Identified! CA - Laurel Canyon, WhtFem 358UFCA, 20-23, Nov'69 - Reet Jurvetson

[AlexFromnic]

One thing is that Marina and Reet look very simmilar, both petite, for me they have very simmilar face features

View attachment 290375

Second thing is that of course we have no idea from where exactly Reet disapeeared (and even if she disappeared) but this speaks to me a bit more than Manson's connections:

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Sorry for coping that map but I wanted to see it more clearly.
Of course it's still possible, but considering that's middle of LA, not middle of nowhere... it still can go in every possible direction, I would exclude possibility that any of these could be murder inspired by Manson because as far as I know he wasn't that much into killing young women.

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Was it ever discussed that possibly her speaking Estonian had something to do with her invitation to LA?

I mean... If second Jean couldn't speak English then he was for sure fluent in some other language.

That supposed French... in Montreal? He should have no issue with instantly finding someone to chat with if he was French and anyone who spoke to him wouldn't have much trouble finding out if he's French native or not.

That uncertainty about him being French or not makes me suspect that people who saw him briefly didn't spoke French, just English while he wasn't speaking much because he couldn't speak French, because he spoke in some more obscure language (for that area), like Romanian?

Maybe somewhere very near from that hotel where they live in LA was a place where people fluent in different languages could easily get a job?
She said that she frequently go to the Beach... but that sounds like something you would say to your parents while on trip like that. I can't really tell but she doesn't look tan on sunburned so maybe she spend like two days on the beach and the rest of time tried to figure out a way to start new life in LA?
I mean... how much money she could save while working at post office? Enough for few weeks of Vacation in LA? Or nearly enough to try to start a new life in LA?

Watch the 5th estate documentary. They interview a friend and fellow french canadian. He knew the man. He forgot his last name but they were friends/aquaintances. The man Jean is a french canadian man. Its been verified. We cant throw this fact out to start plugging in all sorts of big named characters like Alcala or whoever else. The man we are looking for is a man possibly from Montreal area who is a french canadian WITH a heavy accent. If you have a suspect and they arent french canadian with an accent you might as well cross them out.

I think this type of speculation is counter productive to say the least. I could sit here and say oh wow they found a pair of thick framed black glasses on the road near reets body. Could be the zodiac. Maybe Jean is the zodiac and put a picture with the zodiac and long hair instead. It does us no good and its a waste of time.

No Jean wasnt a guy who was mistaken as a guy who had an accent. Multiple people who knew reet knew him. One was Jeans friend the other Reets.

Again, Jean is from Canada and is a french canadian with a heavy accent.

 

[dotr]

Nov 18, 2016
On November 16, 1969, the body of a young woman was found along Mulholland Drive in Los Angeles. She had been stabbed 157 times. The body was never claimed. The name of the murdered woman would remain unknown for the next 46 years -- her case was simply known as “Jane Doe #59.” Nearly half a century later, three childhood friends from Montreal identify her as their long lost friend – Reet Jurvetson. Now the Los Angeles and Montreal police are trying to piece together the final weeks of Jurvetson’s life and the fifth estate helps uncover new clues that might help unlock a decades-old mystery.

 

[deadfoot13]

You are incorrect on Methadone. An opiate user trying to use it after heroin / pill abuse wont get high. Someone who starts at methadone will get high as a kite. Yes there are methadone abusers.

If that is in fact the case (I see no collateral links to support your claim, so will assume it's only your opinion), I still highly doubt that this was a common thing in 1969.

 

[SophieRose]

Here's a photo of the old Paramount Hotel.

https://oldshowbiz.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F659701655885987840

 

[Richard]

The location, time frame, and manner of death are all very similar to known murders connected with the Manson family.

 

[beubeubeu]

So Reet's mother left a small personal in the paper 10 years after her death. She was looking for her. But the personal clearly ends call widowed mother. It strikes me a rather odd way to refer to oneself... call widowed mother. For me this was saying, your father is gone now its just me.. come speak with me.

Well, for me it says "my husband is gone, please have mercy and ease at least some of my pain and if you know ANYTHING about her whereabouts, call me, it may be our last chance to reconnect".
If it was Reet's mom idea to phrase it that way. Cause quite possible that someone else was responsible for the exact wording, or its just very official way of saying that.

In conclusion I think Reet and her father didnt get along at all. Infact it would seem there were some pretty hard feelings enough so that her mother felt she wasnt in contact because of her father. Just a tiny piece of evidence but something none the less.

If you assume that she's adressing it to Reet. Which is possible, but technically it isn't. Seems to be adressed to some people who may know something about Reet.
For me it
1. Speaks to emotion of the reader. Here she is, not only a mother trying to contact her daughter, but widowed mother. So she's not only missing her daughter but also grieving her husband. Can I help somehow? Do I know anything about this Reet?
2. It's kinda reasonable way of phrasing it. If it was adressed to Reet herself, then "mom", "mommy" or something to that accord would fit. But doesn't fit so well, especially for a mature, conservative woman. Mrs. Name Surname would be appropriate... but that would take a lot of power and a lot of information out of it.

