GUILTY CA - Vyctorya Sandoval, 2, beaten to death, Pomona, 23 April 2011

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leanaí;7659747 said:
The thing that should have been done was forced sterilization of the Mother and Father since that many kids had been taken away from them. Anyone who has abused a child or had them taken away because of abuse should be sterilized.

This beautiful little girl should never have been allowed to go back to them. Of course nothing will be done about this or any other case where Child Services **** up and things like this will just continue to happen unless we start making up petitions and complaining about this to people that matter, not just voicing out anger on this forum.
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I've been writing letters and starting petitions for 20 years. There's no money in child abuse. No drug money, no fines - the children and the abusers just clog up the system. It's much easier to send the kids home and hope for the best. It's easier to throw money at the family. No one wants to hear about it - they'd rather talk about drug addiction and the sex life of Jennifer Lopez. Limbaugh makes news calling women *advertiser censored* - Limbaugh whose been spewing sexist remarks and victimizing women for 30 years - where is his responsibility? He's got one helluva louder voice than I do. The thread about his "*advertiser censored*" remark has 221 hits, this one just 21. Do the math.

I'll express my anger here and everywhere else - it's called raising awareness. Assuming that is all a person does is just that, an assumption. At some point it becomes everyone's responsibility.

ETA: Forced sterilization would violate their civil rights - what a joke, huh? The baby has no rights except to the pro-lifers - at least until they are born.
 
Just from reading about this, these two don't sound capable of taking care of a pet rock. And CPS gave them a little child-this was so very predictable except apparently to CPS. I wonder what happened to the latest one she was pregnant with?
 
jjenny said:
Just from reading about this, these two don't sound capable of taking care of a pet rock. And CPS gave them a little child-this was so very predictable except apparently to CPS. I wonder what happened to the latest one she was pregnant with?
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According to an article I read earlier, advocates and families have forced this Judge to open up his children's court to the public and reporters. Sounds like this is not his first flub up.
 
I have always wondered why "parents" want their children back just to abuse them...is it just for the money? JMO
 
This is another one that makes me cry. She was so precious in her cute little outfit, drinking from her sippy cup. Why couldn't she be left with the people who loved her and took good care of her? I will never understand these cases.
 
Belinda said:
This is another one that makes me cry. She was so precious in her cute little outfit, drinking from her sippy cup. Why couldn't she be left with the people who loved her and took good care of her? I will never understand these cases.
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Heatbreaking indeed.

I'm glad to know that she knew and felt love and was cherished for a least a period of time in her short life. God bless the family that gave that to her.
 
Belinda said:
This is another one that makes me cry. She was so precious in her cute little outfit, drinking from her sippy cup. Why couldn't she be left with the people who loved her and took good care of her? I will never understand these cases.
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So CPS could achieve their primary goal of "reunification." That child had a chance of a normal life, and it was all taken from her.
 
vlpate said:
I've been writing letters and starting petitions for 20 years. There's no money in child abuse. No drug money, no fines - the children and the abusers just clog up the system. It's much easier to send the kids home and hope for the best. It's easier to throw money at the family. No one wants to hear about it - they'd rather talk about drug addiction and the sex life of Jennifer Lopez. Limbaugh makes news calling women *advertiser censored* - Limbaugh whose been spewing sexist remarks and victimizing women for 30 years - where is his responsibility? He's got one helluva louder voice than I do. The thread about his "*advertiser censored*" remark has 221 hits, this one just 21. Do the math.

I'll express my anger here and everywhere else - it's called raising awareness. Assuming that is all a person does is just that, an assumption. At some point it becomes everyone's responsibility.

ETA: Forced sterilization would violate their civil rights - what a joke, huh? The baby has no rights except to the pro-lifers - at least until they are born.
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Children don't vote either...they have no power or voice of their own....
 
Even if they have to work toward reunification based in fulfilling a contract, social services should be in them like white on rice until it has been established that the child is actually safe, with weekly visits, reports, and immediate follow-up on anything that seems amiss. That should be part of the contract.
 
