Jeana (DP)
Former Member
Exactly! And then, just to be a nice guy, Phil confesses to his driver that he did it. I guess he just wanted to protect her reputation.
GUILTY CA - Lana Clarkson, 40, fatally shot, Alhambra, 3 Feb 2003
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Exactly! And then, just to be a nice guy, Phil confesses to his driver that he did it. I guess he just wanted to protect her reputation.
And then clean her and the scene up a little bit so she was more presentable! (Said sarcastically)Exactly! And then, just to be a nice guy, Phil confesses to his driver that he did it. I guess he just wanted to protect her reputation.
panthera
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What bothers me about Dr. Baden is that he's been on FNC in the last couple of weeks, opining on everything from the Minnesota bridge collapse to the autopsy report on Jessie Davis. What he said on those topics sounded believable, and he was stressing the importance of an autopsy to determine the cause and manner of death. Yet in this case, he disagrees with the ME's findings of homicide, which sounds totally disingenuous considering the other factors involved ~ like Lana being in a stranger's house, not knowing where PS would've kept a gun, not knowing his history of pulling a gun on women, and nothing about her screamed of being so depressed to insert his gun into her mouth and pull the trigger. So which times are we to believe Dr. Baden? Additionally, his wife is PS lawyer!All of my forensic heros seem to be bitting the dust one by one. How can I ever look at them the same way again???? I've always known that expert opinions could be bought, but I've always though a great deal about DiMaio and Baden. After watching their performances on the witness stand during this trial, I doubt if I'll ever be able to believe anything that comes out of either of their mouths ever again.
I do have a shred of hope left for California juries, however, which isn't easy after the O.J., Blake and Jackson cases. If they don't convict Spector for Clarkson's murder there will be nothing left to believe but that "Hollywood" can get away with ANYTHING. Even old, shriveled up, dusty, thought-he-was-already-dead Hollywood.
panthera
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Only for a brief moment though since he immediately proceeded to tell the police what a (well, insert whatever vile word you want here) she was.Exactly! And then, just to be a nice guy, Phil confesses to his driver that he did it. I guess he just wanted to protect her reputation.
Jeana (DP)
Former Member
What bothers me about Dr. Baden is that he's been on FNC in the last couple of weeks, opining on everything from the Minnesota bridge collapse to the autopsy report on Jessie Davis. What he said on those topics sounded believable, and he was stressing the importance of an autopsy to determine the cause and manner of death. Yet in this case, he disagrees with the ME's findings of homicide, which sounds totally disingenuous considering the other factors involved ~ like Lana being in a stranger's house, not knowing where PS would've kept a gun, not knowing his history of pulling a gun on women, and nothing about her screamed of being so depressed to insert his gun into her mouth and pull the trigger. So which times are we to believe Dr. Baden? Additionally, his wife is PS lawyer!
Well Dr. Baden was on the team before his wife got on board. I wouldn't have as much of a problem with him if he didn't suddenly have this notion that her spine wasn't severed completely until the defense started having HUGE problems in the trial. Then it all of a sudden looks as though he's the clean up guy. He also claims that it was possible for her to have gotten blood on the buttons of her jacket in such a preposterous way that I actually had a hard time believing that he was actually serious. There's no way that she could have contorted her not-so-long-ago broken wrists in the way that he suggested she would have in order to hold the gun in one hand and pull the trigger in the other. It would have been impossible, in my opinion.
panthera
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I agree Jeana, it's ridiculous! And since I can't watch the trial live, I'm relying on articles & posts to keep up ~ and thought I'd share with everyone here!
Judge: Jury will learn that Spector's team broke evidence rules
By Harriet Ryan
Court TV
LOS ANGELES Jurors will be told that Phil Spector's defense team violated discovery laws before they begin weighing murder charges against the music legend, a judge said Thursday.
Los Angeles County Superior Court Judge Larry Fidler said that, as punishment for the misconduct, he will instruct jurors that the defense failed to inform prosecutors as required by law that noted pathologist Dr. Michael Baden had arrived at a new theory of Lana Clarkson's death.
Baden revealed the hypothesis, which provides an explanation for the actress's blood on the producer's jacket, during testimony Tuesday. He said that it was the result of an "a-ha moment" two days before during conversations with a defense attorney.
Fidler denied a prosecution request for the harsher sanction of striking Baden's testimony about the theory. He said he was convinced that the defense was trying to "gain tactical advantage" by not telling the prosecution in advance, but said striking testimony was reserved for the most extreme cases.
"The judge who goes that route is walking a very fine line on very thin ice," he said.
The instruction the judge will give jurors at the close of the case tells them they cannot hold the wrongdoing against Spector as they determine his guilt or innocence, but they can consider how withholding information affected prosecutors' ability to present their case.
Spector's attorneys argued that no sanctions were warranted because the time between the pathologist arriving at the new hypothesis and testifying was short and because the prosecution had time to prepare to cross-examination.
"If there was no prejudice, there is no violation," defense attorney Bradley Brunon said.
A prosecutor insisted that being caught off guard had damaged the government's case.
"We could have done a lot [if forewarned of the new theory]," said Deputy District Attorney Patrick Dixon. "[Deputy District Attorney Alan Jackson] would have been much more prepared on the science."