And there was probably very strict limit of signs/letters to use

 

[SophieRose]

I wonder how they determined that someone named M. Lindhorst lived across the hall from Jean and Reet, if the building's tenant records from that time had gone missing... Curious.

I don't mean to "dox" anyone, but a simple Whitepages search returned public results for a few different individuals named "M. Lindhorst" who at one point in time lived in the L.A. area (and who were old enough to rent back in '69).

I would imagine the police have already done due diligence / contacted the surviving individuals who bear this name (it's a slightly unique spelling; the most common variant of the name is "Lindhurst"). I'm merely sharing what I found.

Did people back then pay a whole lot of attention to their neighbors' comings and goings? Times being what they were - tune in, turn on and drop out - and considering that this was L.A. and not small town USA, as well as the fact that Reet was living there for only a few weeks / around a month at that. I don't know. I have watched documentaries that examine the hippie scene and the social climate back in '69, especially as it existed in California... seems that people came and went, and crashed wherever - very casual, nomadic, transient.

Would a pretty, tall and slender girl like Reet have attracted the attention of anyone in that building, to where they would have been able to recall her years down the line? We're talking about people who were possibly under the influence of all kinds of mind-altering substances that summer and into the fall (the infamous "Summer of Love"). Very hard to say if she'd be recognizable to the now 65+ year-old crowd who lived in the apartment building and may or may not have seen her pass by in the hall.

Also wondering if she was killed in that apartment or if not, where. We're talking about a very brutal stabbing, a possible "rage killing" where sounds of screaming would have likely been heard. It's hard to imagine, when you read how many times she'd been stabbed. What could've possibly happened to trigger the killer?

They got the name M Pinehurst from a Jan 1969 Los Angeles reverse directory. Looks like that's the only tenant listed at that address. The address is also listed as building not apartment. It makes me think Hollywood Executive Apartments was very transient at that time. I think the reverse directory got addresses from the phone number so no one there must have had a telephone. It probably came furnished.

ResCarta-Web - Image Viewer

rescarta.lapl.org

https://www.cbc.ca/news/reet-jurvetson-jane-doe-neighbour-hollywood-1.3835406

 

[SophieRose]

It would be hard to exaggerate how old fashioned 'bourgeois', conservative, status-in-the-community aware her parents LIKELY were I mean I don't know for sure. Estonia is a small country with only a million speakers even now world wide but WITHIN the church and community the family this would be an illustrious one, grandparents President of the country etc. - almost certainly anti-Communist almost certainly with a fair amount of money, old money. It doesn't seem there has been any attempt to get into that community by LE there would be lots of rumours and perhaps some knowledge. I have no idea how the family dealt with inquiries by others about Reet they would certainly be constant EXCEPT I am guessing they would do a good job of shutting those down. One reason for the family's reticence would be the fear bordering on paranoia that upper class Eastern Europeans especially those of the old political caste would have about the possibility of Reet being disappeared by the Soviets etc. NO I don't think that happened. It would go briefly though I think through every member of that community's minds. There would be a stir.

Her parents did not have "a fair amount of money, old money" as you imply. I read they never owned a home or a car.

 

[Neil48]

Her parents did not have "a fair amount of money, old money" as you imply. I read they never owned a home or a car.

Read where? Everything else about their status in the community would remain valid in any case. My best friend even ten years later bought a car for 50 dollars.. there is little sense of them being impoverished imo unable to afford a car.

Separate question...are the glasses likely to be relevant to the crime? If so what are they doing down the hill?

 

[Neil48]

Read where? Everything else about their status in the community would remain valid in any case. My best friend even ten years later bought a car for 50 dollars.. there is little sense of them being impoverished imo unable to afford a car.

Separate question...are the glasses likely to be relevant to the crime? If so what are they doing down the hill?

 

[Neil48]

It is a very odd location for the glasses if relevant.

Am I correct there were an unusual number of wounds to her neck? What does that mean given their were many other wound locations? It seems like overkill....of her neck.

 

[Neil48]

It is a very odd location for the glasses if relevant.

Am I correct there were an unusual number of wounds to her neck? What does that mean given their were many other wound locations? It seems like overkill....of her neck.

With the face preserved so to speak.

If one of the Jeans was a med student in Canads that should be highly searchable/verifiable with a bit of work. Limited number of med schools in Canada. Yearbook pictures presumably and their archives would have that information. Only so many med students.

The artist who drew one of the Jeans said his face...was...coming out of the shadows. Any sense of what he means?

 

[Neil48]

I

 

[dotr]

Police believe Reet Jurvetson stayed with two men named Jean in the weeks before her disappearance. They are calling Jean No. 2 (right) a 'person of interest' in the case because Jurvetson, then 19, had gone to L.A. to specifically visit him. These sketches show how the men would have looked in 1969. (the fifth estate)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/reet-jurvetson-la-murder-sketch-released-1.3745895

Sep 02, 2016
''Green does not remember the surnames of either Jean, both of whom she and Reet knew from Montreal.

As part of the fifth estate investigation, Green sat down with two sketch artists to create images of the two Jeans.

She remembers Jean No. 1, who she ran into in Montreal in 1970, as being "short," in the five-foot-six-inch range, having black hair, blue eyes and a French accent.

