CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, Bullhead City, hiking wearing bikini in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019

[Cardinal47]

Hmm, remember, we don’t know that he showed deception on his lie detector test.

We know that he said that LE told him he showed deception on the test.

I can’t imagine any reason HE would lie about that, but my understanding is that it might be quite likely that LE would lie to him as an interrogation technique.

You know I've thought of that. Somewhere in time I followed a case where they did do that. Lied to the man taking the test and told him he failed when he passed.
Sorry I don't have a link.

 

[MassGuy]

Who said he failed the test?

RT said LE told him he was being deceptive.

I would like to hear what the administrator of the test says about whether or not RT was truly deceptive or not, if the test was conducted by an independent not associated with LE.

LE is not going to tell their prime suspect that he was not deceptive on the test, even if he was.

Oh, they do tell suspects if they fail.

They begin with an interview before the polygraph is administered, and in many cases they do a post polygraph interview.

Ever heard of Chris Watts?

 

[neesaki]

Your post sparked a thought re: emotional stressors.

There was a case here very recently on WS where a man (don't remember his name) went missing.
Interestingly, casinos came up in that one, as I recall.
One of his co-workers or something was posting on that thread, I think.
His brother was apparently gravely ill at the time he went missing.

Anyway, as it turns out, that guy had gone voluntarily missing.

I mention that case only b/c per our (unverified) insider, dbdb11, BT is planning on taking a trip to Hong Kong to see her own brother who is suffering from what sound like significant health issues as well.

Personally, I'm not seeing this being a reason for BT to disappear herself.
But I did think it was worth mentioning that we've seen it happen.

People under a great deal of emotional stress/duress behave unpredictably at times.

JMO.

Apologies if already addressed here, but just wondering if she could have undiagnosed early stage Alzheimers and got seriously lost. There's no telling where she may have ended up. Just a thought.

 

[PaulR]

Perhaps his excuse is that lie detector tests are quack nonsense?

No, no: that would be the absolute, absolute undisputable truth. Anyone who "fails" a lie detector test has just failed a *worthless* quack piece of garbage.

Actually that makes more sense than you'd think.

Polygraphs work by measuring stress levels. Indirectly this is measuring the amount of hormones like cortisol in the blood: Measuring Signs of Stress in the Body with Truth Verification Technology

Stress causes a lot of temporary changes in the body. It first registers in the brain, which goes into fight-or-flight mode when we feel fear or anxiety. The sympathetic nervous system (SNS) becomes engaged and stress hormones such as cortisol and adrenaline are released to give the body more energy. Our muscles tense up—the body’s way of protecting us. We also breathe differently; some forget to take a breath, hold our breath, or breathe faster in order to bring more oxygen to the brain. The heart starts to beat faster, and your body produces more glucose, providing the spark of energy needed for a dash away from danger. Our digestive system can also be affected, causing the sensation of butterflies in the stomach or even diarrhea.
...
Truth verification systems don’t actually detect lies; they measure the stress caused by those lies, according to CVSA Examiner and Senior Instructor Bill Endler. Right now, there are two main truth verification devices used by law enforcement—the polygraph and the Computer Voice Stress Analyzer (CVSA®). However, they measure stress in different ways.

The polygraph measures delayed or “downstream” physiological stress by monitoring heart rate, blood pressure, breathing, and galvanic skin response (GSR) through sensors placed on the body. These include a blood pressure cuff, pneumograph tubes around the chest to measure respiration, and galvanometers attached to the fingertips to measure perspiration. The subject is asked a series of questions and the results appear on a graph.

On the other hand, the CVSA measures one physiological change in response to questions. Remember how, when stressed, our muscles tense up? This also applies to the muscles that control the human voice, and this is what the CVSA focuses on. While stress doesn’t affect the pitch or the volume of our voice in a way that is apparent to the naked ear, it does cause vibrations in these tense muscles to change the FM frequencies in the voice. This response can only be measured by voice stress analysis software. The CVSA gathers this data through a microphone and the results are instantaneously charted on a graph.

