AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #22

[BaxterDE42]

I am on page 55 and yes, I am really behind in my reading. I am viewing a picture of Isa (post 1366 by Lisa B - thanks Lisa!) and cannot figure out what it is about Isa's teeth but this has bothered me since I first saw her face and read that she has a upper and lower tooth missing.

Does anyone which upper tooth is supposedly missing? There is something that strikes me as being odd about her upper front (her left) tooth. It almost appears to me to be a temp fill in - like a flipper with one tooth. I may be spending far too much time researching her case but I swear, I can't get past that "girly-girl's" tooth and frequent use of make up that seems sometimes out of place.

If anyone can find a photo of Isa showing her missing tooth, please post?
TIA
*Don't know where this post lands.

 

[Knox]

Could be both at this point?

A financial hoax for profit, does not make any sense to me at all. I don't think that is what we are looking at here. There is either direct family involvement, or this was a non-familial abduction by someone who *knew* the Celis family :moo:

 

[athy]

I haven't been posting but this for me this is an easy (but unpopular) answer. Knowing my innocence, if I knew the kids were safe with the other parent and the likelihood was fairly high that I felt CYS would play hardball and get an official order or remove them from both of us (with the result being foster homes for the kids), I'd agree in a heartbeat. Why? The stability for my kids (even without me there at that time (given my spouse is stable and secure) would be worth them having one reassuring, loving parent without CYS running the kids in and out of court. If it can't be the way you want it to be, at least choosing the most stable for the children with all circumstances being equal, despite your own pain is often what is best for the children in times of crisis and trauma, IMO.
<snipped for space>.

it would be hard but i can understand and agree with this.

not going to get into too much personal info here but one of my daughters was fighting her ex in law over her kids. she fought for 2 years, we ran out of money and a bunch of other carp was going on. she loves her kids and did nothing wrong (could she have done better? sure all parents can but no drugs or anything like that were involved) after 2 years my daughter signed the papers...not because she wanted to, not because she was "guilty" of abuse or anything but because she DID love them and didn't want them to have to keep going through all the court stuff. she knew they needed stability, knew at least that in law would do her best in raising them so she "gave up" fighting. it was hard for her to do. its been years later and she still cries over it and prays every night once they're old enough they'll contact her. so yes. i can understand agreeing to something like this even while being innocent of wrong doing.

 

[elmomom]

I don't recall there being an "official" statement regarding the length of the NCO, but WS member, AZLawyer posted general information about the usual duration being 90 days.

AZLawyer posted about the guidelines for a No Contact Order. This is a voluntary agreement, which is not the same thing. She also posted that for a voluntary agreement, there is no time limit, it is open ended (only unless the kids are in foster car, which the Celis' are not) I am just trying to stop these bits of info from becoming well worn "facts" when in fact, they are not.
Please see AZLawyer's post here:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - AZ AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #18

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well, they ARE getting donations, anyway, aren't they?

I do not subscribe to the hoax theory, BTW, but given how little we do know and the sketchy (IMO) stuff surrounding the family, I won't say it's impossible.

Yes, they are, but not enough to go to prison for making a false claim of child abduction.

IMO

 

[CarolynV]

A financial hoax for profit, does not make any sense to me at all. I don't think that is what we are looking at here. There is either direct family involvement, or this was a non-familial abduction by someone who *knew* the Celis family :moo:

I don't mean that it started out as a financial hoax, I mean that since whatever happened, they are riding this gravy train as long as they can.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Okay, so some of us are wondering if this is a hoax, why don't the parents do more interviews? Why don't they get even more attention for the case? But Sergio said that Isabel's case is #2 to 9/11 so maybe he thinks they don't have to talk more...Because the case has already bypassed every other murder, terrorist attack, natural disaster, missing child, etc in the past 11 years.

 

[scout35]

Okay, so some of us are wondering if this is a hoax, why don't the parents do more interviews? Why don't they get even more attention for the case? But Sergio said that Isabel's case is #2 to 9/11 so maybe he thinks they don't have to talk more...Because the case has already bypassed every other murder, terrorist attack, natural disaster, missing child, etc in the past 11 years.

Honestly, if (general) your child was missing and (if) you had nothing to do with it, I'm sure you would consider it your personal 9-11. I know I would. JMO.

 

[Jules71]

I am on page 55 and yes, I am really behind in my reading. I am viewing a picture of Isa (post 1366 by Lisa B - thanks Lisa!) and cannot figure out what it is about Isa's teeth but this has bothered me since I first saw her face and read that she has a upper and lower tooth missing.

Does anyone which upper tooth is supposedly missing? There is something that strikes me as being odd about her upper front (her left) tooth. It almost appears to me to be a temp fill in - like a flipper with one tooth. I may be spending far too much time researching her case but I swear, I can't get past that "girly-girl's" tooth and frequent use of make up that seems sometimes out of place.

If anyone can find a photo of Isa showing her missing tooth, please post?
TIA
*Don't know where this post lands.

I thought the same thing about her tooth. I am going to go back and look at pics again. It was after someone posted a pic of her saying it was supposedly taken after she went missing.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

 

[Knox]

I don't mean that it started out as a financial hoax, I mean that since whatever happened, they are riding this gravy train as long as they can.

I see, thank you for clarifying.

A long time ago (during the Lindsey Baum case), I decided I would never discuss money insofar as it relates to a missing person's case (reward fund, fundraising, the administrator's of the money, cost of the investigation).

I find it distasteful, and in my experience the discussion always turns ugly. Just my ppov for what it's worth.

