Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020

[Knox]

This is max, typically only children with severe medical needs receive the maximum post adoption.

Not trying to defend anyone, just like to keep speculation in its place. MOO

ETA: if money was a factor in the adoption, I would assume the parents had nothing to do with the children’s disappearance.

Thanks for chiming in on this, the State link and some other county specific things I've looked at call the $1,037.00 "the basic monthly payment" for any finalized adoption taking place after 2017. I took that to mean a baseline payment for any child between the ages 0-18.

What's your gut feeling on happened to Orson & Orrin?

 

[DidYouThinkOfThat]

yes


Yes, we lived in CA for many years and I’ve worked with families out of CA. According to the rate table, these are max amounts that are negotiated (case by case) for post adoption. Foster care rates remain the same.

Thanks, it is good to have someone familiar with adoption in CA (since it is new to many of us).

So what precisely was inaccurate that I stated above? Just want to make sure we are as accurate as possible for sleuthing purposes since you stated the information I posted was inaccurate which I would object to based on the sources I listed.

Are you stating that the “basic rate” is the maximum and that in many cases the payment is below this amount? I do not think that is correct based on the usage of “basic rate” and the “higher tiers” listed for adoptees with more health/medical needs.

 

[dillysmom11]

@Knox and @DidYouThinkOfThat

The “basic rate” is what is provided during foster care and then entered into contract at the time of adoption. Generally the state starts low and, if families understand their rights, can be bargained up based on the needs of the children.

For instance, in WA state we received a foster rate of over $500 for one child, because she had no medical needs (at the time of adoption), we negotiated to $230 monthly plus medical (which doesn’t necessarily cover what the child needs). I frankly wanted nothing because they are MY children now, but I also know the expense that comes from adopting children who’ve been dragged through the state for years.

It is the same process in CA. Every family doesn’t receive a blanket $1037 per child at finalization.

Knox, I really don’t know. I’m super concerned that no one has seen the children since their move to CC. But I also don’t fault the interactions with the parents just yet... MOO.

 

[Warwick7]

Preferred Towing just added $10,000.00
My link won't work with m6 cell.
Can someone link it please?

 

[Jo in Calif]

https://www.facebook.com/bayanwang23abc/photos/a.1600107210114534/2695284713930106/

Another reward.

 

[rosesfromangels]

This is inaccurate. Each child is different, and many receive nothing but a medical coupon.

Children Adopted from Foster Care: Adoption Agreements, Adoption Subsidies, and Other Post-Adoption Supports

"....Overall, three out of four of all children adopted from foster care (75 percent) have an adoption agreement that includes Medicaid coverage (representing 81 percent of all those with an adoption agreement). Children who had been eligible for federal foster care subsidies prior to their adoption and whose adoption assistance agreements are provided for under title IV-E of the Social Security Act are categorically eligible for Medicaid until age 18. ..."

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[dillysmom11]

It would be interesting to know how much they received, and what part of California they moved from. If they were getting the full amount per child and then moved where housing is under $200k, that could be a windfall.

 

[dillysmom11]

Children Adopted from Foster Care: Adoption Agreements, Adoption Subsidies, and Other Post-Adoption Supports

"....Overall, three out of four of all children adopted from foster care (75 percent) have an adoption agreement that includes Medicaid coverage (representing 81 percent of all those with an adoption agreement). Children who had been eligible for federal foster care subsidies prior to their adoption and whose adoption assistance agreements are provided for under title IV-E of the Social Security Act are categorically eligible for Medicaid until age 18. ..."

Amateur opinion and speculation

Cash assistance (adoption subsidy) is different per child.

 

[ReallyStar]

Are you familiar with California adoption in particular? Can you explain why all of the literature shared in the thread here points to a $1000 basic rate for each adopted child? Our cost of living is very high here so $1000 isn’t a lot, but it can be substantial if you have 4 adopted children and are living in the lowest cost of living area in the entire state.