He said he didn't sleep well. What happens when we don't sleep? Sleep loss results in an elevation of cortisol levels the next evening. - PubMed - NCBI

Plasma cortisol profiles were determined during a 32-hour period (from 1800 hours on day 1 until 0200 hours on day 3) in normal young men submitted to three different protocols: normal sleep schedule (2300-0700 hours), partial sleep deprivation (0400-0800 hours), and total sleep deprivation. Alterations in cortisol levels could only be demonstrated in the evening following the night of sleep deprivation. After normal sleep, plasma cortisol levels over the 1800-2300-hour period were similar on days 1 and 2. After partial and total sleep deprivation, plasma cortisol levels over the 1800-2300-hour period were higher on day 2 than on day 1 (37 and 45% increases, p = 0.03 and 0.003, respectively), and the onset of the quiescent period of cortisol secretion was delayed by at least 1 hour.

So yes, lack of sleep could cause a polygraph to return inaccurate results.

 

[wary]

She was drinking a cold beer so the refrigerator was most likely on (on most late model RVs the refrigerator can run on electric and gas) or they had a cooler with ice to keep the beer cold. She would have most likely gone for another cold beer if she was back at the truck and camper. So why would she be outside???

As I see it, if she minded the heat she wouldn’t be going camping in the desert in July. So, sitting outside relaxing with a cold beer might be preferable to being cooped up inside the camper.

 

[zecats]

I remember it as well. Which means if she did make it back and he found the key under the rock then she had to have been taken before she entered the RV and could give credence to her interrupting someone looking at their truck/camper. What if she surprised someone and they incapacitated her and took her away. Makes me wonder how far behind her he really was for him to not see or hear another car. On another note, he said he went back and checked some caves they knew about. Did anyone go back there and check again? Are there lava tubes along the way? MOO.

The lava tubes appear to be farther north in the Reserve, closer to Interstate 15. There is a warning about falling when trying to get down to see them though.

I thought maybe she did return, used the key to get in and use the bathroom, then went back out, leaving the key under the rock as he was not back yet...And perhaps she wandered momentarily off in the opposite direction, looking for rocks etc. I'm more concerned about abandoned mines and mine shafts.

 

[oviedo]

IF she was picked up by someone - would she have kept the beer/travel mug - whatever she was carrying? She is pretty fit - I would think she may struggle and drop it - and if she did where is it? I guess whoever took her could have picked it up ? I'm just trying to understand the abduction scenario - in the few minutes he lost sight of her -JMO

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Here's the second article where the reporter says RT mentioned Las Vegas (obviously, again, it is not a direct quote but is the source of all the discussion upthread):
"He’s asking people in surrounding areas, including Las Vegas, to be on high alert."
Woman missing from Mojave Desert

If he was misquoted in two separate MSM articles by the TV station that interviewed him, that based on their interview with him, he mentioned Las Vegas as an area where his missing wife could be, that would seem to have to be publishing misinformation intentionally, which makes no sense to me why they would trump up what he said. I think the intention was earnest, based on what he said to them, to put out the word for people to be on the lookout for her in this nearby metropolitan area.

It's tragic she has been missing for a week now, and there are no clues being reported by LE as to what they think might have happened to her. MOO

 

[Jwu]

The similarities between this case and the Powell case are pretty interesting. Short distance away from each other, experienced outdoorsy-types, husband is gone mere minutes and wife disappears. Both families claiming abduction from near the beginning, both husbands originally under suspicion. We've got one story of a knife-wielding crazy man in the other story and another story (admittedly coming from the husband and not Barbara) with a possible random man choosing BT because she was wearing a bikini and crossing a road. It's amazing to read the same back and forth in this case, as is happening in the other case. Thankfully in the Powell case, she was found. While I wish that would be the case here, already 7 days in for BT is not looking good. I do hope for the family's sake, it's just her having been lost though and not something more nefarious.

 

[MassGuy]

The only thing I am clinging to that makes me 51% on the side of she is lost in the desert is this: If you're going to do harm to your wife and hide it by concocting a "she got lost while hiking" story why would you describe her attire as a bikini and boots with a beer in her hand? Why not make it at least reasonable, ordinary, average etc...

Maybe the story goes like this: She was inside the trailer in her underwear with a beer. They had a fight or as a joke and he kicked/locked her out of the trailer. Perhaps it was even an accident as they were both drinking (MOO). After sometime he goes outside and she is gone. He makes up the story about hiking and fails his polygraph test.

It’s always a dangerous proposition to try and rationalize the logic of a person you do not know.

He’s not thinking like you.

If she’s 51% in the desert though, she’s 100% dead now.

 

[oviedo]

Attempting to summarize what has been reported so far..

Search underway for lost hiker in Mojave Desert
2:30pm reported time - black bikini, red hat, boots/socks. No supplies or cellphones - she walked ahead when he stopped to take a picture.
69-year-old Arizona woman missing after hiking in Mojave Desert
They were about 20 miles north of Interstate 40, east of Kelbaker Road.

