Recovered/Located CA - Cecil Knutson (dec'd), Dianna Bedwell (inj'd), Valley Ctr, 10 May 2015

[GigTu]

This is awful. I feel so bad for the family.

Just my two cents, this sounds like a car accident to me. If there was no breaking or swerving and they just "drove off the road", it would be very hard to detect a trace of that while driving down the road. And if there are trees and the car is upside down, it will be tough to spot from the air.

I hate to say it, but they need to get some dogs out there and stop every 50' for at least a 1/4 mile radius from the last ping.

 

[watcher9]

Do they normally carry cash or do they use credit cards to buy snacks along the way?
After all this time, they would have needed to get gas if they were lost and still traveling.
Would they ask for help or directions if needed?
If they ran off the highway, wouldn't it have had to be a lonely stretch of highway where no one could witness the accident?

 

[steelman]

Here is a quick map I made up of the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zAAmDUXJe_aE.kgrCr1tZB1LM

I am baffled by the driving directions given in post #10 above.

Left casino (specified the door) and went left and then NB on Lake Wolford, cell phone, then another left at the end of Lake Wolford, and then onto Deer Springs Road for 10 miles until the 15 freeway entrance.

Dianna's last ping was at exit of the Valley View casino, and his 10 miles away at the 15 freeway entrance

Deer Springs road is no where near the casino. How would they drive down it for 10 miles after leaving the casino ?

You guys figure it out.

You can zoom map in and out with the center wheel on your mouse. Left click and drag to move it around on your screen.

 

[ButForFortune]

I can't imagine what this family is going through.
It is interesting and frightening that both phones were turned off at different times.
Something which her son says neither of them do.

He says they always call to say they are leaving the casino, but didn't this time.
It seems as if something occurred just as they were leaving. But the question is what??
They see them leave and get into their car. They know what direction they traveled.
Could someone have been in the back seat, out of view?

BBM - this was my immediate thought also.

 

[TravelingBug]

Here is a quick map I made up of the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zAAmDUXJe_aE.kgrCr1tZB1LM

I am baffled by the driving directions given in post #10 above.



Deer Springs road is no where near the casino. How would they drive down it for 10 miles after leaving the casino ?

You guys figure it out.

You can zoom map in and out with the center wheel on your mouse. Left click and drag to move it around on your screen.

I think what the broadcaster meant to say is that they drove 10 miles to Deer Springs Road and he just didn't say that clearly.

Because he also said Cecil's phone pinged 10 miles from the casino at Deer Springs Road - and it's not 10 miles there.

But it would be about that TO Deer Springs Road from the last turn and going from there at Lake Wolford Road to Deer Springs.

I WISH what they had said was exactly how they went to Deer Springs.

Did they go El Norte and up Centre City Parkway? Did they go up N. Broadway toward Country Club and over to Centre City? Or to Jesmond Dene?

Jesmond Dene actually runs pretty closely to N. Centre City and then merges into N. Centre City just south of Deer Springs where they'd have entered.

I suspect the phone could have pinged the same general route if they had done Jesmond Dene instead up to Centre City and just been off what (to me would be the most likely route of Centre City) and could have been missed?

Did they go further down to Valley and then across and north on Centre City or something?

To me there are FAR more unknowns on that stretch from what has been said in the media and FAR more options.

And if you don't know the area, the funky little options with Centre City / Country Club / Jesmond Dene / Broadway that area can be a little weird.

You DO NOT really feel like you're going the right way coming from El Norte (which is what they most likely were on from Lake Wolford Road)

And I live here and drive those roads and KNOW if I give someone directions that involves that area to let them know that it does seem to be a kind of circuitous route, especially since if they really did take El Norte from Lake Wolford, instead of going up the Centre City N route, they could have gone just a smidge further and hit 15 directly at El Norte also instead of then running along below the freeway just to enter at Deer Springs.

 

[TieDyeJedi]

Just based on the map alone it looks like they may have missed the on ramp and may have stopped to turn around. But I'm on the other coast, so I wouldn't know the first thing about driving it in person.

 

[TravelingBug]

As I just drove up the road a bit to the store - looking north toward where all this happened it made me think of another case on WS from awhile ago.

It took me a bit to find it, but I finally tracked it down! The Holly Fischer case from TN/NC.

There were all sorts of weird things with her cell pings, timing, etc. and the route where her car ultimately ended up being a found had been checked multiple times and no one noticed anything.

