CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, Bullhead City, hiking wearing bikini in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019

[GordianKnot]

At this point, based on the information released, I also believe she got turned around. It really is easy to do sometimes, even in familiar locations. People also get separated while outdoors, common is one person is going to take a breather and catch up, now they're lost and both looking for each other and getting further and further away.

I tend to, with adults, put abduction theories on the backburner. Not always, but often.

Although I did think what if she did make it to the road, was still lost and was offered a ride or asked for one back to her starting point. That concerns me a little.

Again, at this point, I believe she got lost. When people are lost, they often panic (understandable) and exert a lot of energy moving and trying to find where they think they should be. This of course can be very dangerous, especially if you consider the environment and what they have on them or better yet, don't have.

She may indeed be lost out there in the desert.

I'm struggling with that scenario right now for a few reasons, though:

1) I ain't a hiker, but even I have the sense to know that if I'm lost and I come across a road, I need to stay right by that road. I'm not going to wander away back off into the desert further away from the path of civilization.

2) If she got lost/turned around, there wasn't much time for her to get very far, especially given the enervating circumstances, i.e., extreme heat, terrain, lack of provisions, etc.

3) No signs of her being out there have resulted from the search efforts, at least, none that LE have shared. One would think that if she were lost, BT would try to leave some type of trail in her wake to signal that she had been there, i.e, scratching messages in the dirt, breaking off and leaving branches, etc.

JMO.

 

[Stripehaven]

Wondering how likely people here think it is for a 70-ish old woman to be abducted (by a stranger). What is the purpose? It sounds like the entire area is fairly unpopulated, and that an attack at the location would be more likely, if an attack would be the purpose. Kidnapping, at least without a ransom?

I'm tending to think more along the lines of the poster a while back who mentioned mine shafts. Something like could easily happen.

And: It's a little frustrating that there has been no update -did the dogs find ANY scent of her? Have they found that beer can/bottle, etc.

I can’t undetstand how much distance she could have put between herself and her husband just in the time it took to take a picture. I doubt she was hustling, in that heat - but who knows? Are there hiding places right there where an abductor could have been lurking? Or where an abductor’s vehicle was concealed? Did the husband hear a car? She may not have had a chance to scream but there must have been a vehicle or a person would have had to wrestle her away to .... somewhere? No noises, no signs of a scuffle? How far could an on-foot abductor get, carrying a tall woman in the desert heat, with the husband coming along shortly?

 

[Betty P]

Wondering how likely people here think it is for a 70-ish old woman to be abducted (by a stranger). What is the purpose? It sounds like the entire area is fairly unpopulated, and that an attack at the location would be more likely, if an attack would be the purpose. Kidnapping, at least without a ransom?

I'm tending to think more along the lines of the poster a while back who mentioned mine shafts. Something like could easily happen.

And: It's a little frustrating that there has been no update -did the dogs find ANY scent of her? Have they found that beer can/bottle, etc.

JMO, one scenario could be an "accident" at the highway, with the driver panicking and taking the victim away to later abandon them elsewhere. It has happened before. Seems like a silver alert might be helpful in that situation, as other LE and the public could be looking out in other areas along the roadways to possibly find the abandoned victim. I'm trying to be as tactful as possible for any family who might be following this thread.

JMO

 

[fridaybaker]

Wondering how likely people here think it is for a 70-ish old woman to be abducted (by a stranger). What is the purpose? It sounds like the entire area is fairly unpopulated, and that an attack at the location would be more likely, if an attack would be the purpose. Kidnapping, at least without a ransom?

I'm tending to think more along the lines of the poster a while back who mentioned mine shafts. Something like could easily happen.

And: It's a little frustrating that there has been no update -did the dogs find ANY scent of her? Have they found that beer can/bottle, etc.

Replying to my own post here, because I forgot about the edit button...

