GUILTY AZ - Sylar Newton, 2, Rimrock, 25 July 2010 - #2

[larsinaz]

Something else is off.

Indeed.

However, I must say I keep getting away from the fact that there is a scared little fellow out there... somewhere. When I stop and think of this, it crushes my heart.

But I can't help smelling the BS.

I wish Arizona had some type of sleuthing reporter who would go interview adopto-mom's neighbors/co-workers/acquaintances. I want a better idea of her character. I suppose what little we've had access to doesn't paint the best picture.


Praying that today is the day this ends well.

 

[Leomoon80]

I just can't get past the believability of a child opening a tent zipper and getting out on his own (without being heard).

Almost every other weekend, I can be found camping 30 miles away from this place. Although we have an RV now, it wasnt long ago that we spent our evenings in tents. One major rule was the tent door be zipped up at all times.

You would be amazed by at how quickly bugs/spiders and other creepy crawlys find their way in a tent especially now with our monsoon season.... everything is out in the evening trying to mate.

Unless someone is used to living in filthy conditions and/or they were bombed off their a$sses, that tent zipper would have been closed tight.

I would agree with you and there are also Bear in that region at that higher elevation perhaps other animals like bobcats?

I wonder about this myself......especially after a story changes
Anyone who is a camper in Arizona's high country would know this that predators are also in the woods and mountainous regions.

 

[Taminator]

Indeed.

However, I must say I keep getting away from the fact that there is a scared little fellow out there... somewhere. When I stop and think of this, it crushes my heart.

But I can't help smelling the BS.

I wish Arizona had some type of sleuthing reporter who would go interview adopto-mom's neighbors/co-workers/acquaintances. I want a better idea of her character. I suppose what little we've had access to doesn't paint the best picture.


Praying that today is the day this ends well.

I pray they find him and that he is safe.

This may have been discussed in previous threads, but I have a question about the creek.

I've never been to Rimrock, so pardon if I sound ignorant. Is there a swift water area in the creek? IOW, could he have reached the creek and then been pulled by a current. I'm just asking because if there's no swift water it would seem that if he reached the creek and drowned they would have found him floating by now. I know, it's morbid to think about but I really believe they would have found him by now otherwise.

 

[Soulmagent]

This is a wonderful link.In more than one way. It shows where and how far away children where located after missing in all states.
So far it looks like the a 1/2 to a mile and a half. Altho I did read once where one child did make it 4 miles I cant find that link right now.

http://www.achildismissing.org/state.asp?state=co

 

[larsinaz]

I would agree with you and there are also Bear in that region at that higher elevation perhaps other animals like bobcats?

I wonder about this myself......especially after a story changes
Anyone who is a camper in Arizona's high country would know this that predators are also in the woods and mountainous regions.

No question, there are bobcats and a bear would not be unheard of. But honestly, they would have found animal prints.... if not in the campground, at the very least along the muddy bank of the creek. It would be something they were looking for.

In my opinion, the only animal capable of being involved would be a Mtn. Lion. But I have yet to meet one that can open a tent, tip toe over the adults, select the smallest occupant and pull him out of a sleeping bag.... all the while not making a sound.

 

[Taminator]

This is a wonderful link.In more than one way. It shows where and how far away children where located after missing in all states.
So far it looks like the a 1/2 to a mile and a half. Altho I did read once where one child did make it 4 miles I cant find that link right now.

http://www.achildismissing.org/state.asp?state=co

Very interesting site. I guess in Sylar's case I'm having a hard time believing he could get any farther than a mile (if that) because of the circumstances. He's 2, barefoot, clad in only a diaper, possibly a lot of cloud coverage making it even harder to see in the dark, the terrain.....I don't know. If he had shoes on, maybe.

 

[Leomoon80]

No question, there are bobcats and a bear would not be unheard of. But honestly, they would have found animal prints.... if not in the campground, at the very least along the muddy bank of the creek. It would be something they were looking for.

In my opinion, the only animal capable of being involved would be a Mtn. Lion. But I have yet to meet one that can open a tent, tip toe over the adults, select the smallest occupant and pull him out of a sleeping bag.... all the while not making a sound.

Of course, good point.

Were they actually near Oak Creek Canyon, the waters of Oak Creek?

I haven't been able to open these few links posted for the map area.

 

[nurselady]

Something is not right here!

 

[larsinaz]

Is there a swift water area in the creek? IOW, could he have reached the creek and then been pulled by a current.

There may be pockets of swift water but they would be only a few feet long and then immediately followed by ankle deep water.

This is not a creek to be measured by standards you outside of the desert southwest are used to.

 

[larsinaz]

Of course, good point.

Were they actually near Oak Creek Canyon, the waters of Oak Creek?

I haven't been able to open these few links posted for the map area.

Oak Creek... at least the section that most out of towners would be familiar with is probably 20/30 miles away.

The campground is located in an area that is not entirely unlike Oak Creek Canyon.... just on a smaller scale and more desert.

 

[Leomoon80]

There may be pockets of swift water but they would be only a few feet long and then immediately followed by ankle deep water.

This is not a creek to be measured by standards you outside of the desert southwest are used to.

I live in the Sonoran Desert and have been often to Oak Creek and Sedona in the past. (not camping however)....I'm not a camper

As I said in my previous post, I could not gain access to a map on links posted to see exactly where Sylar disappeared..

But on foot, a toddler cannot of course, traverse that distance, that's a given.

