AZ AZ - Adrienne Salinas, 19, Tempe, 15 Jun 2013 - #8

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About her returning to the apartment a second time. LE was the only ones saying that and it was based on all her possessions being found there. It was a natural conclusion that she MUST have returned if her keys, wallet and bag were back. But what if SHE didn't??? What if something happened to her earlier then was reported?? I agree that the roommates were partying and weren't watching their clocks to have any idea what time she originally left.

The longer this case goes on, the more I'm believing that she was not the one who brought those things back to the apartment, they may have been returned, but not by her.

With so many people going in and out of it that night, anyone seen there would have a "good" reason for being there, especially someone in that social circle. JMO
 
About her returning to the apartment a second time. LE was the only ones saying that and it was based on all her possessions being found there. It was a natural conclusion that she MUST have returned if her keys, wallet and bag were back. But what if SHE didn't??? What if something happened to her earlier then was reported?? I agree that the roommates were partying and weren't watching their clocks to have any idea what time she originally left.

The longer this case goes on, the more I'm believing that she was not the one who brought those things back to the apartment, they may have been returned, but not by her.

With so many people going in and out of it that night, anyone seen there would have a "good" reason for being there, especially someone in that social circle. JMO

BBM

Perhaps LE used her phone pings/GPS to come to the conclusion that Adrienne returned to the apartment. And maybe tracking her phones location match what witness's have told the police. JMO.
 
I have no idea if this is plausible or not, but I try to come up with some scenario that nobody else has mentioned in cases I follow, just to help ensure that all sides are considered. This could be one of my worst, so far.

Is it possible that someone was leaving the party around the time this was all going on, and got into an altercation with her which resulted in her death (no, I don't always talk like this!) If there was a couple, the female may have taken her car to get rid of it so it wasn't obvious that something happened right by her home, while the male took AS in his/her/their car to dispose of the body. She could have called the cab pretending to be AS after the accident (which happened because she was so flustered by what had happened) but never intending to get a ride. She could have called one from father away because being stood up after driving that far would be likely to make it more memorable and appear to prove that AS was alive at that time.
 
I know we can't sleuth a particular person but I'm interested in the other young man who is said to have had a crush on Adrienne. He may be an upstanding great guy or he may have been a drunk horny cad that went too far and things got out of hand.

As far as the bf is concerned, it's hard to imagine that someone that was AS's friend since 6th grade would end up killing her. I know when romantic love enters the picture, the plot thickens - but still. I wonder why, if he wanted space, he continued to come around. Why not stay in Scottsdale then? Does bf know AS's father well? Did AS know his mother?

In an article I read today, AS's dad said that AS had been at a birthday party her last night. We know she was at her own apartment. Whose birthday was it? I'd not heard that before.

I haven't read anything as to "who's" birthday party it was.
AS and FA knew each other since 6th grade, as well as several of the others. Both AS and FA had "single" on the FB status. (Mods, please snip if I went over the line there, please) I have to believe the on again/off again relationship was currently off. We really can't tell why Adrienne was upset about FA, all we know is she was, to what degree? That all rests on the perception of the roomates. It might not have had anything to do with "them", it might have had something to do with "him".
We do know she ejected him from the party. We do know she left with him. We do know she came back. What was said, done, or where they went during her absence is only one person's version. So, THAT's bare bones.
 
BBM

Perhaps LE used her phone pings/GPS to come to the conclusion that Adrienne returned to the apartment. And maybe tracking her phones location match what witness's have told the police. JMO.

That could be RANCH, but as we know, tracking the phone/GPS might not matter IF Adrienne didn't have her phone and from around that time, someone else had it and was making calls to the bf and later the cabbie, to help establish that she was still alive and well then. kwim??? At this point, we aren't sure who had her phone after the bf gave it to her. Or maybe even before that.
 
I have been following along for Adrienne since she initially went missing. I have followed many cases but I do not think many as closely as Adrienne's. Some of yall know I also have a cab company in a college/tourist town and I very strictly questioned the cabbie timeline of events early on.

These are our customers, our streets, our town. Cab drivers are very observant and aware of everything going on in their work environment. With Tom Sr being the cab company owner, his son Tom jr was handling the phones, driving and was described by TOM SR. as night shift manager. Sounds like there was one other cab running at the 5am hour who Tom Jr met up with that night to collect the percentage or cab rental fee after Adrienne was a no show. Then Tom SR said Tom JR stopped by his home and conducted any needed business. This might be dropping off the logs, $money and the dispatch phone.

I believe its very possible that there were plenty of verifiable records or data for LE to verify his where abouts and like to remember that Tom Jr's home was searched, he was questioned and they took DNA. Tom SR reminded us that this was all voluntary and out of concern for Adrienne's well being. Tom Jr. wanted to clear his name and his fathers company. The whole fact that LE searched his home, took DNA was quite shocking and rattled me even more when considering the timeline. So many of us here follow many cases and are quick to judge and follow LE's words and action as gospel. We learn to read between the lines and predict from experience what we think it all means.