Etilema said:
Even if they have to work toward reunification based in fulfilling a contract, social services should be in them like white on rice until it has been established that the child is actually safe, with weekly visits, reports, and immediate follow-up on anything that seems amiss. That should be part of the contract.
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I'm opening myself up for a lot here, so bear with me. In a normal situation, when children are removed, yes, they do stay on the parents like white on rice, until the steps have been completed and the contract fulfilled. In some cases, it is not only one agency, but two or three contract agencies that are also working with the same family. I say this because I have had my older boys taken from me. I joined WS the month they came home. I will always maintain the truth about my children's removal, that I did not harm them, but rather my older son harmed himself. The State of MI admitted as much the day they sent my children home. Once we got the official autism diagnosis and they directly observed him in the foster homes, they realized it wasn't us beating him, it was us not knowing how to keep him from harming himself. We were negligent in that area, and yes, we did need training, as parents, to be able to care for him adequately. We got the training and both my kids came home.

BUT, from the moment, my kids were taken, until the day they came home 10 months later (we had to wait for the judge to approve the removal and that meant long waits between court hearings) we diid not go one single weekday without contact between us and one of the monitoring case workers. We had to maintain contact with the actual CPS worker, the CPS foster care worker, the contract agencies, Ennis Center, and Catholic Charities, as well as the GAL and children's attorneys, and our own attorneys. We took supervised drug tests up to three times a week, every single week. We had our home inspected for food, cleanliness, lead, locks, smoke detectors, plug covers...you name it, by representatives from all agencies. They delved into our finances, and made us create alternate plans for financial survival. The kids were first only allowed to be with us unsupervised for a few hours at a time, and they were carefully checked for marks and bruises by us when we picked them up, and them by their foster mother when we returned them. We were required to make at least 90% of our visitations, and reschedule hours early if we had to miss one. We could not refuse or miss a drug test, and we did not find out about them until the day we had to appear for them. We had to attend all court hearings. We had to prove that we caould care for the kids overnight, and then for weekends, without them getting so much as a scratch, missing one meal, or bath, or having anything negative to say when we returned them. We had to complete about 4 classes apiece. Not just attend, but actually pass them.

And every single one of these agenices pissed me off, made my life difficult, made me feel practically inhuman...and every single one of them had at least one person that cared about my children, and wanted them to be in the best situation they could be in. All of these people, at least 10 of them, were watching my every move, to make sure that I was taking care of my children, that I was able to manage my own life, as well as theirs, and take care of their individual and special needs.

That's why I can't believe that so many people can drop the ball, and cases like this still occur under supervision. It's why I also can't believe that the answer is to stop returning children across the board, because there are some like me that just have a child that doesn't fit in the mold, and that they need help to learn how to parent. There are others, like these parents that obviously don't care at all. How to tell the two apart, and act accordingly, is the hardest part.
 
Etilema said:
Even if they have to work toward reunification based in fulfilling a contract, social services should be in them like white on rice until it has been established that the child is actually safe, with weekly visits, reports, and immediate follow-up on anything that seems amiss. That should be part of the contract.
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Whoever is making up these rules has to realize that 100 % reunification shouldn't be their primary goal. Because some people aren't capable of taking care of a pet rock, let alone a child.
 
jjenny said:
Whoever is making up these rules has to realize that 100 % reunification shouldn't be their primary goal. Because some people aren't capable of taking care of a pet rock, let alone a child.
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That would be the politicians who vote in the laws.
 
not_my_kids said:
I'm opening myself up for a lot here, so bear with me. In a normal situation, when children are removed, yes, they do stay on the parents like white on rice, until the steps have been completed and the contract fulfilled. In some cases, it is not only one agency, but two or three contract agencies that are also working with the same family. I say this because I have had my older boys taken from me. I joined WS the month they came home. I will always maintain the truth about my children's removal, that I did not harm them, but rather my older son harmed himself. The State of MI admitted as much the day they sent my children home. Once we got the official autism diagnosis and they directly observed him in the foster homes, they realized it wasn't us beating him, it was us not knowing how to keep him from harming himself. We were negligent in that area, and yes, we did need training, as parents, to be able to care for him adequately. We got the training and both my kids came home.