UNTIL a MC rider noticed the marks and them going off through grass that was right near the edge of a parking lot for a no-longer-functioning business at a curve in the road.

Even just prior to her being found over a month after she had gone missing that stretch had been looked at by authorities and others and NO ONE noticed it.

It was the one stretch between two guardrails that a car could have gotten and her car apparently did.

Anyway, Montjoy, in this post http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...harlotte-NC-27-May-2013&p=9588547#post9588547 had some interesting thoughts as to why a MC rider might be more apt to notice something like skid marks or something than someone in a passenger vehicle, especially if they were driving alone in a car.

It'd be interesting to see if one of the MC groups that go out riding often would ride both routes to Valley View from Deer Springs (via Esco - meaning Centre City / El Norte / Lake Wolford as they apparently went; AND going via Champagne / Old 395 / Lilac / Old Castle - JUST in case they backtracked) to check for anything they might notice.

 

[TravelingBug]

In the images, Cecil Knutson and Diana Bedwell can be seen walking outside Valley View Casino located in the North County. The video was recorded just before 2 p.m.

Source: http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...le-Leaves-Casino-303515211.html#ixzz3Zxy5YsKF
Follow us: @nbcsandiego on Twitter | NBCSanDiego on Facebook

 

[steelman]

I think what the broadcaster meant to say is that they drove 10 miles to Deer Springs Road and he just didn't say that clearly.

Because he also said Cecil's phone pinged 10 miles from the casino at Deer Springs Road - and it's not 10 miles there.

But it would be about that TO Deer Springs Road from the last turn and going from there at Lake Wolford Road to Deer Springs.

I WISH what they had said was exactly how they went to Deer Springs.

Did they go El Norte and up Centre City Parkway? Did they go up N. Broadway toward Country Club and over to Centre City? Or to Jesmond Dene?

Jesmond Dene actually runs pretty closely to N. Centre City and then merges into N. Centre City just south of Deer Springs where they'd have entered.

I suspect the phone could have pinged the same general route if they had done Jesmond Dene instead up to Centre City and just been off what (to me would be the most likely route of Centre City) and could have been missed?

Did they go further down to Valley and then across and north on Centre City or something?

To me there are FAR more unknowns on that stretch from what has been said in the media and FAR more options.

And if you don't know the area, the funky little options with Centre City / Country Club / Jesmond Dene / Broadway that area can be a little weird.

You DO NOT really feel like you're going the right way coming from El Norte (which is what they most likely were on from Lake Wolford Road)

And I live here and drive those roads and KNOW if I give someone directions that involves that area to let them know that it does seem to be a kind of circuitous route, especially since if they really did take El Norte from Lake Wolford, instead of going up the Centre City N route, they could have gone just a smidge further and hit 15 directly at El Norte also instead of then running along below the freeway just to enter at Deer Springs.

All I know is this, after looking at the map, there are about 20 different routes they could have traveled to make it over to the I-15 entrance ramp . If they were out putzing around and taking an afternoon drive....better make it 50.

It's no wonder they can't find them. I still say they are within a mile or two of the last phone ping, which apparently was close to the I-15 on-ramp. I assume they were going to head north, but who knows.

 

[watcher9]

Here is a quick map I made up of the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zAAmDUXJe_aE.kgrCr1tZB1LM

I am baffled by the driving directions given in post #10 above.



Deer Springs road is no where near the casino. How would they drive down it for 10 miles after leaving the casino ?

You guys figure it out.

You can zoom map in and out with the center wheel on your mouse. Left click and drag to move it around on your screen.

I was confused about Deer Springs Road too. It was going out west from I-15.

You are so smart to make all those little symbols and then be able to bring a map into the thread. I still can't do one but I can tell you the way the route looks on my computer using regular Google maps, not earth. I hope you can follow me.

Plugging in the casino and the LaQuinta destination, Google shows two different routes - one goes by interstate and the other one goes the back way, apparently through the mountains. Using the interstate one, the route from the casino is going Lilac Rd and then Old Castle Rd until it dead ends at N Old Hwy 395. Take a rt on N Old Hwy 395 and then left on Gopher Canyon Rd to get to I-15. That I am assuming is their normal route. This looks to be an I-15 interchange north of where you marked your I-15 interchange.

If you would look up or north on 395 just a block or two, you can see the Deep Springs Fire Protection District HQ on the rt. So maybe this interchange is considered part of the Deep Springs community.