But soon there was a campaign to hush all that talk of cabbie. I would do the same thing for my company. This is my business and how I support my young children as a single woman and mother. BUT, in those early days it also shocked me because as Social media savy as Tom SR is there was no mention of Adrienne or the missing girl from Tempe. I find this lack of concern speechless. When a beautiful young woman went missing in our town I had missing posters posted in my cars. Remember, we are out in the public, this is our town and we can reach many segments of the population and help spread the word. Anyways...

My point is that IMO LE is playing smoke and mirrors here, or cat and mouse because from early on LE recognized what they are up against. This is a very complicated group of characters with an incredible timeline. I so far have to say Tempe LE is an experienced on the ball force. I really am impressed.

jmo guys! I am appreciating all of your hard work and thoughts.

Also, to the Salinas family-God bless you, I am so sorry.

BBM
Owning 2 of my own businesses, in the past, I would have let LE do their stuff and backed away from the media. Yes, I would most likely have posted missing posters in my business, but I would have not drawn further attention to my company's alleged involvement when my employee was never even named in the media, IIR. So what if he was shown on the AMPM surveillance, how many of their patrons are going to remember that or even see that? But doing a media blitz, both local and National is just drawing unneeded attention to one's self and their company. Very bad business, IMO.
WideOpen, would you have gone to the media or? If you don't mind me asking?
 
That could be RANCH, but as we know, tracking the phone/GPS might not matter IF Adrienne didn't have her phone and from around that time, someone else had it and was making calls to the bf and later the cabbie, to help establish that she was still alive and well then. kwim??? At this point, we aren't sure who had her phone after the bf gave it to her. Or maybe even before that.

I'm just wondering if the phones location matches what everyone's telling LE. So your right, there could be some kind of coverup involving her phone by the person or persons responsible for her death. MOO.
 
It seems like LE should be able to "break" at least one of a group of college-age partiers into telling the truth, if this is some intricate web of lies. That is what LE does, work to get the real story by going over it time and time again. Of course, it is possible they are outsmarting LE, but right now, I feel like LE is asking for new clues, new theories, from what they said today. That could mean that nothing is coming together to bring them any closer to the truth. And we still have not heard of any of the young people getting lawyers, as far as I know, which they would likely do, if they were feeling pressure or heat, JMO.
 
I'm just wondering if the phones location matches what everyone's telling LE. So your right, there could be some kind of coverup involving her phone by the person or persons responsible for her death. MOO.

For one thing, BOTH the roomies give the same time.....2:30 am when she and bf left to go to his place. I was not a wild and crazy teenager and didn't really drink until I was about 23 years old but when I did at a party, I did not watch the time. Had someone asked me later about what time something happened, I would not have any idea.
 
Omg Bernina. What if she had originally been thrown into a well? Is that possible. Could a body emerge from within a well? What's amazing too is that it sounds as if the body was found intact. At least to some degree.
Are there unused wells around there? Would they contain water? Because wouldn't that preserve a body to some degree? Considering the remains attracted vultures.

"Pooley described the condition of the remains, which had been exposed to floods in the wash and possibly animals.

"The entire body was not intact," he says. However, investigators didn't think the shape of the body was necessarily related to the cause of death."

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2013/08/adrienne_salinas_case_not_obvi.php

IIRC, somebody saw her legs sticking out from under the bushes. And their was mention of a frame, which I think might mean skeletal remains.
 
Omg Bernina. What if she had originally been thrown into a well? Is that possible. Could a body emerge from within a well? What's amazing too is that it sounds as if the body was found intact. At least to some degree.
Are there unused wells around there? Would they contain water? Because wouldn't that preserve a body to some degree? Considering the remains attracted vultures.

Wells out here are so different than what you see in the old Westerns. For residential and small acreage agriculture, there is only going to be a 6" diameter pipe going down into the ground. This is the outer casing. This casing will go down until the sides of the hole maintain their shape. Then pipe, ranging from 1-3" diameter in 12-15 foot lengths is dropped down and screwed or affixed onto the next length of pipe. Depending on the depth of the static line (the water level) and how far below that you want to draw water, the actual pump head is inserted between 2 sections of pipe and dropped down the hole with your electrical lines.........When it's all said and done, the top of your 6" pipe is covered with a metal cap, lines are run from the lower sides of the 6" to your pressure tanks and the electrical off the top, split between your power source and the pressure tank gauges.
No buckets and cranks, or the little girl from "The Ring". :floorlaugh:
Depending on the city and county zoning laws and ADEQ, well requirements vary. Some cities will not allow you to deepen or drill a new well if it goes dry, and you have to run lines to city water. Sometimes water districts will vote to sell their water shares to another city and you loose your well rights.
I think that kind of covers that..........now you can go dig a well!
 
