address and the entire article may be filled with those names... soooooo confusing! Can anyone explain it? Also, even the press conference, where the top detective recorded a plea to the public, includes the victim's name, IIRC??

I agree deugirtni - some paranoia I think, but hey, there’s bigger issues imo so I try to respect

 

[bearbear]

Yes, well I have seen it said (here) that he wasn't at the estate that morning. But I haven't seen an MSM link. I don't know if that is true. I think it is speculation because some were wondering why he wasn't interviewed at the estate.

He did drive himself to Penrith for a formal interview ... and then his ute was impounded.

i guess this is where its assumed js wasnt there when police arrived, but he may have been somewhere nearby?

When police arrived, Ms M was present at the estate without the company of her fiancé and during an informal round of police questions she had 'a medical episode' and was taken to Blue Mountains Hospital at Katoomba.
On Friday afternoon, js drove his ute to High Street, Penrith and entered Penrith Police station and spoke with detectives.

Police seized his parked ute and impounded it, towing it away to a location for forensic examination; officers also seized the motor boat from W estate
C M alleged murder raises three key questions as mum of alleged killer defends son | Daily Mail Online
haha! marg944 you beat me to it

 

[Aussieboy]

I was hoping she died while sleeping so she never knew what was happening. The fact they haven’t found any evidence at the house sadly rules out that theory. I wonder if those two guys who were detained at the campground were the friends and JS got jealous and took it out on dear CM to get back at KM, as previously mentioned, a possible domestic murder type incident.

It does smell a bit like a third party payback to me, not much that the media or LE have brought out in the public is logical. We'll probably never know the whole truth as it's a very sensitive issue when a young 9 year old child is involved.

 

[Warshawski]

i listened to this and the friend isnt very coherent, its hard to understand him,
he seems slurred or stoned and talks about his drug use in the interview

I agree Bearbear, but I think he says he’s on prescription medication but still cops sh{¥ for that

 

[Sdow]

I just found it...... but then this article states that KM rang Triple 0.... when other media states it was JS. Hard to know who to believe! But, for our purposes, we aren't going crazy, we did in fact read that KM was not with JS at Wildenstein on the Friday morning when Police first arrived.

"Around 4.30am on Friday, Mount Wilson resident CH was reading a book in bed when she heard the sound of a vehicle on the driveway of the neighbouring property, Wildenstein.

She got out of bed and went to the window from which she could see the shadow of a vehicle without its headlights on moving along the driveway.

Almost four hours later a person, believed to be KM, dialled Triple-0 to report that CM was missing from the Wildenstein property.

When police arrived, KM was present at the estate without the company of her fiance and during an informal round of police questions she had 'a medical episode' and was taken to Blue Mountains Hospital at Katoomba.

Police began to search Wildenstein and then a wider search of the Mount Wilson and Mount Irvine areas was initiated, with SES and RFS volunteers calling in to participate.

On Friday afternoon, JS drove his ute to High Street, Penrith and entered Penrith Police station and spoke with detectives.

Police seized his parked ute and impounded it, towing it away to a location for forensic examination; officers also seized the motor boat from Wildenstein estate."


JS not interviewed at Wildenstein

Thank you for finding this. A couple of interesting points in this article… it doesn’t specify which direction car was going in. Neighbour also didn’t see boat at that time yet boat was seized at property and seen on cctv attached to Ute.

JS coming and going couple of times early hours of morning after Colo River?

If car travelling towards house without boat, possibly KM arriving?

 

[Aussieboy]

I wonder what JS's google history looks like.


Chlorine bleaches can remove a Bloodstain to the naked eye but fortunately, forensics experts can use the application of substances such as luminol or phenolphthalein to show that haemoglobin is present.

With oxygen bleach, the bleach has an oxidising agent, which could be a substance such as hydrogen peroxide. In these instances, haemoglobin is completely removed and can’t later be detected. As expected, this presents a unique challenge for forensic scientists.

https://www.exploreforensics.co.uk/detecting-evidence-after-bleaching.html

I would expect that they would have some type of evidence of a cover-up, they would find receipts of products or have CCTV of him buying cleaning items or even disposal of the cleaning items, they even check mops, buckets and drains for any type of evidence.

 

[SLouTh]

the shooting could have occurred anywhere on the 12 acres, so it would be pretty much impossible to find any evidence there wouldnt it?

Not if they did a "close" line search (shoulder to shoulder) ........ and broke the property up into grids for searching....doing one section at a time....

They may find something that way?? Although I assume they would have done this already??

There is footage somewhere of a search of grass in UK case, where Police are down on their hands and knees in the grass checking all the blades of grass with a torch..... after they narrowed down an area..... it was quite fascinating to watch....

IMO

 

[Warshawski]

All of that sounds believable, but wouldn't mom ask to speak to her daughter at some point. If he and the 9 yr old are just sitting around, alone, awaiting upon boat repairs, what excuse could he give for CM not being able to talk to mom?

That's why I wondered if maybe he told KM that he dropped the child off to his mom, so she could take her shopping and to fun things in town? That way KM wouldn't expect t to speak to her because KM and AS were not on good terms, apparently.

this is just IMO as I can’t find a link - but was it said that the GM in Qld phoned & spoke with CM on the Tuesday evening 7.00 pm and the phoned again the next morning but couldn’t reach her - and that’s why the Police time frame of her death.

So I would think GM would’ve said to KM that she couldn’t reach her & where was she etc ...

 

[SLouTh]

If he couldn't efficiently dispose of the body for what ever reason, I doubt he would have thoroughly made the crime scene spotless of all evidence. I reckon that it all happened somewhere else.