Jean No. 2, whom Jurvetson went to visit in L.A., is described as being more than five feet nine inches in height, with brown eyes and long hair feathered back in 1969.''

 

[Neil48]

View attachment 529579
Police believe Reet Jurvetson stayed with two men named Jean in the weeks before her disappearance. They are calling Jean No. 2 (right) a 'person of interest' in the case because Jurvetson, then 19, had gone to L.A. to specifically visit him. These sketches show how the men would have looked in 1969. (the fifth estate)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/reet-jurvetson-la-murder-sketch-released-1.3745895

Sep 02, 2016
''Green does not remember the surnames of either Jean, both of whom she and Reet knew from Montreal.

As part of the fifth estate investigation, Green sat down with two sketch artists to create images of the two Jeans.

She remembers Jean No. 1, who she ran into in Montreal in 1970, as being "short," in the five-foot-six-inch range, having black hair, blue eyes and a French accent.

Jean No. 2, whom Jurvetson went to visit in L.A., is described as being more than five feet nine inches in height, with brown eyes and long hair feathered back in 1969.''

Correction per LA LE the glasses were found.. up there...by the road not down the hil belonged to a very near sighted person...Liberty Brand a common brand sold across the US. But now it becomes interesting they didn't come back to pick up their glasses...they were found days later. Also surely LE should have found them in the first place?

 

[dotr]

Repost Ronna Syed · CBC News · Posted: Nov 16, 2016

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/reet-jurvetson-investigation-glasses-1.3850542

The note dated May 16, 1972 — and leaked to the fifth estate — says that police consulted with an optometrist and other sources who advised that the glasses appeared to be for a man who was "very nearsighted."
The prescription was –75 for both eyes "at 20/30 and 20/40." The frames were the Liberty brand, available across the U.S. at the time.
Retired lead detective Cliff Shepard told the fifth estate that he thinks it's "very probable" that the glasses are connected with Jurvetson's death.

'Going as fast as he can'​

"You have a man who has to get rid of this body of this girl. He's afraid that someone will see him so he's in a hurry and going as fast as he can," says Shepard.

"It's possible that the glasses fell out of his pocket or he dropped it and he was in such a panic he didn't notice. And when he did notice he doesn't recall where he dropped it. It was probably pitch black up there. "

 

[Rikissa]

So Reet's mother left a small personal in the paper 10 years after her death. She was looking for her. But the personal clearly ends call widowed mother. It strikes me a rather odd way to refer to oneself... call widowed mother. For me this was saying, your father is gone now its just me.. come speak with me.

It may be odd to refer to oneself as 'widowed mother' in English, but remember that the native language of Reet's mother was Estonian, and she was probably born in the 1920s. I don't know Estonian, but I speak Finnish, a related language, and it's still possible today to see "leskiäiti" (widowed mother) as a reference to an older widow in texts. I don't see it neccessarily having anything to do with there having been a conflict between Reet and her father, rather more as 'I'm a widow now, I need your help at home'.
I can remember my grandmother being referred to as "leskiäiti / leskimummo" in the 1970s (widow granny to me).

 

[SophieRose]

Read where? Everything else about their status in the community would remain valid in any case. My best friend even ten years later bought a car for 50 dollars.. there is little sense of them being impoverished imo unable to afford a car.

Separate question...are the glasses likely to be relevant to the crime? If so what are they doing down the hill?

Article on her brother, parents, grandparents. Brother says his parents never owned their house nor a car.

Tõnu Jürvetson in memoriam - Estonian World Review

Möödunud aasta lõpul saabus Californiast ootamatu ja kurb teade – meie hulgast lahkus 12. detsembril Tõnu Jürvetson. Tõnu Jürvetson sündis Tallinnas 18. aprillil 1938. aastal Artur ja Silvia Jürvetsoni esiklapsena. Tema emapoolne vanaisa oli Eesti kõrgema kunstihariduse, aga ka Eesti Punase...

www-eesti-ca.translate.goog

 

[Neil48]

Thanks... it is a bit mysterious... as noted by T. here "for some reason" his father could not make money. Though of course the whole context of this bio more or less proves the point that they were important in the Estonian community surely. No mention of Reet's death I guess not the place for it.

 

[Neil48]

Thanks... it is a bit mysterious... as noted by T. here "for some reason" his father could not make money. Though of course the whole context of this bio more or less proves the point that they were important in the Estonian community surely. No mention of Reet's death I guess not the place for it.

See post 210 Reet's drawings could the middle middle top row be Jean I ? Given the other artist's description of the face coming out of the shadows it is really quite remarkable. He seems older but Reet is not a gifted artist. Three appear to be self portraits c.f. the very long neck....one Jagger the other a regular girl...sister or friend.

Changing the subject...the comment by Gilda Green about her using methadone is weird. As earlier posts on this thread suggest it doesn't really fit Reet especially as was not a first use drug typically. Overall G.G. seemed a bit odd a bit shifty and possibly unreliable. Will have to watch that doc again.

Reet's drawing...possibly a first nations person Northern Quebec? I don't think it is Morrison. A guess but it might be Jean.