Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #21

[otto]

No doubt they are dangerous but they do occur. In some cases, with larger burns, the owner will plan the burn with the local fire department so that they can be on hand to keep things under control. In other cases the owners don't take such precautions and just burn away. I would post some photos of my buddies burn from this summer when he cleared a portion of his property but kids are in all the pictures and I don't want to post them in this discussion.

Out of curiosity, I looked up the regulations for my buddies county and they are pretty relaxed on burning cleared brush/trees:http://www.mdfoothills.com/resident..._department/burning_permits__regulations.html

Acreages outside of Calgary don't have a "local fire department" and houses burn to the ground before anyone can do anything. Aidrie is in the MD of Rockyview and the acreage is close enough to Airdrie. I can see Douglas Garland being crazy enough to openly burn all sorts of things on the property without really caring about the consequences to neighbouring properties.

http://www.rockyview.ca/CountyServices/FireEmergency/FirePermits.aspx

 

[garbagetweet]

Acreages outside of Calgary don't have a "local fire department" and houses burn to the ground before anyone can do anything. Aidrie is in the MD of Rockyview and the acreage is close enough to Airdrie. I can see Douglas Garland being crazy enough to openly burn all sorts of things on the property without really caring about the consequences to neighbouring properties.

http://www.rockyview.ca/CountyServices/FireEmergency/FirePermits.aspx

By "local fire department" I meant the county fire service/stations and the folks associated with them (fire guardians/fire wardens.)

 

[otto]

Wow on the times. Wth

When I was first reading about the router being turned off, I wondered if the Liknes family turned it off because of the move. I suppose Garland was thinking like someone from his youth who would cut the phone line before committing a crime, but today it means disabling the router. Although a phone would work without a router, it wouldn't have wifi. What is the advantage of disabling the victim's phone wifi while committing a crime?

 

[lawyer-mum]

When I was first reading about the router being turned off, I wondered if the Liknes family turned it off because of the move. I suppose Garland was thinking like someone from his youth who would cut the phone line before committing a crime, but today it means disabling the router. Although a phone would work without a router, it wouldn't have wifi. What is the advantage of disabling the victim's phone wifi while committing a crime?

If they had VOIP, then turning off the router would have disabled the home telephone.

 

[Power of Two]

I remember reading the 1st or 2nd day of trial he was wearing his blue jumpsuit so I'm assuming he just doesn't care...and I don't think he would start caring 4 days into his trial lol...he doesn't seem to care about much

If he were to be wearing nice street clothes it would mean someone was providing them for him each day. It would be a stretch to assume his aged mother would be up to the task. Would a lawyer see he was dressed nicely for court?
Perhaps the prison garb is meant to provoke some sort of empathy/sympathy?

 

[Kamille]

If they had VOIP, then turning off the router would have disabled the home telephone.

They did have VOIP so the home phones were disabled by shutting down the router. Now since they both had working cell phones, does this explain why AL's was found in a cardboard box in the bedroom? Was the phone on the nightstand and DG threw it in the box prior to whatever transpired to ensure that it wasn't used either? :waitasec:

 

[otto]

If they had VOIP, then turning off the router would have disabled the home telephone.

Thank you! They did have VOIP. Kathryn's cell phone was in the kitchen, and Alvin's was in a 'box'. I wonder if Garland knew that they had VOIP, if he was able to sleuth into their phone provider. Maybe he stole their mail to figure it out, but maybe they had automatic billing.

 

[olivebpa1]

They did have VOIP so the home phones were disabled by shutting down the router. Now since they both had working cell phones, does this explain why AL's was found in a cardboard box in the bedroom? Was the phone on the nightstand and DG threw it in the box prior to whatever transpired to ensure that it wasn't used either? :waitasec:

I wondered why AL's cellphone was in a cardboard box. KL's was plugged in in the kitchen which makes more sense. with all of the planning he did I suppose he could have thrown the cell phone in the Box to get it out of the way.

 

[Power of Two]

A reporter tweeted that Nathan's parents were in court every day but today so far.

I would be shattered by day # 3.

 

[Georgeo]

Lots more details coming out. Good that LE were thorough. Why is it that photos of accused are not allowed to be taken at trial?

 

[Wondergirl]

Meghan Grant
@CBCMeg

1st thing Salway noticed: Key hole not up & down, it's at 90 degree angle from where it's supposed to be (I'm using layman's terms) #Garland
3:52 PM - 19 jan

 

[Wondergirl]

No doubt they are dangerous but they do occur. In some cases, with larger burns, the owner will plan the burn with the local fire department so that they can be on hand to keep things under control. In other cases the owners don't take such precautions and just burn away. I would post some photos of my buddies burn from this summer when he cleared a portion of his property but kids are in all the pictures and I don't want to post them in this discussion.

