Found Deceased CA - Kiely Rodni missing from Party Near Prosser Family Campground in Truckee #7

[LooksSusToMe]

AWP has said before that a car with open windows sinks faster. Her car could have sank within 30 secs, so did she really have time to move all the way to the cargo area for air when there likely was not any air pockets for very long?

I realize Kiely was thin, but she was tall for a girl at 5’7”. I don’t think it would be possible for her body to move all the way to the cargo area and stay there in the time it took to sink.

I hate to say it but from AWP’s underwater footage it looks as though she’s laying with her legs scrunched up to fit in the cargo area. The seats look up and not folded down IMO

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

In the Honda's I have owned, I needed to open one of the rear doors and really yank on things.

I'm a few inches taller than Kiely was and abt 60 pounds heavier, for context.

They definitely don't make it easy.

 

[Gemmie]

AWP has said before that a car with open windows sinks faster. Her car could have sank within 30 secs, so did she really have time to move all the way to the cargo area for air when there likely was not any air pockets for very long?

I realize Kiely was thin, but she was tall for a girl at 5’7”. I don’t think it would be possible for her body to move all the way to the cargo area and stay there in the time it took to sink.

I hate to say it but from AWP’s underwater footage it looks as though she’s laying with her legs scrunched up to fit in the cargo area. The seats look up and not folded down IMO

Perhaps the rushing in of water helped push her body back that way when it was in the nose dive position. MOO Because at some point (seconds in) that would have been the only part of the car with air, and the water was rising fast and furious, likely helping propel her up. MOO

ETA - I've GOT TO start "Liking" posts before I hit Quote & Reply. I apologize to all that I responded to over the years, but failed to acknowledge that I liked your post.

 

[Beekarina]

So this may be completely unrelated, but I noticed it, so posting.

There is what appears to be recent damage to the rear of Kiely's CRV, visible below. Similar spot on opposite side, but I could not quite grab it before video cut to AWP at surface.

 

[Gemmie]

So this may be completely unrelated, but I noticed it, so posting.

There is what appears to be recent damage to the rear of Kiely's CRV, visible below. Similar spot on opposite side, but I could not quite grab it before video cut to AWP at surface.

View attachment 363744

I had wondered early on if she was having fun doing donuts and if she rolled her car (I know all too well how easy it is to roll a car since I did it once), and that's how some damage to the car was done. But I don't recall seeing evidence of donuts where they pulled her out, but I did see them somewhere nearby. I had pointed that out upthread. Here's that post: Found Deceased - CA - Kiely Rodni Missing From Party Near Prosser Family Campground in Truckee #6

 

[Gemmie]

So this may be completely unrelated, but I noticed it, so posting.

There is what appears to be recent damage to the rear of Kiely's CRV, visible below. Similar spot on opposite side, but I could not quite grab it before video cut to AWP at surface.

View attachment 363744

I did it again (Didn't Like first before quoting)

I wanted to say GOOD CATCH!!! I had not noticed that.

 

[NeverPersonal]

probably old news for y'all, but i just realized AWP meant she was in the hatchback, like the trunk. not simply the backseat. that changes things IMO. backseat i would get - searching for a pocket of air. hatchback is a bit more suspicious to me

 

[Gemmie]

probably old news for y'all, but i just realized AWP meant she was in the hatchback, like the trunk. not simply the backseat. that changes things IMO. backseat i would get - searching for a pocket of air. hatchback is a bit more suspicious to me

She could have had the cover open or closed. If closed, and she was under it (inside the trunk area), the diver would not have been able to see her when he peered through the window. He'd have seen the top of the cover. So due to that, she was either on top of the cover (IOW... roof on the bottom of the lake bed, then Kiely, then the closed cover (if it was closed), and then the trunk space. Or the cover was open to store stuff, or whatever. So the above "IOW scenario" minus the cover in-between.

Again, IMHO, if he saw her through the rear window, she was laying on the roof and NOT under the trunk cover.

