Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #20

[otto]

I suspect the bones were in bad shape, otherwise the would have said much earlier that the bones were human and they were simply determining cause and/or manner of death. For them to be unable to recognize the bones as human, in my opinion, means they were either fragments, or burned, or evidently dismembered, or all of the above, to the point of being beyond immediate recognition as human.

On the one hand, it makes me so hopeful about the L/O case, that perhaps their remains will be found and they will be put to rest by their families. It would make the case against the accused that much stronger to have bodies. But sadly, we also know there are many missing, especially missing women. I guess the most we can hope for, if the remains do turn out to be human, is that someone somewhere will finally have the peace of mind that comes from knowing with certainty the fate of their loved one(s) and that they may be given a proper burial.

It is such a horror to me, that these murderers cannot muster up one shred of human decency or remorse, and spare these families the sorrow of never finding the remains of their murdered loved ones. I feel the same way in the case of the McCanns, the St. Albert couple missing and presumed murdered.

IMHO

It's still very possible that the Liknes/O'brien bodies were burned on the property, and also possible that they were first burned, and then the remains were left near the animal reserve.

Are there a lot of missing women in the Innisfail area?

 

[Slebby]

It's still very possible that the Liknes/O'brien bodies were burned on the property, and also possible that they were first burned, and then the remains were left near the animal reserve.

Are there a lot of missing women in the Innisfail area?

I was thinking about the Project KARE investigation into the murders of many women from the Edmonton area, whose remains were found in rural areas around Edmonton, and as far away as Camrose, iirc. Innisfail is a bit far but not outside the realm of possibility - a straight shot south on the QE2.
Just offering alternate theories about whose remains it could be, and that it would be a good thing if it could bring closure to a family mourning a lost loved one.
Of course I'm getting ahead of the investigation, which may determine the remains are not human.

 

[Slebby]

The bones found near Innisfail are determined to be human.
http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/bones-dis...b7H&_giguuid=5f1a44774ab045f7941953dc0adc3937

The gender, age and identity of the bones and how long they were there are unknown, and the investigation continues by Innisfail RCMP with the help of the Calgary Major Crimes Unit and the Medical Examiner’s office.

 

[otto]

The bones found near Innisfail are determined to be human.
http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/bones-dis...b7H&_giguuid=5f1a44774ab045f7941953dc0adc3937

The gender, age and identity of the bones and how long they were there are unknown, and the investigation continues by Innisfail RCMP with the help of the Calgary Major Crimes Unit and the Medical Examiner’s office.

Thank you! It is still possible that these are the remains of the Liknes/O'brien family. It's likely that they were burned in the pit towards the South end of the property, near the water pump station - there was a tent over that area for several days. There were several burn barrels and incinerators on the property.

What if the fire wasn't hot enough to burn all of the remains, and the accused was watching the news; learned that police were close to catching him (the public request for information about a specific green Ford 150). Did he have time to dispose of evidence near the animal reserve?

 

[wendiesan]

Another source regarding the burned bones from Innisfail.

http://www.calgarysun.com/2016/04/14/rcmp-says-bones-near-innisfail-are-human

 

[Sillybilly]

Another source regarding the burned bones from Innisfail.

http://www.calgarysun.com/2016/04/14/rcmp-says-bones-near-innisfail-are-human

Where does it state the bones are burned?

 

[otto]

Where does it state the bones are burned?

There is no statement that the bones of the Liknes/O'brien family victims have been burned, however we cannot ignore what we know. Police set up tents on the property; some for food and drink, and other's for investigative purposes. A tent was set up South of the house, along tree line and just past the incinerators, which would suggest that police suspect that the victims were taken out of the Parkhill home, very likely deceased, in the back of a green Ford F-150 truck to an Airdrie acreage.

Bone fragments have been found near an animal farm straight North, and a bit East, of Airdrie. Are there remains of the Liknes/O.brien family?

 

[Sillybilly]

Thanks otto. I do recall that, but was asking about wendiesan's reference to the bones found at Innisfail as I don't see any of the articles referencing that they are known to be burned.

 

[wendiesan]

Thanks otto. I do recall that, but was asking about wendiesan's reference to the bones found at Innisfail as I don't see any of the articles referencing that they are known to be burned.

My error. I apologize for buiding the assumption into my comment preceding the citation.

 

[otto]

My error. I apologize for buiding the assumption into my comment preceding the citation.

The bones must be quite small given the evidence collection bag size in this video:

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=844336

 

[otto]

Another fact that always suggested the bodies were burned at the Airdrie acreage was the neighbour's report that someone was burning something on the property for a couple of days after the murders. What made it difficult to believe was the required temperatures to completely turn a body to ash.

The bones that were recently found near Innisfail could be another missing high-risk lifestyle woman from Edmonton (although that is quite a distance to go to dispose of a body from Edmonton), or they could be bones that were not completely burned from the Airdrie property.

