Two huge questions....
1. What was her state of mind, at the time of her last known sighting....
IMO, she appears to be acting strange right from the moment she walks into the elevator....why would anyone press all the buttons immediately walking into an elevator...at that point she doesn't appear alarmed or scared....
This makes me think she is hallucinating... Her odd behaviour including paranoia in the elevator may be from the hallucinations....
2. From the info that has been made available by LE and sleuthing posted by netizens.... Why and how did the body end up in the tank?
Great sleuthing everyone! Thoughts?
http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/A...eded+determine+cause+death/8012631/story.html
VANCOUVER SUN FEBRUARY 25, 2013 9:40 AM
Same information, different source.
Let's see if the CKNW story issues an "update" at all....?
http://www.cknw.com/news/vancouver/s...spx?ID=1897213
The toxicology results likely are needed to explain why she ended up in the tank and to explain her odd behaviour in the elevator.... I still think there is a probability that it was freak accident.... Time will tell...
Ok, but still the initial autopsy would have been able to reveal that the cause (not manner) of death was drowning if she had entered that tank alive. And as far as we know it did not.
And poof, the CKNW story is now gone. I am received (the dreaded) 404 page not found message.
Bad link:
Here's the whole link:
http://www.cknw.com/news/vancouver/story.aspx/story.aspx?ID=1897213
cknw.com/news/vancouver/story.aspx/story.aspx?ID=1897213
LAPD claims:
"We've done a comprehensive investigation with interviewing everybody at the hotel." - Detective Tim Marcia
Oh oh oh ! I think I've got it ! Oops, sorry to alarm , not what happened necessarily . BUT I just had a thought about the autopsy unable to determine COD and wanting to wait on tox results ! Some med, especially valium, cause the lungs to become sedate. It's used in concert with other drugs during surgery / anesthestic ? Here's where I will need some help . Could someone have slipped her valium and if she did go into tank ( whether on her own or forced there) her lungs not APPEAR as if drowning occurred after the fact because they were SO SEDATED, they no longer react the same way as what a coroner was looking for as far as determining drowning or not ? I'm afraid that made no sense.
Rephrasing question.... Can drowning be determined definitively when looking at the lungs IF the person has had a BIG dose of valium? ( or some similar drug).
If a person had been in the water all that time, would the drugs, alcohol or medication still be able to be measured in the blood accurately?Ok, but still the initial autopsy would have been able to reveal that the cause (not manner) of death was drowning if she had entered that tank alive. And as far as we know it did not.
Oh oh oh ! I think I've got it ! Oops, sorry to alarm , not what happened necessarily . BUT I just had a thought about the autopsy unable to determine COD and wanting to wait on tox results ! Some med, especially valium, cause the lungs to become sedate. It's used in concert with other drugs during surgery / anesthestic ? Here's where I will need some help . Could someone have slipped her valium and if she did go into tank ( whether on her own or forced there) her lungs not APPEAR as if drowning occurred after the fact because they were SO SEDATED, they no longer react the same way as what a coroner was looking for as far as determining drowning or not ? I'm afraid that made no sense.
Rephrasing question.... Can drowning be determined definitively when looking at the lungs IF the person has had a BIG dose of valium? ( or some similar drug)
Thank you Think Hard, I am I am !
Few years back someone I know OD'd on valium. Virtually in a comatose state and was literally DROWNING, the dr said , of Carbon Dioxide . So very little lung function was taking place that the normal process of breathing IN oxygen and breahing OUT carbon dioxide was not happening ...... the breaths were so shallow and far apart that a buildup of carbon dioxide was in the body and became a poison. Ugh , a real nightmare.
Very interesting....
I'm also pretty sure that when a dead body is in water for a time, the internal bacterial go wild, releasing very similar gases....which can cause refloat......
Could explain why they are so uncertain about how she died.
The thing with Valium is its a sedative, and usually makes you tired and heavy....Are you thinking she took it and made it up there on her own? I think Valium would impair her coordination...
....or could someone else have put her in their when she was in this severe Valium state....causing the already weird lung issues .... And further confusing autopsy results?
If a person had been in the water all that time, would the drugs, alcohol or medication still be able to be measured in the blood accurately?
A diagnosis of drowning cannot be made without a complete autopsy and full toxicologic screening, histologic analyses of all organs including the lungs, and the diatom test. The diagnosis of drowning cannot be based solely on the circumstances of the death, nonspecific anatomic findings, and the results of biologic analyses. (Payne-James, Busuittil and Smock at p250)
It emerges that the investigation must be carried out without any preconceived idea that because a body has been found in water drowning is the cause of death. The examinations must, therefore, include a detailed examination of the clothing and the body for marks.
At autopsy, the lungs of a drowning victim commonly resemble those seen in deaths associated with severe pulmonary edema, as in cases of arteriosclerotic heart disease. (Spitz and Fisher at p 353)
The presence of pulmonary edema is of no help, as it might be present in drug overdoses, heart failure or drowning
http://netk.net.au/Reports/DiagnosticsofDrowning.asp
Link from Think Hard, tks again
Also, they're probably using the water from those unlocked water tanks to shoot drugs and if they're reusing needles and syringes, that contamination is also going into hotel and other building's water supplies.
I don't think we're allowed to post links to people who aren't confirmed to be persons of interest in the case.
But I remember seeing that Vimeo account linked to before, and it freaked me out a little. I couldn't watch the videos (too creeped out) but there were video titles like 'waiting for the elevator' and 'secretly my hands tell messages'? Yet they were from a year ago
Maybe I'm a big scaredy cat but I'm afraid to click on those links now
edit: I clicked on the Tumblr just to peek at the titles and see if it was the same thing, be warned that on the second page of the blog some of the videos auto-play themselves. It gave me a scare and I closed it quickly. It looks as though some of the videos may have explicit content, given the tags. This is all so messed up
I do not understand why people keep thinking there is any possibility this is suicide.
In order for it to be suicide Elisa Lam would have had to have been alive when she went into that tank. She would have died of drowning. This would have been IMMEDIATELY obvious to a medical examiner. She would have had lungs filled with water. And the autopsy would have shed some light on to this fact.
The fact the autopsy report so far has revealed nothing and that they NEED toxology results to determine cause of death, tells us she was already dead when her body entered that tank.