It seems like LE should be able to "break" at least one of a group of college-age partiers into telling the truth, if this is some intricate web of lies. That is what LE does, work to get the real story by going over it time and time again. Of course, it is possible they are outsmarting LE, but right now, I feel like LE is asking for new clues, new theories, from what they said today. That could mean that nothing is coming together to bring them any closer to the truth. And we still have not heard of any of the young people getting lawyers, as far as I know, which they would likely do, if they were feeling pressure or heat, JMO.

It is possible that they are minimizing what they have to let the perp(s) feel comfy enough to make a mistake. At least that's what I'm hoping for! So where did those friends of hers go to on the beach trip after she went missing? Anyone know? Just curious and hope I'm not pointing fingers or breaking rules or anything... JMO
 
It seems like LE should be able to "break" at least one of a group of college-age partiers into telling the truth, if this is some intricate web of lies. That is what LE does, work to get the real story by going over it time and time again. Of course, it is possible they are outsmarting LE, but right now, I feel like LE is asking for new clues, new theories, from what they said today. That could mean that nothing is coming together to bring them any closer to the truth. And we still have not heard of any of the young people getting lawyers, as far as I know, which they would likely do, if they were feeling pressure or heat, JMO.

ITA & the boyfriend must have been really feeling pressure taking 3 polys.
 
I know I am in the minority but I completely believed A called the cab and was that desperate to continue the fight and/or make up. Also probably upset by the wreck, maybe wanted to blame the BF for making her so upset that she crashed, or get him to comfort her. I also believe, at this point, that she ran into a predator, known to her or otherwise, but not necessarily anything to do with the party. JMO

Partly because of where and how she was found, but even before that, I felt that at 5am, at least partially distracted and alone on a street a young woman is going to attract the attention of those who look for exactly this type of victim. Also because of the seeming lack of evidence of raised voices, an argument, etc. could point to a weapon and her being quietly forced into a vehicle in an instant, by a "pro" who was ready to go.

Sorry to double quote you, but I agree that this is definitely quite a high possibility in this case. Think Jill Meagher, walking home after a night out with friends, abducted, raped and killed by someone who just happened to stumble across her. Or Mickey Schunik, who was riding her bike home and abducted right off the street. While statistically the perp is most likely someone the victim knew, there are cases that show the high possibility of a random perp being involved. In this case, Adrienne was walking to the AMPM on her own, in the early morning - she would have been very vulnerable and very open to someone to just take her right off the street. All they would need is a vehicle. In the Jill Meagher case, she was abducted off the street and then found in a second location - just as Adrienne was found in a location where she couldn't have gotten to unless transported by someone.

I've got to believe that LE secured a warrant for Adrienne's phone records soon after her missing person's report was taken. If the phone was in her father's name, all they would have needed was his written permission. LE confirmed that her phone went dead, silent, whatever, soon after 5:00 am. All the pings off the towers placed her phone in the general area of her apt. Without witnesses, no one knows "who" was using her phone. For all we know, those repeated calls to the BF's phone were an attempt to find it because he had misplaced it? 11 or 32, that many calls and no left messages? Was his voice mail full? The only time I've ever done that is when my BF looses his phone somewhere in the house, which is pretty common. If it's under his discarded clothes, or the freezer (yes, it has happened) it takes several calls from the land line to pin down where the ringtone is coming from. At one point, he's even gone so far as to put his ear up to one of the dog's stomachs. :facepalm:

I do agree to a point, but I think the amount of calls makes it a little less likely that it was BF trying to find her phone.

I remember reading that the guy's observations were unfounded. A young woman in light colored shorts nearby the microwave that police couldn't collaborate. I didn't note the timeframe though. LE has to put limits to how far back or ahead they check I suppose. I mean they have to go by what the witness claims within reason or they'd be checking video forever.

IIRC, the sighting of a girl in light colored shorts near the microwave was on a different day, which is why it was so confusing when it came out. It was only in the second (?) interview with this guy that he recalled seeing her, but it wasn't on the morning Adrienne disappeared.

Was dog poop a regular thing around there? I thought they were aware she had left without mentioning or asking for help with her dog. What's up with that? Who is or was in charge of the cats? Party mess is one thing but the messes the animals made is another story.

From personal experience, I can see it being a situation where everyone is partying and a little too drunk to really care whether the animals are making a mess in the apartment. When I was this age, friends of mine would seem to 'forget' that the animals were inside, and worry about cleaning up the mess after they were done having fun. Too much effort when you're in the middle of a party. I've also had friends who were not very good at cleaning up after their pets. I would walk into their house and it would literally smell like poo/piss and there would be little accidents just laying all over the house.