 

[Savmom]

I pray they find him and that he is safe.

This may have been discussed in previous threads, but I have a question about the creek.

I've never been to Rimrock, so pardon if I sound ignorant. Is there a swift water area in the creek? IOW, could he have reached the creek and then been pulled by a current. I'm just asking because if there's no swift water it would seem that if he reached the creek and drowned they would have found him floating by now. I know, it's morbid to think about but I really believe they would have found him by now otherwise.

The only time that creek is swift is when there is substantial rain (like several inches in a very short time). My now 16yo ds learned to swim in the pools there, it is so calm. We used to take him there when he was a toddler since the water moves so slowly. There are a few areas the current picks up a bit, but the water is generally only several inches deep (plus the campground is located near the deeper pools for swimming).

There is no way he could have walked over the rocky, sticker-laden terrain without making SOME sort of noise (trust me on this one, you could not walk barefoot in the area unless your feet were made of steel)! The rocks are large, sharp, and plentiful being only an inch or so apart and you NEED shoes if you plan on walking more than a couple feet from the campsite. It is hard to walk in the area with shoes on because the terrain is so uneven with all the large rocks. Even if he made it to one of the little paths, his feet would be so full of stickers he'd be screeching like a banshee.

They have the area closed, but once it opens up (and if they haven't found him yet) dh & I will go take some pictures of the campground & creek and I'll post them on here.

 

[Taminator]

There may be pockets of swift water but they would be only a few feet long and then immediately followed by ankle deep water.

This is not a creek to be measured by standards you outside of the desert southwest are used to.

I'm from Tucson. I know when the monsoon hits here our streets and washes fill quickly and it's very dangerous.

I think from what you are saying *if* he reached the creek, they would have definitely found him by now, correct?

 

[Soulmagent]

Very interesting site. I guess in Sylar's case I'm having a hard time believing he could get any farther than a mile (if that) because of the circumstances. He's 2, barefoot, clad in only a diaper, possibly a lot of cloud coverage making it even harder to see in the dark, the terrain.....I don't know. If he had shoes on, maybe.

I dont believe he could either. I dont believe he walked away on his own at all. I could believe be made it to the creek but would think he would have been found Rain doesnt wash away a trail for SAR dogs. A sweaty hot baby in a diaper would leave a good scent to follow.Diapers when wet swell and leave bits an pieces after a time period. No way that diaper wouldnt have been found by a dog.
No way an animal took him off either, not from the campsite. That would have left a scent all the way to where the animal was.
In reality we have 3 options that are feesible
1.He is in the creek
2. Tina or other family members/friends have done something with /to him
3. Stranger abduction.

 

[Taminator]

I dont believe he could either. I dont believe he walked away on his own at all. I could believe be made it to the creek but would think he would have been found Rain doesnt wash away a trail for SAR dogs. A sweaty hot baby in a diaper would leave a good scent to follow.Diapers when wet swell and leave bits an pieces after a time period. No way that diaper wouldnt have been found by a dog.
No way an animal took him off either, not from the campsite. That would have left a scent all the way to where the animal was.
In reality we have 3 options that are feesible
1.He is in the creek
2. Tina or other family members/friends have done something with /to him
3. Stranger abduction.

Number 2 is my theory.

I'm really curious if CPS has any open case files on any of these family members. Maybe I'm jumping the gun but perhaps they got wind of the *adoption* and decided it wasn't in Sylar's best interest so they made him *disappear*.

 

[swanniee11]

I have to agree with other's here. I can't see a 2yr old getting very far at all. This is not a development/neighborhood, we're talking serious climbing/hiking he would have to do to get far. I keep thinking if he did walk out at that time of night on his own, he would walk in circles/get turned around and wouldn't make it far at all. Not to mention, no shoes, that ground has rocks/sticks, he would have cut himself within 20 feet. IMO

 

[larsinaz]

I uploaded another pic to my flickr account.... this is indicative of most of the creek.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/42934962@N00/4838476818/

You can see how it is inches deep in places and there is virtually no way a body would float more than 15 feet in that creek without getting hung up on a shallow, rocky area.

Also, the area around most of the creek is thick like this. The campground is a little more open but get outside of it and the terrain quickly becomes unnavigable for a toddler.

If he made it away from the creek bed and outside of the camp, the terrain is pretty open and he would be fairly easy to spot.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/42934962@N00/4836068551/in/photostream/ (creek in the background against the mtn.)


But who are we kidding, the dogs would have found his scent if he were still around.

 

[Savmom]

I didn't see if this was posted, but here is a link to the Beaver Creek campground on the Coconino National Forest site

 

[AnnieOakley]

Can anyone find whether it is ever stated that the tent zipper was "open" (or closed) when Tina awoke 'in a panic'?? I can't find that piece of info anywhere.

A 2y/o opening a tent and wandering out certainly would not turn around and re-zip the tent, right? So, if T stated that she 'found the tent unzipped" (or said something like: and then i unzipped the tent and ran out to look for him) ... that would be a crucial detail IMO

TIA!

 

[EziliGede]

Number 2 is my theory.

I'm really curious if CPS has any open case files on any of these family members. Maybe I'm jumping the gun but perhaps they got wind of the *adoption* and decided it wasn't in Sylar's best interest so they made him *disappear*.

That's what I'm wondering too. I know the bio mom was ok with the adoption, but what if it couldn't be legally approved, so CP sent Sylar away. I'd be very curious to know what the status is for that adoption.