Please see table D and the literature above table D in this chart: https://www.cdss.ca.gov/Portals/9/ACL/2019/19-58.pdf

Please see this page, specifically the “Agreements signed after 1/1/17”: California State Adoption Assistance Program

Where does it state the basic rate only applies under certain conditions or special needs? The first chart states that the 3 higher rates (above the $1000 basic rate) only apply under certain conditions.

If the information I shared is inaccurate, as you stated, please post any source here that disputes such information.

The adoption assistance payment amounts listed in the tables are consistent with the payment my friend receives. He fostered twin boys for a year and then adopted them in 2017. The boys are healthy and enrolled in regular school. He gets a supplement because he adopted siblings and the adoption assistance is more than what he received while fostering them. He's able to be a stay home dad while his spouse works.

 

[Peppery]

It would be interesting to know how much they received, and what part of California they moved from. If they were getting the full amount per child and then moved where housing is under $200k, that could be a windfall.

We’ve been told they moved from Bakersfield to Cal City in September 2020.

 

[Warwick7]

https://www.facebook.com/bayanwang23abc/photos/a.1600107210114534/2695284713930106/

Another reward.

Cool!! Thank you!!
This just may prompt someone to talk!!

"SECOND REWARD: Another $10,000 reward has been offered Thursday for 3-year-old Orson West and 4-year-old Orrin West, who were reported missing in California City on Dec. 21. This is the second reward announced from Rick and Amanda Jones, a couple who operate a few local businesses in town. The couple will now pay a total of $20,000 "to the person, or persons who provide information leading to the finding," of the boys."

 

[susiQ]

This is max, typically only children with severe medical needs receive the maximum post adoption.

Not trying to defend anyone, just like to keep speculation in its place. MOO

ETA: if money was a factor in the adoption, I would assume the parents had nothing to do with the children’s disappearance.

RBBM
I understand what you’re trying to say, but you’ve adopted for all the right reasons. I’m not sure I agree with your last statement though. I do believe it’s possible they could have adopted for money. At this point we don’t know if either of the boys had any special needs. Their birth mother lost care of them for “whatever” reason. Drugs and/or alcohol during pregnancy can cause significant issues in a child. If the adoptive parents were looking at the financial gain without considering what was involved, who knows what “out” was taken. We have to remember love was not the motivator in the adoption if they were interested in the $$$. On top of that, if their motivation was less than honorable, were these children sold? In that case, the adoption stipend was only a short term benefit. It’s a horrible thought but desperate people do desperate things. A total forensic accounting of their affairs is called for.
All MOO.

 

[rosesfromangels]

RBBM
I understand what you’re trying to say, but you’ve adopted for all the right reasons. I’m not sure I agree with your last statement though. I do believe it’s possible they could have adopted for money. At this point we don’t know if either of the boys had any special needs. Their birth mother lost care of them for “whatever” reason. Drugs and/or alcohol during pregnancy can cause significant issues in a child. If the adoptive parents were looking at the financial gain without considering what was involved, who knows what “out” was taken. We have to remember love was not the motivator in the adoption if they were interested in the $$$. On top of that, if their motivation was less than honorable, were these children sold? In that case, the adoption stipend was only a short term benefit. It’s a horrible thought but desperate people do desperate things. A total forensic accounting of their affairs is called for.
All MOO.

Your last sentence BBM. YES. Accounting forensics will tell the tale, for sure.
In a nefarious scenario (we don't know if this one is nefarious or not, but certainly is under suspicion), I wouldn't put it past criminal types to sell the children (for....I don't want to even think about that)....and attempt to pass off two of the other kids as Orson & Orrin. Stranger things have happened.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[DidYouThinkOfThat]

I wish TW would disclose how long he was in the house for before he went back outside and saw no kids. I assume it was not terribly long. If TW and JW are not responsible, the ONLY thing that makes sense is if someone was hiding in the yard waiting for the precise moment to pounce, which is highly improbable. LEO should determine if any home improvement trips have been made recently and any shovels purchased.