 

[Megnut]

Like Sully's decision to land the plane in the Hudson, IMO all these videos on how to save yourself in a sinking car fail to account for the timespan it takes for a person to react!! What all these survival videos have in common is awareness! They know what's going to happen and mentally are several steps ahead!!

This was a dynamic situation for Kiely. As she's processing and then reacting, already new things are happening to the vehicle so she's got an emergent reality to process and then react to!

First, the awareness she's in water, then that she's going to sink. Tick tick tick. Her clock is starting but the car has a headstart. Seatbelt off, water coukd already be coming in the passenger window -- with force, meaning there's no swimming through it. In all the videos, windows are up giving the drivers some time to prepare to execute the escape. They know exactly what to anticipate.

Kiely is in a dark dark car on a dark dark lake on a dark dark night, with a car that is filling forcibly and now nosediving. Dynamic situation. Under any influence or stone cold sober, she has to process the new information, that the engine is sinking the front of the car. IMO that's when she moves toward the back because IMO she's trying to save herself. Front goes down, back is up. Hard to get between rows of seats? Undoubtedly. But she was obvioulsy motivated. Her survival depended on it. And now with windows open, the vehicle is filling up fast, gaining weight and IMO that is when it turtled. No way could she have prepared for that. Upside down in an upside down car, what kind of somersault is that? Disorienting beyond belief.

As it was, maybe if she had another 15 seconds, as water pressure equalized, she'd have been able to pop the hatch and swim to safety. No guarantees -- inhaling water, exhausted, the night was still oil dark and from the sounds of it, no one around to save her. Still it would've been her only chance.

That she made it to the cargo area tells me she was lucid, she was smart, she had a plan, she didn't want to die.

Kiely wanted to live.

She simply ran out of time.

Devastating.

JMO

 

[franker]

In the Honda's I have owned, I needed to open one of the rear doors and really yank on things.

I'm a few inches taller than Kiely was and abt 60 pounds heavier, for context.

BBM and ITA.

Over the years I've owned GM, Suzuki, Toyota and Hyundai SUVs.

Under the best of conditions figuring out the riddle of how to adjust the headrest or fold the rear seats can be a challenge (although the newer ones have buttons or straps behind the seats in front of the cargo area so that makes it easier as far as the seats go).

Figuring out how to do either of these things while submerged and in the dark and in the process of being flipped upside down would be impossible. IMO

 

[Beekarina]

Hmmm....this is interesting. Perhaps a 2013 CRV is easier to create space/flip seats around than some other models? I still think this would have been a lot to do in a vehicle filling with water, but sharing for visualization of cargo area, etc:

 

[EmmieA]

Forgive me if this seems insensitive, but if you flip the image, there does seem to be room/a different perspective if a vehicle was upside down. I was having a really difficult time imaging how anyone would slip through to the cargo area too.

I think possible?View attachment 363695

It’s so disorienting to even look at the picture - I can’t imagine being in the car & having to navigate what to do, where to go.

 

[justme11]

Hmmm....this is interesting. Perhaps a 2013 CRV is easier to create space/flip seats around than some other models? I still think this would have been a lot to do in a vehicle filling with water, but sharing for visualization of cargo area, etc:

In the video can we see if the back seats are up or not? I don't remember.

 

[MsMarple]

I think we are thinking logically, but when someone is panicking, I'm not sure logic always prevails. People asking why she didn't go out this window, or that window are probably not considering that Kiely, if conscious, and panicked, was probably trying to flee the incoming water, and trying desperately to get to the back, that may have still been dry and had air, rather than trying to swim out the very open windows that had water rushing in at that time. JMO

IMO this is a very important point about panic. Note: Please skip the next paragraphs if you are triggered by mild graphic descriptions!

Remember the video where the woman drove to the beach? She stopped short of the water because she knew it was right in front of her. Could we say the same for Kiely that night? Imagine the shock of expecting to drive on solid ground and instead you find yourself rapidly sinking into water.