The judge agreed, calling it "a major change in defense strategy" and labeling attempts to downplay its importance "nonsense."
Fidler also said there was a history of defense violations of evidence rules, a characterization which drew criticism from Brunon. He accused the judge of "putting a thumb on the scale" to favor prosecutors.
The comment enraged the judge.
"That is really insulting. I'll tell you what. You better withdraw that comment," Fidler shouted at Brunon.
The attorney complied, saying he did not mean to personally attack the judge.
The defense continued questioning of Baden Thursday morning. The judge cleared prosecutors to cross-examine the pathologist Thursday afternoon about possible bias because of the money his wife, Linda Kenney-Baden, is earning as a defense lawyer.
Outside the presence of the jury, Fidler asked Baden if he knew what his wife was being paid.
"It was $100,000 or $150,000," the pathologist replied.
The judge said he would have prohibited the line of questioning "if it was some enormous amount" that might prejudice jurors, but that he did not find that fee high.
http://www.courttv.com/trials/spector/081607_ctv.html
panthera
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Some very interesting things in Harriet Ryan's blogs from today, including a little courtroom demo with Spector and anger & concern from the judge about the trial dragging on too long ~ one juror has to leave due to family emergency.
http://blog.courttv.com/phil_spector/
http://blog.courttv.com/phil_spector/
Right now Baden is talking about the Utah mine disaster.
Jeana (DP)
Former Member
It was HYSTERICAL!!!!! Spector's OWN attorney had him stand up and hold up his arm and hand like he was pointing a GUN at someone. He had the most horribly angry, blank, evil expression on his face and he's standing there with his finger out like a gun!! If the jury wanted to be able to picture what Lana was looking at the night she died, well thanks to his own counsel, they got to see exactly what he looked like when he killed her!!!!!! OHMYGOD!:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:
Nore
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Now I am joking~the thought has crossed my mind,maybe his entourage thinks he is guilty too and just doesn't give a darn.LOL...They are not helping him at all! I almost felt sorry for Baden as he was so flustered and at times groping for words.Me thinks he needs a rest~IMO
Jeana (DP)
Former Member
I think Baden is brillant. I also don't think he'd throw away his reputation in order to help Spector. If he were going to do it for anyone, his wife tops the list; however, I very seriously doubt he would even consider it then.
However, what it appears is that after watching the trial, the defense said to him "we need to find a possibility, ANY possibility, that this could have happened" and Baden came up with the theory that he did the other day. Its a good one, however, and if he had it from the beginning it may carry some weight. The problems the defense is going to have are (1) the marriage between the expert and the attorney; and (2) it just HAPPENED to be this VERY expert (among many) who came up with the Hail Mary Theory. Whether it actually happened the way it did or not will most likely get lost in the mere fact that there appears to be some ethical reasons why Mrs. Baden shouldn't have been brought in on this case.
panthera
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I wish I could've seen it ~ over the weekend I'll check CTV Extra. I can only imagine it was as good as the OJ glove demonstration, only with the reverse effect on the jury. PS appearance just looks like someone who wouldn't have any regard for Lana's life, in other words, just mean & angry. :bang:
panthera
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I used to find Dr. Baden credible in some things he'd say (about other cases)but this seems like he's really stretching it with this latest theory. I've always thought there was a conflict with him being an expert in this trial, and his wife representing the defendant ~ like he'd say anything to get PS acquitted. Since he was at the autopsy and has literally been involved since day one, why just come up with this theory now? So I agree it seems like a last ditch effort to save PS. :behindbar
And did you notice that his hand was not shaking at all when he was "pointing the gun" finger? Totally at odds with all the handshaking he's had going on while sitting at the table.
I agree that he's stretching it. He's trying to manipulate things so much, like how the blood spatter got onto the buttons, that he forgets about major questions like how Lana would have managed that with her wrists; or, as the prosecution asked, how come the pattern of blood or other matter showing where folds or wrinkles would have been on the jacket arm had the arm been manipulated like they were doing so on the manequin. At this point I don't even think Baden is using common sense.
panthera
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I've never been able to figure out how Lana would've pulled the trigger on the gun to start with, considering she still had difficulty grasping the steering wheel of her car. Now for Dr. Baden to be testifying about the blood spatter and suggesting she manipulated the gun in such a manner to get the spatter where it was it really is defying logic. Very strange considering how familiar he should be with her medical history & the evidence in this case.
Jeana (DP)
Former Member
If I were the defense attorney and had to choose between Dr. Baden being an expert and Linda Kenny being an attorney for me, I'd choose Dr. Baden any day. However, its the fact that he IS such an incredible medical examiner and the fact that he WAS present at the autopsy that makes it so hard for me to believe that he didn't pick up on the fact that her lungs were so heavy. I'm not a medical expert by any stretch of the imagination, but isn't that M.E. 101??? I mean you're at the autopsy and they weigh every organ. When the weight of the lungs was said aloud in the room that instant, wouldn't that be like an alarm bell going on in the minds of these experts if it was SOOOOOOO unusual??? Even in the ensuing four and one-half years, not one of the four very intelligent, very experienced, very expensive medical examiners working for the defense even considers this??? How is that even possible? Like I said, even if we assume that all of this is above board, even giving the appearance of impropriety could seal the deal for Spector and open up the floodgates of possible appeals arguments all at the same time.