I am interested in understanding about what people here think of the "likelihood" of kidnapping; however, the fly in the ointment, of course, is that ANYTHING can happen. I just remembered about a man who once told me he had been kidnapped as a young man. This happened in the Chicago area, and I can't remember the exact circumstances, but it was very bizarre, to say the least. He was outside his house, and several men pulled up in a vehicle, tied him up, and took him to a warehouse. He was there for a short time, after which they let him go. Can't remember if they took his wallet, although I think they did, but: Why in the heck kidnap him?

He told this story in a very believable way -not sort of looking for attention, but in the sense that he was so puzzled about it himself. (And terrified out of his mind, which was the greatest memory for him. Absolutely terrified.) So, it's true, kidnapping is certainly possible. I just wonder how likely? I still go with getting lost/injured/mine shaft, etc. being the most probable. (The old medical school axiom: "If you hear hooves, look for horses, not zebras".)

 

[fridaybaker]

I can’t undetstand how much distance she could have put between herself and her husband just in the time it took to take a picture. I doubt she was hustling, in that heat - but who knows? Are there hiding places right there where an abductor could have been lurking? Or where an abductor’s vehicle was concealed? Did the husband hear a car? She may not have had a chance to scream but there must have been a vehicle or a person would have had to wrestle her away to .... somewhere? No noises, no signs of a scuffle? How far could an on-foot abductor get, carrying a tall woman in the desert heat, with the husband coming along shortly?

I agree here. It's difficult to really get a handle on this whole thing, for several reasons, one being: Unless you're a professional/very serious amateur photographer, how much time does it take to get a photo? The whole "beer in hand/bikini" description sounds like a couple who took a short, leisurely walk to take a photo or two, stretch their legs, etc., not "hiking" in the sense of moving at a fast, purposeful clip. How far ahead could she have gotten, seriously?

The kidnapping thing really doesn't make much sense to me. I can see being attacked if someone saw her alone, but kidnapping, although certainly possible, seems like a long shot.

Again -why no updates? Have they checked with locals, looked at old maps, tried to contact people who might spend quite a bit of time in the area, etc., for old mine shafts?

In order of likelihood, this is where I am: Lost with injury/accident most likely, then voluntary disappearance or kidnapping.

 

[mrstfs]

I’m wondering if she made it back to the camper but not to the key yet and encountered someone poking around their camper. Seems unlikely, I guess it’s more likely an accident occurred. *thinking out loud*

 

[mrstfs]

Does anyone know how long they been married? Do they have children? I saw her niece post on Facebook that Barbara got a dog recently. Where was the dog over the weekend?

Just asking questions out loud...

 

[zecats]

Not sure if this has been linked. Says from 28 minutes ago and does include updates from today (Wednesday).

Search for bikini-clad woman in Mojave Desert expands with off-road vehicles

On Tuesday, the agency said 20 Search and Rescue volunteers, and deputies assigned to the River Station, continued combing through the unforgiving wasteland in search of the 69-year-old.

"Off-road vehicles are being utilized to allow searchers to cover additional area," the sheriff's office said.

"There have been no sightings of her at this time," the latest update Wednesday from authorities read. Search efforts resumed at sun up on Wednesday and focused on the area of Kelbaker/Hidden Hills near Interstate 40.

 

[kkdj]

How many mine shafts are in that area? Do we know? Are we sure there are any in the area they were in? Even if she had fallen in one and passed wouldn't buzzards be seen overhead?

 

[PommyMommy]

JMO, one scenario could be an "accident" at the highway, with the driver panicking and taking the victim away to later abandon them elsewhere. It has happened before. Seems like a silver alert might be helpful in that situation, as other LE and the public could be looking out in other areas along the roadways to possibly find the abandoned victim. I'm trying to be as tactful as possible for any family who might be following this thread.

JMO

I've thought about this too but it seems there would have been some kind of evidence on the road, especially if it was a serious accident. I don't want to be graphic either but at the very least, I would expect to find that beer can and skid marks. ? MOO

 

[zecats]

How many mine shafts are in that area? Do we know? Are we sure there are any in the area they were in? Even if she had fallen in one and passed wouldn't buzzards be seen overhead?

Here's a list. One near Mojave Preserve seems to be in that area. Not sure though how many are.