Now, if you were to turn down or south on 395 which parallels I-15, the road name changes to Champagne Blvd. You can follow that road all the way down to the Deep Springs Rd we found on the map. I believe that the 395-Champagne Blvd used to be part of the old Deep Springs Rd, maybe before the interstate came and a lot of people may still call it that.

 

[TravelingBug]

Just based on the map alone it looks like they may have missed the on ramp and may have stopped to turn around. But I'm on the other coast, so I wouldn't know the first thing about driving it in person.

Knowing they went by way of Lake Wolford Road in order to get to Deer Springs, while there are many options in some spots, ultimately, unless there are a lot of missing or unreported pings, they basically HAD to end up on either N. Centre City Parkway or Jesmond Dene to merge onto N. Centre City Parkway.

Otherwise, they can't have gotten to near the Deer Springs ramp unless pings somewhere else were WAY off.

Without knowing some of the middle pings there is some leeway, but knowing the ones they included (how they left the casino, where their initial turns were, etc. onto Lake Wolford - and the last one at Deer Springs) does eliminate some choices.

Had they missed turning left (west) from N. Centre City Parkway and onto Deer Springs (where if they had gone back east it turns into Mountain Meadow) just in order to take the NB 15, then they'd have continued on N. Centre City Parkway.

N. Centre City Parkway turns into Champagne Blvd after you pass the Deer Springs Rd option, and goes past the Lawrence Welk Resort, and then turns into Old Highway 395 right near Old Castle Road (which is the other route to Valley View from the 15) and you hit Gopher Canyon - the NEXT entrance/exit to the 15 if you miss Deer Springs.

N. Centre City isn't a big road - one lane each direction north of Deer Springs and up to Gopher Canyon, etc.

Had they decided to turn around if they missed Deer Springs, it'd be hard to do without turning into a private drive or something, plus it's pretty clear that road keeps going (if you're driving on it it's pretty clear) and you can tell you're running parallel to the 15 and will eventually hit it again.

Because there are so few options off that road, it seems like if they had turned around to go back, deciding not to trust the parallel / business freeway type route that N. Centre City is, they really shouldn't have been able to miss Deer Springs a second time to then go on the freeway the right way.

Maybe I'll see if I can get up there with someone and drive it so you guys can see it

 

[TravelingBug]

The one thing I DO hope they looked at was footage from the AM/PM / Arco that's RIGHT at Deer Springs Road on the west side of 15.

It is basically RIGHT there!

And they'd have seen it coming down the 15 when they exited at Deer Springs to go to Valley View.

When you exit 15 SB (which they'd have done coming from Anaheim - as they'd almost certainly taken the 91 over and then down the 15) at Deer Springs, you SEE the Arco / AM/PM on the right hand side FROM the exit.

You pretty much CAN'T miss it.

It would be an EASY bathroom stop (or grab a snack or put some gas in the car) type place because it's RIGHT at the freeway at Deer Springs and they'd have easily remembered it being there.

THAT is where they absolutely should look at video - IMO - to see if they stopped there for a bathroom break or more (whether they typically used it or used a card normally, I could see perhaps using cash for snacks - or heck, even gas - perhaps after maybe winning a bit at the casino?)

There's a little parking lot / park and ride type thing also right there at the corner of Mesa Rock Rd that I doubt has a camera, but I'm sure there are multiple at the Arco / AM/PM.

It's a busy place as there is a stretch where there just aren't many very easy stops heading on that part of the 15.

There's one at the south end of Temecula that's always a nightmare crowd wise - and you can tell that from the freeway - and then there's another that's more of a truck type stop one, so the Deer Springs one is the more accessible, no wait just to even exit the freeway type option.

Plus, Cecil's phone could easily ping where it's reported to have and they could actually be on the WEST side of the freeway had they gone to the Arco / AM/PM and/or left there and gotten turned around and then had an accident or incident.

And it would NOT be the likely side to be looking on since that'd have not allowed them to get NB onto 15, so it would be less likely they'd thoroughly ground search that side.

 

[meanmaryjean]

She is Sylvia Likens sister? Wow!

 

[TravelingBug]

Also by that Arco / AM/PM there is often a little farmstand on the weekends.

That area often has people sell avocados or melons (avocados are the big thing usually) at little stands and sometimes flowers, as well.

I'd try to check with them if someone recalls who was out there selling on Sunday - with it being Mother's Day it's even more likely.