Add the *possibility* that Kiely was drunk and/or high and how much slower her reflexes would have been. And on a moonless night (moonset was ~12:21 am). It probably would take a sober person at least 30 seconds to grasp what had happened and by then the car would be in the process of overturning. In pitch black.

How could we expect a novice driver who may have been in an altered state to use every precious second needed to plan a logical escape from their sinking car? Google is full of how-to videos for sober people escaping sinking cars in daylight but so far I haven't found any that would help Kiely's circumstances.

Of course, my comments are predicated on my own belief that Kiely's death was a tragic accident. IF there was foul play involved then any number of things could have happened that night. I wanted to express my thoughts on how panic can skew a person's reasoning powers. My heart starts pounding just thinking about sinking into a lake. Poor sweet little girl.

 

[Beekarina]

In the video can we see if the back seats are up or not? I don't remember.

I wasn't able to tell. Maybe someone else can? I'm hesitant to really zoom in anywhere close to the back of the vehicle, near open space even though they have edited/blurred.

 

[ForensicToxicologist]

Like Sully's decision to land the plane in the Hudson, IMO all these videos on how to save yourself in a sinking car fail to account for the timespan it takes for a person to react!! What all these survival videos have in common is awareness! They know what's going to happen and mentally are several steps ahead!!

This was a dynamic situation for Kiely. As she's processing and then reacting, already new things are happening to the vehicle so she's got an emergent reality to process and then react to!

RSBM
This is an excellent point! We are all trying to think about this with level heads. Being in the moment, panicking, late at night, and likely inebriated would produce very different results than what occurs to us here IMO

 

[justme11]

I wasn't able to tell. Maybe someone else can? I'm hesitant to really zoom in anywhere close to the back of the vehicle, near open space even though they have edited/blurred.

I've only watched it once but I'll try to watch it again and see if I can tell. No zooming in for me either.

 

[Beekarina]

IMO this is a very important point about panic. Note: Please skip the next paragraphs if you are triggered by mild graphic descriptions!

Remember the video where the woman drove to the beach? She stopped short of the water because she knew it was right in front of her. Could we say the same for Kiely that night? Imagine the shock of expecting to drive on solid ground and instead you find yourself rapidly sinking into water.

Add the *possibility* that Kiely was drunk and/or high and how much slower her reflexes would have been. And on a moonless night (moonset was ~12:21 am). It probably would take a sober person at least 30 seconds to grasp what had happened and by then the car would be in the process of overturning. In pitch black.

How could we expect a novice driver who may have been in an altered state to use every precious second needed to plan a logical escape from their sinking car? Google is full of how-to videos for sober people escaping sinking cars in daylight but so far I haven't found any that would help Kiely's circumstances.

Of course, my comments are predicated on my own belief that Kiely's death was a tragic accident. IF there was foul play involved then any number of things could have happened that night. I wanted to express my thoughts on how panic can skew a person's reasoning powers. My heart starts pounding just thinking about sinking into a lake. Poor sweet little girl.

The thing about videos and related knowledge too. How many kids her age would be *really* aware? She may have been passingly aware, given it sounds as though her upbringing had an element of appreciation for the outdoors, self reliance, etc. but kids rarely expect anything bad to happen.

 

[annpats]

When Diver Nick notes he sees a pair of shoes, he is wiping off the rear cargo corner "window" on the driver's side. He has just made his way past the partially open rear window and finished stating he "cannot positively identify anybody inside yet" ...."I'm looking in the back now...." goes to the cargo window, touches it, and says "I see a pair of shoes..." View attachment 363736

He saw a pair of shoes....but were they on Kiely? Or were they just laying around on the seats/floor?

Sometimes women keep spare shoes in the car too.

MOO.

 

[Beekarina]

He saw a pair of shoes....but were they on Kiely? Or were they floating around?

Sometimes women keep spare shoes in the car too.

MOO.

The way he describes it/leads in, it sounds as though he saw Kiely's shoes first, and then confirmed Kiely, so I interpreted it as shoes attached to her, but you raise a valid point.