Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 June 2014 - #1

[LayzeeDayzee]

Maybe drag marks were of a heavy item that they were selling and scraped against the ground? LE may be appealing to those who visited the sale to help recall what that item was? JMO

That's what I'd wondered here yesterday. Maybe the dark fluid stains are from some piece of equipment/machinery that Alvin sold.......that had leaked some kind of fluid, oil, etc.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

I'm curious whether the grandfather and his twin brother are identical or fraternal. The fact that they are twins might explain why the brother went to the house when he couldn't reach the grandfather ... maybe it was a feeling.

If they are identical, then if ... contrary to police information ... if there was a domestic situation and the grandfather fled, then he would have ID and a vehicle to use without creating any suspicion.

It's not the same brother. Cliff is the brother who went to the home. I believe Allen is the twin brother who has the place in Mazatlan. There are many pics on KL's FB page/albums, of the brother and wife and them all down in Mazatlan.

EDIT: I stand corrected. In KL's "albums" of pics if you click on the Album "Kathy" you'll see pics of KL and AL and their 2 boys, and the twin Allen and his wife and their son............and wow, the brothers look identical, see for your self! Surprised me as the main profile pic for Allen looks much different, much darker hair.

 

[matou]

Well I know there were lots of thefts of equipment like snowblows, small tractors, trailers, etc in my area over the last 10 years or so, then resold on Craigslist, etc.

 

[otto]

It's not the same brother. Cliff is the brother who went to the home. I believe Allen is the twin brother who has the place in Mazatlan. There are many pics on KL's FB page/albums, of the brother and wife and them all down in Mazatlan.

EDIT: I stand corrected. In KL's "albums" of pics if you click on the Album "Kathy" you'll see pics of KL and AL and their 2 boys, and the twin Allen and his wife and their kids............and wow, the brothers look identical, see for your self! Surprised me as the main profile pic for Allen looks much different, much darker hair.

I know I should stop suspecting that there was a domestic dispute and that the grandfather was somehow responsible. Police have said the complete opposite. I just can't understand why someone would be dragged out of the house, and I don't understand why the family thinks that the victims have been taken out of Calgary.

I know I'm not alone in my thinking, as one of the reporters kept asking if police were going to travel to Mazatlan to look for the missing family members. Police must also be thinking along those lines if they have notified border crossings, airports, and US agencies. I'm assuming that they have been asked to look for the child ... random kidnappers don't take family members and leave the country on a plane.

 

[KMouse]

Well I know there were lots of thefts of equipment like snowblows, small tractors, trailers, etc in my area over the last 10 years or so, then resold on Craigslist, etc.

Anybody remember the Tim Bosma murder case from last year? People came out to test drive a truck he was selling and he was murdered.

 

[jwbear]

Anybody remember the Tim Bosma murder case from last year? People came out to test drive a truck he was selling.

I thought of him as soon as I read there was a sale going on day before. Hope they find them soon.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

However, we don't know how old or fresh those 'drag marks' are. Perhaps LE does but we don't. The reason I was asking yesterday if garbage truck picks up garbage on front street or alley is because some areas of the fluid streaks/lines looked to me like what you'd see if someone had dragged a leaking garbage bag down the driveway.

 

[KMouse]

There are some photos of the presser here:

http://live.calgaryherald.com/Event/Amber_alert_The_search_for_Nathan_OBrien_and_his_grandparents

and the presser can be viewed here:

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2014/07/...arents-to-make-public-appeal-for-their-return

 

[otto]

However, we don't know how old or fresh those 'drag marks' are. Perhaps LE does but we don't. The reason I was asking yesterday if garbage truck picks up garbage on front street or alley is because some areas of the fluid streaks/lines looked to me like what you'd see if someone had dragged a leaking garbage bag down the driveway.

Hasn't there been a fair bit of rain? Didn't someone mention rain on Sunday? Wouldn't something that leaks have been washed away?

Rain at 8PM Sunday

http://www.timeanddate.com/weather/canada/calgary/historic

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

Hasn't there been a fair bit of rain? Didn't someone mention rain on Sunday? Wouldn't something that leaks have been washed away?

Rain at 8PM Sunday

http://www.timeanddate.com/weather/canada/calgary/historic

If it was dark oil it would have taken probably more than a pressure washer to get rid of, IMO.......so if oil I don't think rain would get rid of it.