 

[LisaB]

How it Happens

Prosecutors offer eligible defendants the diversion option at their arraignment (first appearance) ONLY. Those who accept are directed to Southwestern Intervention Services, Inc. S.I.S. provides cost-effective, professional intake, assessment, referral, and monitoring, including referral to one of 27 local counseling agencies. Participants cited with substance abuse charges attend substance abuse counseling. Participants cited for shoplifting, disorderly conduct, theft, etc. attend adult responsibility classes. Participants cited for specific animal code violations attend a humane education class.
http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/prosecutor/diversion

:banghead: Note to self, read first, post second. Lava already found this! LOL@ME!

BBM. Is this something I can sign my child up for? It sounds like something all teenagers should have to take!

 

[MBK]

I am on page 55 and yes, I am really behind in my reading. I am viewing a picture of Isa (post 1366 by Lisa B - thanks Lisa!) and cannot figure out what it is about Isa's teeth but this has bothered me since I first saw her face and read that she has a upper and lower tooth missing.

Does anyone which upper tooth is supposedly missing? There is something that strikes me as being odd about her upper front (her left) tooth. It almost appears to me to be a temp fill in - like a flipper with one tooth. I may be spending far too much time researching her case but I swear, I can't get past that "girly-girl's" tooth and frequent use of make up that seems sometimes out of place.

If anyone can find a photo of Isa showing her missing tooth, please post?
TIA
*Don't know where this post lands.

This is an interesting post, and I would very much appreciate it if you could elaborate on what you mean by "frequest use of make up that seems sometimes out of place." Do you think it's out of place, meaning inappropriate? How so, is it too much, way too adult or teenager-ish, etc. I haven't looked at a lot of photographs. But I do remember those disturbing photographs of Madeleine McCann wearing make up. And various scenarios suggested by those photographs in the makeup . . which were horrifying.

Missing tooth as in knocked out? Hmmmmm. . .

 

[MBK]

I know. When I read that..and their concentration on the footboard -pillow- carpet (add the possibly bedding and dust ruffle found near the ramp or park) and the concentration on kids rooms <modsnip>. And what happens in a family when people are fighting? someone usually intervenes- could have been discipline gone tragically wrong <modsnip>. :-(

:bigfight:

Maybe the aunt straightened up the furniture too! Nice of her!

Interesting! I also like the comments people made about the game chair and bed in the boys' room. One thing I would note is that Jr's 911 call was the MOST believable and the most filled with urgency. By which, I am implying NOTHING about his involvement.

 

[BaxterDE42]

I thought the same thing about her tooth. I am going to go back and look at pics again. It was after someone posted a pic of her saying it was supposedly taken after she went missing.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

Thanks Jules71,
Check out this photo at link. Maybe you can see what I am talking about (upper left tooth). This photo is not dated but there has not been enough time for her to lose that and one to erupt to full growth.

Are there pageants in Mexico? Is video at home pagentry legal? Maybe preparing her for beauty contests?

These are questions I have and there is definately something amiss regarding her teeth. She does not fit the children's dental growth chart.
Google will give you more on child tooth development. Sorry, I received this chart in email and don't know how to post it and it may not be acceptable to do so.

Is the Daily Mail acceptable link? It is the photos I wanted to bring over here.
TIA
Forgive me Jules 71 for misspelling your name before edit. Have an injured hand today.

 

[buggsmom]

I am on page 55 and yes, I am really behind in my reading. I am viewing a picture of Isa (post 1366 by Lisa B - thanks Lisa!) and cannot figure out what it is about Isa's teeth but this has bothered me since I first saw her face and read that she has a upper and lower tooth missing.

Does anyone which upper tooth is supposedly missing? There is something that strikes me as being odd about her upper front (her left) tooth. It almost appears to me to be a temp fill in - like a flipper with one tooth. I may be spending far too much time researching her case but I swear, I can't get past that "girly-girl's" tooth and frequent use of make up that seems sometimes out of place.

If anyone can find a photo of Isa showing her missing tooth, please post?
TIA
*Don't know where this post lands.

Just my observation...fwiw
I looked at photos of IC and the left tooth has that "odd" look even in her younger pictures. To me (MOO) it looks like there is a darkening between the front and next little tooth...a decay like darkness. (not meaning anything bad by that-have worked with many children with dental needs). The tooth also looks to be a bit crooked to me.
The missing tooth/teeth is new to me.

ETA...duh dad is a dental-surgical assistant...I doubt she would have a bad spot on her tooth! So please ignore my post!! Thanks!

 

[buggsmom]

such a pretty little girl!

 

[MBK]

Which photos are released and WHEN is intriguing. Was this photo with the sunglasses just released by family? Why.

 

[MBK]

such a pretty little girl!

She was taking that photo herself. I wonder if she had her own phone. I wonder where it is if she did. I wonder if she had her own camera. I wonder where it is if she did have one.

 

[AzDaisyCrazy]

Which photos are released and WHEN is intriguing. Was this photo with the sunglasses just released by family? Why.

The picture of her with the sunglasses on was posted to FB by her Uncle RR.

It's located in 2 of his album folders:
One posted to his mobile uploads May 2 via BlackBerry Smartphones App (it could have been on his phone previously and he just uploaded to fb at this time)
and the other is located in his profile pictures album on May 2nd as well (actually posted there 5 times of the same picture).

ETA: the original caption on the photo says "Isa with my glasses"

 

[carole]

I thought the same thing about her tooth. I am going to go back and look at pics again. It was after someone posted a pic of her saying it was supposedly taken after she went missing.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

My opinion only - I have wondered why there are no photos of Isabel with the two missing teeth. Since I was such a picture taking mom when my boys were young, I took pictures every time something changed - as soon as a tooth came out I took a new picture.

Maybe the second tooth had just come out, but to me it's curious why there is no picture.

MOO, IMHO, etc.