Desert Mines & Mills

 

[PommyMommy]

Not sure if this has been linked. Says from 28 minutes ago and does include updates from today (Wednesday).

Search for bikini-clad woman in Mojave Desert expands with off-road vehicles

On Tuesday, the agency said 20 Search and Rescue volunteers, and deputies assigned to the River Station, continued combing through the unforgiving wasteland in search of the 69-year-old.

"Off-road vehicles are being utilized to allow searchers to cover additional area," the sheriff's office said.

"There have been no sightings of her at this time," the latest update Wednesday from authorities read. Search efforts resumed at sun up on Wednesday and focused on the area of Kelbaker/Hidden Hills near Interstate 40.

Thanks for linking this, Zecats. Photos from the Nixle Alert in the article:


July 16th - The search for Barbara Thomas, age 69, is continuing in the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

*Edited to remove image of minor child.

 

[K9Enzo]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>

It's possible she suffered a medical emergency - heat stroke comes to mind. Perhaps she sought shade/shelter and is hidden from an overhead view. Severe dehydration can make your mind play tricks on you, hallucinations can even happen, some people make decisions that won't make sense, they don't appear logical.

It's hard to imagine how someone was there, then gone, just like that.

 

[mrstfs]

How many mine shafts are in that area? Do we know? Are we sure there are any in the area they were in? Even if she had fallen in one and passed wouldn't buzzards be seen overhead?

There’s hidden hills mines but I honestly don’t know enough about mines to know if that’s considered a mine shaft.

 

[drama_farmer]

If she is found in the desert, I wouldn't be surprised if she's well outside the search radius. I'm always surprised at how far/long the "lost" are able to travel. IMO

 

[LietKynes]

Any way you could be more clear about this almost being unbelievable?

Agreed.

As in-- parts were not believable ?
Or sot terrible that it was nearly impossible to comprehend ?

 

[1&2&3]

Question - depending on how you look at his statement, I can see two different meanings.

Hubby said when he got back to trailer and lifted the rock up and saw the key was still there, he knew there was trouble. Not verbatim.

At first read, this statement makes absolute sense, nothing wrong with it.

After going back over all that we have been told, why would he go to get the key if Barbara returned ahead of him? She should have already gotten the key and been in the trailer!

Was Barbara even in the area?

 

[Atrain18]

That comment about rounding the bend makes me think they were walking on the far side of the road from Hidden Hills. That looks like the only spot where there is a corner to go around, a highway, and where you could be close to the camper. Somewhere near here: View attachment 193777

That area is only about 7 miles north of I-40.

The media articles I've read have said they were hiking 20 miles north of I-40.

There isn't much around the 20 mile vicinity. Kelso Dunes are kind of near there, but the Kelso Dunes trailhead is approximately 17 miles by road, 12 miles as the crow flies.

The Kelso Depot Center is a little over 20 miles away from I-40 as the crow flies and there's also a heavily used train rail system and some rural homes in that area. The rail heads east towards Vegas and west towards Barstow.

It's definitely flat in this area. I don't see any "bends" or any points of interest you would want to hike to. Most of the "trails" look like dry river beds with little vegetation.

My apologies if this has already been discussed.


Edit: Hidden Hills is nowhere near the train rail I described above. There is a ton of elevation change in the Hidden Hills area, I could easily see how someone could get disoriented or lost. The fireroads don't look very RV friendly and this area is only 8-10 miles north of I-40 as the crow flies... So I'm confused.

 

[mrstfs]

Agreed.

As in-- parts were not believable ?
Or sot terrible that it was nearly impossible to comprehend ?

He clarified what he meant in one of his subsequent posts but I can’t seem to find which one right now.

 

[GordianKnot]

One would think that red hat she was reportedly wearing really would stand out in that brown desert landscape.

Red is one of those colors that tends to jump out against relatively neutral-toned backdrops.

If she's lost, I hope she's waving that red hat over her head for all she's worth.

It's not like she's in the middle of a forest or in the mountains here.

JMO.