BUT, from the moment, my kids were taken, until the day they came home 10 months later (we had to wait for the judge to approve the removal and that meant long waits between court hearings) we diid not go one single weekday without contact between us and one of the monitoring case workers. We had to maintain contact with the actual CPS worker, the CPS foster care worker, the contract agencies, Ennis Center, and Catholic Charities, as well as the GAL and children's attorneys, and our own attorneys. We took supervised drug tests up to three times a week, every single week. We had our home inspected for food, cleanliness, lead, locks, smoke detectors, plug covers...you name it, by representatives from all agencies. They delved into our finances, and made us create alternate plans for financial survival. The kids were first only allowed to be with us unsupervised for a few hours at a time, and they were carefully checked for marks and bruises by us when we picked them up, and them by their foster mother when we returned them. We were required to make at least 90% of our visitations, and reschedule hours early if we had to miss one. We could not refuse or miss a drug test, and we did not find out about them until the day we had to appear for them. We had to attend all court hearings. We had to prove that we caould care for the kids overnight, and then for weekends, without them getting so much as a scratch, missing one meal, or bath, or having anything negative to say when we returned them. We had to complete about 4 classes apiece. Not just attend, but actually pass them.

And every single one of these agenices pissed me off, made my life difficult, made me feel practically inhuman...and every single one of them had at least one person that cared about my children, and wanted them to be in the best situation they could be in. All of these people, at least 10 of them, were watching my every move, to make sure that I was taking care of my children, that I was able to manage my own life, as well as theirs, and take care of their individual and special needs.

That's why I can't believe that so many people can drop the ball, and cases like this still occur under supervision. It's why I also can't believe that the answer is to stop returning children across the board, because there are some like me that just have a child that doesn't fit in the mold, and that they need help to learn how to parent. There are others, like these parents that obviously don't care at all. How to tell the two apart, and act accordingly, is the hardest part.
Click to expand...

Bravo for you! now that is what real parents do!
 
NMK, I hold you in high esteem for all you have been through and survived. This just makes me respect you even more. You jumped through every hoop presented to you to get your kids back. That's what loving parents do. Those hoops should have been in place for Vyctorya, but they weren't. A lot of people dropped the ball here and need to lose their jobs. They didn't check up on this baby and now she is gone. I find CPS and the judge hugely responsible for this.
 
Every single time that a child dies while they should have still been under supervision, I just sit thee and sort of scratch my head. And every time that a parent gets a kid back just to kill them, I scratch a little harder. I can't see why someone would put themselves through the wringer of doing all the things that typically have to be done to regain custody and then kill the child. I never want mine out of my sight again, and the entire experience made me a much better parent. My home is always clean enough to pass an inspection now, the kids don't wait for anything they need and I am super sensitive about every scratch and bump.

To see people that go through the same things and are either unaffected or affected in a completely different way just boggles my mind. I saw it while my boys were in Foster care and it boggled my mind then. Some parents that just did not care, or that would have several kids in several different placements, but would only be fighting for one or two, usually the youngest ones. I think there are just some parents that feel the same way about puppies and kids. They are cute when they're babies, but when they start to grow up, they kill them, neglect them to death, or pawn them off on whoever will take them.
 
vlpate said:
ETA: Forced sterilization would violate their civil rights - what a joke, huh? The baby has no rights except to the pro-lifers - at least until they are born.
Click to expand...

I am for all children before and after they are born (unless they become a child who kills) and want nothing more then to see them all in a loving home and well taken care of.

The civil rights of people who are abusers, rapists, murders and child molesters needs to be adjusted. CPS needs to be redone as well.
 
Not My Kids....Thank you for sharing..I am a GAL and alot of times I just cry for my kids...they just want to be loved and held. I wish I could do that but we also have to keep our distance separate what we want for a child and figure out what is best for them! JMO
 
MorenoI said:
Not My Kids....Thank you for sharing..I am a GAL and alot of times I just cry for my kids...they just want to be loved and held. I wish I could do that but we also have to keep our distance separate what we want for a child and figure out what is best for them! JMO
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What is a GAL? I've seen that several times, but have no idea what it means. TIA
 
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