Not saying that either of those situations are definitely applicable to this situation, but just giving reason why the apartment may have been in the state of mess LE found it in.

Editing to add: OH! and what about that car with screaming coming from the trunk? That was really really crazy IMO! Timing and everything....

<snipped by me>

I can't remember reading this, could someone please point me in the right direction? TIA.

I've been wondering this same thing since day one. When your 19 and wreck your car and have close friends you don't leave that part out. I just feel like maybe she never went home after the wreck or if she did it was alot later the the time we were all told. She could have gone back and everyone was sleeping and no one ever saw or heard her. This has never set right with me at all.

I think it's possible she may have been a bit embarrassed to tell everyone what had just happened. She may have already thought she was being a bit of a 'downer' or a 'burden' because she was upset that night, maybe she didn't want to bring up the accident because she was worried about how her friends might react? She may have even been worried that they would tell her to just leave things for the night, and meet up with her BF later once everything had calmed down. I think that in the state of mind she seemed to be in that night, she didn't want to deal with people trying to stop her from getting to where she wanted to be.

Sorry for your loss PH. I was wondering where you were. Glad to see you back.

Thank you, Seajay. I'm happy to be back, although, I was hoping to come back to news of an arrest.

Obviously, all JMO, IMO, etc... :moo:
 
For one thing, BOTH the roomies give the same time.....2:30 am when she and bf left to go to his place. I was not a wild and crazy teenager and didn't really drink until I was about 23 years old but when I did at a party, I did not watch the time. Had someone asked me later about what time something happened, I would not have any idea.
If you knew that the police was going to question you about what happened would you talk to your friends about what happened and when beforehand?

You may agree on the time that you saw someone and both tell the police the same thing. MOO.
 
If you knew that the police was going to question you about what happened would you talk to your friends about what happened and when beforehand?

You may agree on the time that you saw someone and both tell the police the same thing. MOO.

Even if just innocently, after finding that their friend was missing and LE wanted to talk to them, they could have spoken to each other to try and nail down when exactly they saw her, even if just as a way to give LE the right information. They were all (likely) under the influence, so I would think it would be difficult to know the exact times they had seen her, so maybe they spoke to each other to try and work out when exactly everything happened.
 
Thank you, Seajay. I'm happy to be back, although, I was hoping to come back to news of an arrest.

Obviously, all JMO, IMO, etc... :moo:

snipped by me: That would have been awesome, wouldn't it?? To know what happened and have the guilty party/ies arrested. I think we all so do want to see justice for Adrienne and for her family. I was hoping after Adrienne was found, it would be matter of hours before there was an arrest.
 
BBM
Owning 2 of my own businesses, in the past, I would have let LE do their stuff and backed away from the media. Yes, I would most likely have posted missing posters in my business, but I would have not drawn further attention to my company's alleged involvement when my employee was never even named in the media, IIR. So what if he was shown on the AMPM surveillance, how many of their patrons are going to remember that or even see that? But doing a media blitz, both local and National is just drawing unneeded attention to one's self and their company. Very bad business, IMO.
WideOpen, would you have gone to the media or? If you don't mind me asking?

Thanks for the question.
To clarify, I would not go to the media. I would cooperate fully with LE and keep a low down. I would support the family. I would help with donations, a prayer request on my social media (if I was internet-social media savvy), or arranging to put up flyers. I would be drawn to be compassionate and helpful but agree that drawing attention to the business and myself would be a distraction.

Jmo

ETA; I want to go a little further though and point out that IMO I think Tom SR. is comfortable with the public arena and format. I think using social media to "be way out there" in his line of business is "catchy" with the public he is serving. He wants people talking about him and remembering him so that they will keep calling.

Last week I had a young woman in my cab and she told me she loved to use cabs because she always met the most interesting people. Her favorite company was in Florida and the guy was a complete hoot. He had strobe lights, loud club music, and a costume. He was fun! Some customers love it if they can be entertained. I'm a simple boring cab driver and usually just act like their mother. We have lots of college age kids who are drinking and I just try to provide safe, dependable transportation.

I'm sorry if i am not quite clear, its late and I am supposed to be working.
 
it's been brought to my attention that an individual that looks very very similar to the guy on the AMPM video was arrested today for shooting a cab driver in the area where adrienne lived.

here's the MSM link.. it includes his name. a simple google search will take you to pics and more info of him. he looks eerily similar to the guy on the AMPM surveillance at/near the time adrienne went missing. i dont think we can sleuth him, but i wanted to post it here in case there is any connection to adrienne's case. but it all seems very interesting!

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...er-serious-condition-after-shooting-abrk.html
 
Just as an FYI: a Music benefit is being held to raise money for the funeral expenses for Adrienne Salinas.
salinasmusic_zpsfe94c62f.jpg
 

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