Thomas was last seen wearing a black bikini, a red baseball cap, and tan hiking boots.
The search for 69-year-old Barbara Thomas is continuing In the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden Hills near ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

Barbara Thomas, 69 years old, resident of Bullhead City, Az.
5'9, 130 lbs., Blonde hair, Green eyes
Last seen wearing a black bikini, a red baseball cap and tan hiking boots with black socks

UPDATE #2:
The search is moving into the third day for Barbara Thomas in the Mohave desert. Barbara was last seen in the area of Kelbaker / Hidden Hills near the I-40. The search involves numerous Search & Rescue members, deputies, K9’s, Sheriff’s Aviation(helicopter) and Park Rangers.
There have been no sightings of her at this time. The temperatures today hovered around 104 degrees.

Hiker Wearing Bikini Disappears in Southern California's Sweltering Mojave Desert


Bikini-Clad 69-Year-Old Woman Missing After Hiking in Mojave Desert Amid Heatwave

Arizona woman missing in California's Mojave Desert

Woman, 69, missing in Mojave with no supplies or cellphone and wearing only a bikini
Cat L. Smith
First report of shorts

Woman missing from Mojave Desert

Husband thinks she was taken (first report of this that I have found)

Search for woman, 69, missing in Mojave Desert after separated from husband while hiking in bikini | Daily Mail Online
Bikini-clad woman, 69, reported missing after hiking in Mojave Desert in California amid heatwave
Still searching Tuesday
69-year-old bikini-clad woman missing in Mojave Desert – San Bernardino Sun

Woman Goes Missing Without Supplies in Mojave Desert Amid High Temperatures
Thomas’ husband told KTNV that they took their trailer to the desert for the weekend. They were close to the RV when Robert stopped to take a picture.

“By the time I took the picture she was continuing on because she wanted to get to the RV,” he said. “And she rounded the corner and I lost sight of her.”

He suspects something happened when she crossed a highway. “My feeling is that she was picked up because she had to cross a highway. She was wearing a bikini and she had a beer in her hand.”

He said she may be in the Las Vegas area.

Search continues for missing Bullhead City woman
Search for bikini-clad woman in Mojave Desert expands with off-road vehicles

Desert Mines & Mills
July 16
July 16th - The search for Barbara Thomas, age 69, is continuing in the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle

Husband of Woman Who Vanished During Mojave Desert Hike: 'I Just Want Her Back'
Husband takes a lie detector test

San Bernardino County Sheriff on Twitter
Volunteers and off-road vehicles join hunt for bikini-clad 69-year-old 'abducted' in Mojave Desert | Daily Mail Online

July 17th - The search for Barbara Thomas, age 69, is continuing in the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle


Arizona Woman, 69, Missing for 5 Days in the Mojave Desert After Going Hiking with Husband
Roadside Camping - Mojave National Preserve (U.S. National Park Service)

Map:
https://www.nps.gov/moja/planyourvisit/upload/MOJAmap1.pdf

Latest MSM:
https://nypost.com/2019/07/19/missing-hikers-husband-swears-hes-innocent-after-failing-lie-detector/

These are the stories and interviews I've seen so far - if she was using the bathroom - it would be in one of these IMO. There is the other hiker that was lost (now found) that was using the bathroom and got approached by a knife wielding man. I don't recall reading that BT needed to but it would be a good reason to go ahead and not wait on him to take his picture IMO.

 

[wary]

The only thing I am clinging to that makes me 51% on the side of she is lost in the desert is this: If you're going to do harm to your wife and hide it by concocting a "she got lost while hiking" story why would you describe her attire as a bikini and boots with a beer in her hand? Why not make it at least reasonable, ordinary, average etc...

Maybe the story goes like this: She was inside the trailer in her underwear with a beer. They had a fight or as a joke and he kicked/locked her out of the trailer. Perhaps it was even an accident as they were both drinking (MOO). After sometime he goes outside and she is gone. He makes up the story about hiking and fails his polygraph test.

That’s an interesting idea. Also, it’d be better, I’d think, to set up a timeline that provided more time for her to get lost?

(I realize that we can’t ever make assumptions based on thinking that criminals will be logical. And I’m NOT saying that he is a criminal.)