Agree AussieB.... the Thursday attempts to dispose of dear little C's body tell us a lot about him.... imo not very organized ...

But as to where it happened? Police are going to have to go through many many hours of CCTV footage, if there is any, in that particular area....?

 

[Warshawski]

Is that the red car? Or another vehicle? I’m getting so xxxxxxxxx confused with all these comings and going’s in cars..

yes, his Ute is a Red Holden Colorado twin cab

 

[PrimeSuspect]

One thing I want to mention about the evidence, I distinctly remember the police saying that the barrel was sourced from public property. Because I was wondering if the barrel came from the nearby campgrounds or a park (rubbish bin).

In the presser, DS Doherty said "I can now disclose that the barrel came from the estate". I noticed the new "disclosure".

I wonder what that was about. They are evidently (and as per usual practise, imo) holding back info. The status of this piece of info having now changed, for some reason.

I agree, maybe, after interviewing AS and the gardener or housekeeper?
I wonder if it was used for compost, and there was residue of it inside, so both are confirmation of it coming from the estate? Or, for beer making? Jmo

 

[Warshawski]

It would account for his unknown actions on the timeframe between Tues/Wed am (murder) and Thursday (disposal). PS. I don't enjoy using such cold and detached wording and talking so clinically, it's a far cry as to how I'm feeling, but it's a way to cope with this situation.

I don’t want to even think what I’m thinking - but my guess is that there will be a lot more come out & that’s why officers were so traumatised by what they found in the barrel.

 

[Rumination1]

I don’t want to even think what I’m thinking - but my guess is that there will be a lot more come out & that’s why officers were so traumatised by what they found in the barrel.

Me too. I think the story will only come out in the courtroom

 

[Warshawski]

One thing I want to mention about the evidence, I distinctly remember the police saying that the barrel was sourced from public property. Because I was wondering if the barrel came from the nearby campgrounds or a park (rubbish bin).

In the presser, DS Doherty said "I can now disclose that the barrel came from the estate". I noticed the new "disclosure".

I wonder what that was about. They are evidently (and as per usual practise, imo) holding back info. The status of this piece of info having now changed, for some reason.

agreed SA - but then in the scheme of things, what is Public Property ?

Maybe in car park or along a walking track, as opposed perhaps to inside a shed ?

I think they are being very strategic, but then I would also suggest that they won’t release blatant untruths as it could deter people from providing information they may have ( thinking it must not be relevant as it doesn’t match the police info) Just MO

 

[bfew]

what does he tell her when CM is not with him?

In this scenario, JS might have told KM, that CM is with his mother (AM), who is the owner of the Wildenstein property at Mount Wilson.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

This is an unsavoury subject to talk about because it's a 9 year old girl who was fatally shot, but with regards to blood splatter; if the victim is shot from a distance with a small calibre firearm, there will be little blood splatter as described in the study at link.

No doubt, forensics and firearm experts will be working on this and know what there're looking for.
But for our benefit, until we know how this crime was committed, it opens up different scenarios.

JMO

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...gQFnoECAQQBg&usg=AOvVaw1v_cfPmQ9CQMJBfVeBYISp

 

[Edgar70]

What do sleuthers think about the history of problems with the neighbour at Wildenstein? Numerous allegations of him shooting wildlife and concerns for the safety of bushwalkers and people at Wildenstein? But surely if an unknown person had shot CM, why would JS need to cover up the murder?
Dark past of luxury family property at centre of Charlise Mutten murder | Daily Mail Online

You raise a good point.

What if considering JS's affinity for shooting wildlife as referenced, in conjuction with the child's footsteps located nearby, these are related in some manner given the cause of death?

Has she tried to run away or was hunted as a "game"?

Clue in search for missing girl in Blue Mountains

All IMHO.

 

[katydid23]

Yes, well I have seen it said (here) that he wasn't at the estate that morning. But I haven't seen an MSM link. I don't know if that is true. I think it is speculation because some were wondering why he wasn't interviewed at the estate.

He did drive himself to Penrith for a formal interview ... and then his ute was impounded.

I have a distinct memory of reading in MSM that KM was alone at the property when the police arrived Friday morning. I will try and find it.

 

[Random-me]

I just found it...... but then this article states that KM rang Triple 0.... when other media states it was JS. Hard to know who to believe! But, for our purposes, we aren't going crazy, we did in fact read that KM was not with JS at Wildenstein on the Friday morning when Police first arrived.

"Around 4.30am on Friday, Mount Wilson resident CH was reading a book in bed when she heard the sound of a vehicle on the driveway of the neighbouring property, Wildenstein.

She got out of bed and went to the window from which she could see the shadow of a vehicle without its headlights on moving along the driveway.

Almost four hours later a person, believed to be KM, dialled Triple-0 to report that CM was missing from the Wildenstein property.

When police arrived, KM was present at the estate without the company of her fiance and during an informal round of police questions she had 'a medical episode' and was taken to Blue Mountains Hospital at Katoomba.

Police began to search Wildenstein and then a wider search of the Mount Wilson and Mount Irvine areas was initiated, with SES and RFS volunteers calling in to participate.

On Friday afternoon, JS drove his ute to High Street, Penrith and entered Penrith Police station and spoke with detectives.

Police seized his parked ute and impounded it, towing it away to a location for forensic examination; officers also seized the motor boat from Wildenstein estate."


JS not interviewed at Wildenstein

Maybe one of the friends she was at the van with dropped her off