I personally don’t think TW and JW sold the children. I suspect the two children perished accidentally (whether by accidental drowning, electrocution, drug inhalation, or other) and parents had to stage a disappearance as to not make them look like terrible parents, lose the adoption stipend of their other 2 children ($2,000 a month), or lose their 2 biological children.

“Mom was wrapping presents, and dad was gathering firewood” a story which tries to persuade “good” and “caring” intentions. Imagine if mom was just watching TV or playing on her phone? ... that could never be the story. Has to involve caring actions.

All speculation of course.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Cool!! Thank you!!
This just may prompt someone to talk!!

"SECOND REWARD: Another $10,000 reward has been offered Thursday for 3-year-old Orson West and 4-year-old Orrin West, who were reported missing in California City on Dec. 21. This is the second reward announced from Rick and Amanda Jones, a couple who operate a few local businesses in town. The couple will now pay a total of $20,000 "to the person, or persons who provide information leading to the finding," of the boys."

They should blanket Bakersfield with that reward poster as well.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[susiQ]

I wish TW would disclose how long he was in the house for before he went back outside and saw no kids. I assume it was not terribly long. If TW and JW are not responsible, the ONLY thing that makes sense is if someone was hiding in the yard waiting for the precise moment to pounce, which is highly improbable. LEO should determine if any home improvement trips have been made recently and any shovels purchased.

I personally don’t think TW and JW sold the children. I suspect the two children perished accidentally (whether by accidental drowning or electrocution) and parents had to stage a disappearance as so not to lose their livelihood of the adoption stipends and/or their other kids.

Personally, I would have yelled into the house for the parent “wrapping presents” to look through the house while I run out the gate and check the road. So easy for a child, or two, to be hit by a car at dusk or dark, especially dressed in dark clothing as was reported.

Nothing about this story strikes me as probable. Too many red flags for me. JMHO.

 

[Peppery]

Cool!! Thank you!!
This just may prompt someone to talk!!

"SECOND REWARD: Another $10,000 reward has been offered Thursday for 3-year-old Orson West and 4-year-old Orrin West, who were reported missing in California City on Dec. 21. This is the second reward announced from Rick and Amanda Jones, a couple who operate a few local businesses in town. The couple will now pay a total of $20,000 "to the person, or persons who provide information leading to the finding," of the boys."

I hope the locals go out and support this couples’ businesses. $20k is amazingly generous and I pray it leads to helpful information.

 

[Warwick7]

Personally, I would have yelled into the house for the parent “wrapping presents” to look through the house while I run out the gate and check the road. So easy for a child, or two, to be hit by a car at dusk or dark, especially dressed in dark clothing as was reported.

Nothing about this story strikes me as probable. Too many red flags for me. JMHO.

@susiQ my first thought reading about these boys the very first time was---why did he panic and run into the house? Did he think the boys would catch mom wrapping presents??

Why did he panic and run "into" the house. The danger isn't "in" the house, danger is outside the fence.

 

[Jo in Calif]

They should blanket Bakersfield with that reward poster as well.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Bryan Wang is a reporter for
23ABC They are out of Bakersfield.

 

[Warwick7]

I wish TW would disclose how long he was in the house for before he went back outside and saw no kids. I assume it was not terribly long. If TW and JW are not responsible, the ONLY thing that makes sense is if someone was hiding in the yard waiting for the precise moment to pounce, which is highly improbable. LEO should determine if any home improvement trips have been made recently and any shovels purchased.

I personally don’t think TW and JW sold the children. I suspect the two children perished accidentally (whether by accidental drowning, electrocution, drug inhalation, or other) and parents had to stage a disappearance as to not make them look like terrible parents, lose the adoption stipend of their other 2 children ($2,000 a month), or lose their 2 biological children.

“Mom was wrapping presents, and dad was gathering firewood” a story which tries to persuade “good” and “caring” intentions. Imagine if mom was just watching TV or playing on her phone? ... that could never be the story. Has to involve caring actions.

All speculation of course.

Great post!