Perhaps Cecil and Dianna might have stopped thinking they'd bring something to the family's home?

That could give them multiple possible interaction points over on that side of the freeway...

 

[TravelingBug]

And it'd be interesting to see the TIMING of the ping at Deer Springs to see if it makes sense from the time they were seen actually leaving Valley View.

 

[TravelingBug]

In this photo you can see how you'd see the Arco / AM/PM / farmstand, etc.

The maroon vehicle you can barely see is at the stoplight at Deer Springs just getting OFF of 15 SB (like they'd have done going to Valley View - assuming they went the same way they are reported to have left)

You can clearly see the Park & Ride right there at the corner of Deer Springs and Mesa Rock, and then right by the small Arco / AM/PM sign you can see a small silver SUV type thing (like a Honda CRV sort) by an umbrella - that's where there's often a little farmstand and people just pull next to it.

 

[steelman]

San Diego and Riverside County Sheriff’s have three helicopters searching the area between Valley Center and the Coachella Valley, but so far have turned up no evidence of a crash site, no sightings of the couple or their car.

“My mom's phone was shut off fairly quickly after leaving the casino.” About 15 minutes later their dad's phone was shut off as they drove on Highway 15 near Deer Springs Road

Anybody local there, keep trying to piece together the route they may have taken from what bits and pieces of clues we have. Above are areas mentioned in the MSM


BTW-- Cecil Knutson's daughter is leaving comments at the link below:

Scroll to the bottom of the article to view: user name is Kris TAL K

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...n-Dianna-Bedwell-303304871.html#ixzz3ZrK7UJkQ

Apparently she lives in Florida

 

[TravelingBug]

This is showing how easily visible the Arco / AM/PM would have been exiting the 15 SB (coming from Anaheim via the 91 to the 15) at Deer Springs.

I have my little "guy" on what is the 15 SB exit onto Deer Springs just a few feet beyond the light. It's two immediate rights and it's right there. But you can easily see it.

 

[steelman]

The couple; Cecil “Paul” Knutson, 79, and Dianna Bedwell, 67; planned to head to their son’s home in La Quinta in Riverside County after the casino, but never made it, according to a bulletin from the San Diego County Sheriff’s Department.

Their son told NBC 7 he was expecting them for Mother's Day dinner at 4 p.m

Son Robert Acosta said their disappearance is highly unusual, as they are always punctual and are always in touch with family members.

He said when they didn’t show up by 4:30 p.m., he started dialing both their cellphones repeatedly, but no one answered.


“This is way out of their character. They would never blow me, my wife and my daughter off,” he said. “There’s something wrong.”

Acosta said he called and checked in with his mom at 10:30 that morning and everything seemed fine.

Deputies said the couple was last seen leaving the casino in Valley Center at about 2 p.m. on Mother’s Day. They did not return to their home in Fullerton and both of their cell phones were turned off, their son said.

By 5 p.m., Acosta said he knew something was wrong, so he headed to Valley View and drove throughout the surrounding area all night, looking for any trace of their vehicle.
He found no trace of them and says he now fears the worst.

Source: http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...n-Dianna-Bedwell-303304871.html#ixzz3ZyBAg0g9
Follow us: @nbcsandiego on Twitter | NBCSanDiego on Facebook

 

[TravelingBug]

This is driving NB on N. Centre City Parkway, which is what they'd have had to do in order to end up at Deer Springs (coming from Lake Wolford as their pings are reported to have done)

That light is Deer Springs if you go left (west) and Mountain Meadow if you go right.

If you continue north, N. Centre City Parkway turns into Champagne Blvd, passes Lawrence Welk, turns into Old Highway 395, and then you can enter the 15 again at Gopher Canyon.

Also, if you took Champagne (whether b/c you missed Deer Springs or intentionally - which people sometimes do if they see traffic on the freeway) up to Gopher Canyon, you'd also pass Old Castle / Lilac which give you the other (windier) route to Valley View.

The latter is the other route I think they really need to drive carefully and check in case something caused them to go back toward Valley View (perhaps Dianna having left her phone or dropped it or something, perhaps it powering off - maybe explaining her phone stopping pinging there?)

And I think they ought to check with security / lost & found at Valley View to see if a phone has been turned in (say perhaps if it was left in a restroom or at a table and someone turned it in, but turned it off) - not necessarily something someone would think to look specifically for, I'd not think? (Meaning not even thinking her phone could be sitting there securely)