 

[whitelilac]

Upthread I read it was a mile back to the camper from where she left Robert. That's not really such a short distance in the heat of the desert. I'd like to know whether Barbara could see the camper from where she "turned a corner".
I remember once in Joshua Tree we parked on the side of a road and walked a bit from it. The flat rocks landscape was really disorienting, the same in all directions. I can well imagine getting lost if we could no longer see the car.

 

[GordianKnot]

Actually that makes more sense than you'd think.

Polygraphs work by measuring stress levels. Indirectly this is measuring the amount of hormones like cortisol in the blood: Measuring Signs of Stress in the Body with Truth Verification Technology



He said he didn't sleep well. What happens when we don't sleep? Sleep loss results in an elevation of cortisol levels the next evening. - PubMed - NCBI



So yes, lack of sleep could cause a polygraph to return inaccurate results.

Great info.

And what this info does is exponentially increase my suspicions of the husband.

RT does not at all strike me as the type of guy who would possess a vast fund of knowledge about the reliability of polygraphs and/or how lack of sleep potentially affects their results.

The fact that he was able to glibly supply his purported sleeplessness as the ostensible reason for him having shown deception on his own poly is actually quite concerning to me.

JMO.

 

[Cardinal47]

It's a stretch for me to go from hiking in the desert with a cup of beer and a bikini to being in Las Vegas.
With that said..I love the slots and I can imagine my husband saying that. Yep!

 

[Kapua]

Your post sparked a thought re: emotional stressors.

There was a case here very recently on WS where a man (don't remember his name) went missing.
Interestingly, casinos came up in that one, as I recall.
One of his co-workers or something was posting on that thread, I think.
His brother was apparently gravely ill at the time he went missing.

Anyway, as it turns out, that guy had gone voluntarily missing.

I mention that case only b/c per our (unverified) insider, dbdb11, BT is planning on taking a trip to Hong Kong next week to see her own brother who is suffering from what sounds like significant health issues.

Personally, I'm not seeing this being a reason for BT to hide away from the world.
But I did think it was worth mentioning that we've seen it happen.

People under a great deal of emotional stress/duress behave unpredictably at times.

I do wonder if she's ever been known to hitchhike.

JMO.

JMHO, I wouldn't rule out anyone going voluntarily missing. However, if I ever go voluntarily missing, it will be in Hawaii, not in the Mojave desert in July. Barb may have been a bigger fan of 100+ degree heat than I am. I want to know: if she is there, why haven't they found her? Where did her cell phone ping last? Did she have it with her? Did anyone else actually see her there?

 

[ClaireNC]

FWIW currently there are three sections of traffic delays on that stretch of Kelbaker Rd. One at Hidden Hills Rd, one at Granite Pass and one at the curve in the road.

 

[PommyMommy]

Here's the second article where the reporter says RT mentioned Las Vegas (obviously, again, it is not a direct quote but is the source of all the discussion upthread):
"He’s asking people in surrounding areas, including Las Vegas, to be on high alert."
Woman missing from Mojave Desert

If he was misquoted in two separate MSM articles by the TV station that interviewed him, that based on their interview with him, he mentioned Las Vegas as an area where his missing wife could be, that would seem to have to be publishing misinformation intentionally, which makes no sense to me why they would trump up what he said. I think the intention was earnest, based on what he said to them, to put out the word for people to be on the lookout for her in this nearby metropolitan area.

It's tragic she has been missing for a week now, and there are no clues being reported by LE as to what they think might have happened to her. MOO

BBM Gee, that almost sounds like a criminal investigation. MOO

 

[iscaremyself]

Actually that makes more sense than you'd think.

Polygraphs work by measuring stress levels. Indirectly this is measuring the amount of hormones like cortisol in the blood: Measuring Signs of Stress in the Body with Truth Verification Technology



He said he didn't sleep well. What happens when we don't sleep? Sleep loss results in an elevation of cortisol levels the next evening. - PubMed - NCBI



So yes, lack of sleep could cause a polygraph to return inaccurate results.

I didn't know that..why did he?..hmmm curious

 

[Stripehaven]

But, that is just one interview. Have you listened to both?

At about 1:13 (first interview):
"My feeling is that she was picked up. Because she had to cross the highway. She was wearing a bikini and she had a beer in her hand."

At about 1:12 (second interview)
"I feel that, uh, somebody picked her up, uh, because she was wearing a bikini, she had a beer in her hand, and she was ahead of me and she had to cross that road."

Thank you! Now I don’t feel so bad for my initial impression! And I didn’t imagine it.