Out of curiosity, I looked up the regulations for my buddies county and they are pretty relaxed on burning cleared brush/trees:http://www.mdfoothills.com/resident..._department/burning_permits__regulations.html

I agree.

Burns are common where I live, large, small or otherwise. No big deal to burn tree branches or anything else. Sometimes people will do controlled burns on their ditches etc.

It's very, very common. I'm in Ontario.

Nobody would bat an eyelash, especially a barrel burn, in Aerdrie or a zillion other places around the country. Same goes for a ground fire.

Jmo

 

[Kamille]

Lots more details coming out. Good that LE were thorough. Why is it that photos of accused are not allowed to be taken at trial?

No photos are allowed to be taken in a courtroom in Canada. We do not allow the press to video our trials either. The press is only allowed to use a sketch artist to publish a vague impression of the inside of the courtroom and the people in it. And since most defendants who are in custody are brought into courthouses via underground secure garages in windowless vans, it's very rare for the press to be able to get a picture of a defendant outside of the courtroom. One of the few times I've seen that was one of Michael Rafferty in the back of a police car being transported to the courthouse. Not sure why that was his mode of transportation that day but an alert press photographer noticed it and got the picture.

MOO

 

[xtradegree]

I googled keypad lock. 5 pictures came up, with the third one depicting a keypad with a turn keylock, with similar keypad layout and design (I’m not sure if I’m allowed to include the brand name so I won’t). So I googled (the brand name) and clicked on products, keypad and the first one that came up was the BE365. As DG obviously staked out the place prior to, a quick picture of the lock would’ve easily yielded the above results. And then of course a quick google search of defeating any keypad lock (without even putting in the brand name or model) turns up lots of how-to, with a common denominator being drilling a hole (in various places), including (the brand name) products. Be more specific with that search using the name brand of the lock and it would’ve come up even quicker and easier. All in under 2 minutes. Scary huh?

I'm thinking even if he had been there before as a visitor, how on earth would he know what make and model of lock they had on the door. Pretty sure I can't name one from any home I've ever been to, even quite frequently. Come to think of it, I have no idea what the model number of the one on my own door is. :waitasec:

MOO

 

[Kamille]

For the burn barrel vs burn pile debate, I'm bringing over the pictures of both the burn barrel (appears there was only one) and the aerial of the property showing the location of it in relation to the "south fire pit/fire dump", which is where I assume LE went back to 9 months later?

First the burn barrel

[video=twitter;821434172812079104]https://twitter.com/NancyHixt/status/821434172812079104[/video]

 

[Kamille]

And now the burn pit

[video=twitter;821412549497221120]https://twitter.com/CBCMeg/status/821412549497221120[/video]

 

[lawyer-mum]

Thank you! They did have VOIP. Kathryn's cell phone was in the kitchen, and Alvin's was in a 'box'. I wonder if Garland knew that they had VOIP, if he was able to sleuth into their phone provider. Maybe he stole their mail to figure it out, but maybe they had automatic billing.

Also, I think the phrase 'powered down' was used with respect to the router which suggests it was turned off or unplugged from inside the house rather than from the outside - it could also be possible to cut the cable wires from outside of the house.

 

[sublimemumma]

I can't even imagine the reaction of both him and his defense team when that piece of discovery was sent to them.

And he's pleading not guilty and going to trial because?.... :notgood:

MOO

I truly think it's like someone (forget who) said he is so angry it's just to punish the family more by making them go through the trial.

 

[otto]

I agree.

Burns are common where I live, large, small or otherwise. No big deal to burn tree branches or anything else. Sometimes people will do controlled burns on their ditches etc.

It's very, very common. I'm in Ontario.

Nobody would bat an eyelash, especially a barrel burn, in Aerdrie or a zillion other places around the country. Same goes for a ground fire.

Jmo

West winds and wide open prairie are very scary when there's fire. Fort McMurray is a good example of a fire that was small and of no concern, but with a turn of the wind ...

 

[otto]

I truly think it's like someone (forget who) said he is so angry it's just to punish the family more by making them go through the trial.

I think he wants people to understand his relationship with Alvin and how he was taken advantage of in a business deal. He was fixated on his injustice from 2010 - 2014, and he wants people to see Alvin as he did. The only way to do that is with a trial, and a jury trial is better than a bench trial because more people hear his story. I don't think he want's to hurt Alvin's family.