 

[Wondergirl]

This reminds me of my girlfriend's estate sale 2 weeks ago...She sold her large stainless BBQ to an older couple who in turn asked for assistance ( as in...can your husband travel back to our home and help unload it PLEASE?!....) He reluctantly obliged since they were elderly buyers and insisted they lived very close by,etc...Well...he returned 2 hours later and although he is a successful attorney and considers himself to be a great judge of character...second guessed himself numerous times along that route there...and back...
Perhaps this occured...with bad results? A car accident in a purchaser's car or rented u-Haul? Just thinking out loud....

Excellent post, thank-you.

 

[otto]

If it was dark oil it would have taken probably more than a pressure washer to get rid of, IMO.......so if oil I don't think rain would get rid of it.

In the photos posted in the news, it looks like whatever was there is now mostly washed away, and the reporter that was there did describe an 8 metre long blood trail (drag marks) from the side door to the parking pad at the front of the house. That info obviously didn't come from police, so I'm guessing that it is something that he saw.

 

[5CentsWorth]

Anybody remember the Tim Bosma murder case from last year? People came out to test drive a truck he was selling and he was murdered.

I remember and this also sort of reminds me of the case of Shirley Dermond and her husband, but the Dermonds were much older.

 

[Wondergirl]

Let's talk about motive.

Perhaps there is something very valuable that the Liknes' had for sale in that house. Maybe they mentioned it to some select prospective buyers. They live in an affluent neighborhood afterall.

Perhaps LE is trying to determine if that particular valuable item that is currently not in the home, was the motive for the crime, and they want to see if someone actually bought it.

 

[otto]

Let's talk about motive.

Perhaps there is something very valuable that the Liknes' had for sale in that house. Maybe they mentioned it to some select prospective buyers. They live in an affluent neighborhood afterall.

Perhaps LE is trying to determine if that particular valuable item that is currently not in the home, was the motive for the crime, and they want to see if someone actually bought it.

There might have been jewelry that had significant value.

 

[KMouse]

Let's talk about motive.

Perhaps there is something very valuable that the Liknes' had for sale in that house. Maybe they mentioned it to some select prospective buyers. They live in an affluent neighborhood afterall.

Perhaps LE is trying to determine if that particular valuable item that is currently not in the home, was the motive for the crime, and they want to see if someone actually bought it.

Motive to us ``normal`` people isn`t necessarily a motive for others.

 

[Wondergirl]

The term "Estate" is really being used as just a great marketing term to draw people in. Although they did actually have an "Estate" sale, whereby they sold their entire contents of their home, I believe the term garage sale was not being used, because they wanted to imply VALUABLE things were for sale.

I think these people may have been victimized by the placement of their ad for their "Estate" on Kijiji. I don't think their local pink signs drew in their abductors.

If this was a robbery gone bad, it was generated from the Kijiji ads. The criminals probably target affluent neighborhoods, and the Liknes home fit the bill.

I really hope LE is tracing IPs who accessed their kijiji ads prior to their disappearance. I feel it is critical.

JMO

 

[5CentsWorth]

Let's talk about motive.

Perhaps there is something very valuable that the Liknes' had for sale in that house. Maybe they mentioned it to some select prospective buyers. They live in an affluent neighborhood afterall.

Perhaps LE is trying to determine if that particular valuable item that is currently not in the home, was the motive for the crime, and they want to see if someone actually bought it.

Maybe someone was seeking retaliation against the couple for some reason and heard the Liknes were leaving the country so they thought this was their last chance for revenge.

 

[Wendy101]

Let's talk about motive.

Perhaps there is something very valuable that the Liknes' had for sale in that house. Maybe they mentioned it to some select prospective buyers. They live in an affluent neighborhood afterall.

Perhaps LE is trying to determine if that particular valuable item that is currently not in the home, was the motive for the crime, and they want to see if someone actually bought it.

What about medications?

Valuables to a 20-25 yr old,druggie?? My answer to that is everything in the home... valuables to an older person might be jewelry and such??

if this is not a domestic gone bad.. IMO it will turn out to be a bunch of younger druggies..

 

[otto]

The point about declaring bankrupcy in the last two years is interesting. Looking at it in the context of having sold the house at a time when the market is soft (Christmas) and leasing it back, one has to wonder about the finances. Was there someone that was cleaned-out because of Alvin declaring bankrupcy? Was that person keeping an eye on Alvin and waiting for an opportunity to get back money that was owed? Was that person determined to force some sort of repayment now that the family was liquidating assets and leaving the city? Why was the family moving to Edmonton or Mexico when it seems that a lot of family is in Calgary?

I posted upthread that I had a suspicion that there were some "get rich quick" schemes between the grandafther's oil company start ups and the many business ventures of the grandmother. If there was any history of looking for ways to get money from others, it's certainly possible that the wrong person was taken advantage of - especially if it meant a loss of lifestyle to someone else.