 

[otto]

That the bones were found near the Discovery Wildlife Park (http://www.discoverywildlifepark.com/) suggests that someone familiar with the area tried very hard to disguise the remains.

 

[Sillybilly]

My error. I apologize for buiding the assumption into my comment preceding the citation.

No apology necessary wendiesan. Hard to keep everything straight at times. Just wanting to keep the record straight as we follow the case.

 

[otto]

The bones have been identified as belonging to an Edmonton man whose vehicle was found in Calgary.

 

[kmclaren]

The bones have been identified as belonging to an Edmonton man whose vehicle was found in Calgary.

A link to the news:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmon...fail-belong-to-missing-edmonton-man-1.3538800


And here is his websleuths thread:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...w-42-Edmonton-AB-31-May-2015&highlight=demkiw

 

[dotr]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...bodies-of-missing-calgarians/article19669519/
Police discourage amateur search for bodies of three missing Calgarians

Jul. 17, 2014

Police have told volunteers searching for the bodies of three Calgarians investigators say were murdered that their help is not necessary, stopping just shy of asking the freelance crews to call off their effort.

Untrained volunteers combed through fields near Airdrie this week, sparking criticism from some members of the public who said they risk jeopardizing the murder investigation.

The uninvited crews lack the support specially trained search and rescue crews across the country have at their disposal. The aftermath of finding a body – whether the volunteer is trained or otherwise – can be dangerous.

Investigators have a 30-day search plan in effect that is intelligence driven, which cannot be shared outside of law enforcement in order to protect the integrity of the investigation. We are systematically searching locations that have a high likelihood of locating evidence utilizing officers from the CPS, RCMP and provincially sanctioned civilian search organizations,”

 

[0101ABA]

He was a happy little boy who loved playing soccer, hockey and dressing up as any one of a number of super heroes.

Next weekend, Aug. 19-21, the spirit of Nathan O’Brien will shine once again at the second annual Nathan O’Brien Superhero Sports Decathlon at Springbank Park For All Seasons.

“It’s an opportunity for kids to come out and try a number of sports,” says Jennifer O’Brien, Nathan’s mother.

“It’s a great day for kids — all of Nathan’s friends came out last year and loved it, so I know Nathan would.”

http://www.calgarysun.com/2016/08/09/weekend-set-to-honour-nathan-obriens-memory

 

[Jay78]

Sorry if this seems out of place at this point--but it's been killing me waiting for January when this trial finally gets underway.

One thing that I found fascinating about the legal system is this:
Unless I'm wrong, members of the general public were able to attend the prelim hearing and hear a broad overview of the evidence in this case, meaning that some (including individuals on this forum I believe), meaning that they likely know what was done to this poor boy and his grandparents. It seems amazing to me that, in the day and age in which we live, none of that information is leaked or shared anonymously--I'm sure someone has talked to a friend, colleague etc. Had I loved in Calgary, I would have tried to attend the hearing myself

I almost wonder if I obsess too much--but we've been waiting for over two years for answers now--I wish I knew even a little bit. Does this happen with anyone else--Googling cases every day and hoping for more info leading up to a trial? Things are especially slow up here in Canada...

 

[palisadesk]

Sorry if this seems out of place at this point--but it's been killing me waiting for January when this trial finally gets underway.

One thing that I found fascinating about the legal system is this:
Unless I'm wrong, members of the general public were able to attend the prelim hearing and hear a broad overview of the evidence in this case, meaning that some (including individuals on this forum I believe), meaning that they likely know what was done to this poor boy and his grandparents. It seems amazing to me that, in the day and age in which we live, none of that information is leaked or shared anonymously--I'm sure someone has talked to a friend, colleague etc.

The reason you cannot find out anything about the proceedings in the preliminary hearing (which was, as you noted, open to the general public) is because all of that is under a publication ban.

Here's a link:

http://calgaryherald.com/storyline/...d-of-killing-calgary-boy-and-his-grandparents

Publication bans are serious business. They don't restrict people from talking to their family or friends about what they heard at the hearing, but it very explicitly prohibits any public transmission of any details. So, no blogging, no Facebook entries, no messages to chat groups, nothing verbally transmitted via the radio or other audible media, nothing "published" in any form whatever, whether written or orally communicated.

Here's more information on the rationale, etc.:
http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/cj-jp/victims-victimes/factsheets-fiches/publication.html

Offenders are dealt with promptly and face serious penalties for violations. You and the rest of us will have to wait for the trial for any further information to be released. There's no point Googling for more details, as they are not going to be published anywhere.

 

[Jemska48]

I just saw this. They're going to court today to determine the admissibility of some of the evidence and apparently Garland will be making an appearance. Why would he need to appear to determine admissibility of evidence? Unfortunately, this too has a publication ban. I assume any other hearing will as well until the trial next year. I don't recall the last time I've seen something like this but I guess given the fact that they haven't found their remains it would make sense?

http://globalnews.ca/news/3098854/a...-garland-to-appear-in-calgary-court-thursday/