CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #9

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Audrey was an animal lover and at some time, I read that she either owned or sponsored a horse…LV's nephew was into horses big time. Is it possible that she helped him out (financially) and then retracted? If so, could this nephew have held a grudge?
 
I have been away for a little while so forgive me, but I do not know who your NO.1 POI is…I don't understand your post??? One of my prime suspects is the person I first brought to the board…JV. I hope that LE has looked into him as he is related to Audrey's best friend and may have been precisely excluded from her will.

Can you please explain your post a bit…

My POI no. 1 is PK but we don't know his connections to ie JV, car dealers and so many more possible "perps". The witness list of the TB trial is interesting, we have something to prove. Some connection or motive suddenly could flash up, I hope. I imagine a scenario of perhaps 2 perps, one with personally (revenge) and financial motive and one only with financial motive (car?) .... :dunno:
 
I remember PK saying he had never been for a ride in the camaro. He and AG went to a store to get a part she needed for her mailbox. Did they take separate cars or his car?

I think, he said they would always drive in his car. Verrrry strange, IMO! The shepherds got a drive but her nice longtime friend never ever??? Seemingly there is nobody who says the contrary and Audrey isn't any more.
 
I wonder if that is code for something else other than the obvious meaning ? I do not speak " criminal " .

IMO

I think NOT that's a code. Only fear of someone who will test drive with full speed and then not buy the car.
 
Would you all think that the police department would be checking DNA evidence from the TB death against DNA evidence found in AG's murder? It seems the case has switched hands a few times. I hope that someone still has Audrey top of mind and is trying to bring her killer to justice.

Audrey Gleave is also not forgotten 30 kilometres away, on the second floor of Central Police Station on King William Street.

A white Homicide Case Book rests on the desk of Det. Angela Abrams. The cover reads: "Gleave, Audrey 10.12.30."

Abrams exchanges glances with the victim each day on the job.

"Audrey stares at me every morning," says Abrams of the picture at her desk. "She's not going away."

The snapshot is one of many selfies Gleave took over the years, but in the days before the word existed — self-portraits taken with an old-fashioned camera.

Her picture is among a few others at Abrams' desk. She calls them her unsolved family tree.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/5809219-who-killed-audrey-gleave-/
 
http://www.thespec.com/news-story/45...osma-s-family/

The fact is, there is lots of work being done behind the scenes on the prosecutions of three people charged in connection with Tim's murder.

In the past, Leitch said the case involves "one of the largest computer seizures in Ontario criminal law history."


I wonder if "one of the largest computer seizures in Ontario" included Audrey Gleave's computer with data before December 2010 ..... :thinking:
 
http://www.thespec.com/news-story/45...osma-s-family/

The fact is, there is lots of work being done behind the scenes on the prosecutions of three people charged in connection with Tim's murder.

In the past, Leitch said the case involves "one of the largest computer seizures in Ontario criminal law history."


I wonder if "one of the largest computer seizures in Ontario" included Audrey Gleave's computer with data before December 2010 ..... :thinking:

Excellent question. Audrey was very clever, and used a computer. I remember reading she tried hard to remain quite anonymous online, but it would be interesting to see the history and emails on her computer, for sure, as well as the activity on her phone. Was she thinking of selling her Camaro, or maybe even buying another luxury vehicle ? Might this interest have brought her to the attention of any of those involved in the Tim Bosma case ? It is a real possibility since I believe she lived only 30 miles from Tim. I hope LE take a close look at her computer to see if there are any links to those in the Dellon Millard and Mark Smitch network of friends and contacts.

I always suspected that the sexual component of her attack might have been a smoke screen to cover up theft of some kind, but whoever her killer was, they left the Camaro behind. Maybe they just planned to steal the car during a test drive, or knock her out and take the car, but then it all went wrong, and they killed her, then were afraid to take the Camaro because it would mean too much risk, and could lead LE to them as murder suspects.

Just some thoughts, and IMO
 
Excellent question. Audrey was very clever, and used a computer. I remember reading she tried hard to remain quite anonymous online, but it would be interesting to see the history and emails on her computer, for sure, as well as the activity on her phone. Was she thinking of selling her Camaro, or maybe even buying another luxury vehicle ? Might this interest have brought her to the attention of any of those involved in the Tim Bosma case ? It is a real possibility since I believe she lived only 30 miles from Tim. I hope LE take a close look at her computer to see if there are any links to those in the Dellon Millard and Mark Smitch network of friends and contacts.

I always suspected that the sexual component of her attack might have been a smoke screen to cover up theft of some kind, but whoever her killer was, they left the Camaro behind. Maybe they just planned to steal the car during a test drive, or knock her out and take the car, but then it all went wrong, and they killed her, then were afraid to take the Camaro because it would mean too much risk, and could lead LE to them as murder suspects.

Just some thoughts, and IMO

I have always felt that the Camaro had something to do with Audrey's murder. And I agree that the sexual component may have been a smoke screen.
We live quite close to where Audrey lived. Since her murder my safe feeling in this rural setting I once had has vanished.
The more I read about Tim Bosma's murder the more I think they may be connected. MOO
 
Forensic biologist - is using the term "secondary". Audrey in her email told PK, he would not believe it but she had a "secondary infection". Do you remember? We thought of a unusual term by someone who is not a doctor etc. AND we thought of a fake mail, not written by Audrey herself but perhaps by the/a perp.

Now I'm back on my "PK trip" and I'm asking myself wether PK may have a forensic/biologist/forensic biologist in his engineer circle of friends. PK studied "electrical and biomedical engineering" - I think, maybe not so very far fetched? For now thinking of possibly 2 perps - IF not only the POI or - see above posts - MS/DM etc.
 
Possible traces:

Witness saw a man with backpack wearing a hoodie on AG's drive way around the time of murder.
Was the man smoking when he went along? MS is a smoker, brand still unknown.
 
https://www.google.de/maps/dir/Trin...ed9aa5a3ee!2m2!1d-80.1483788!2d43.2030855!3e0

Trinity Road = Tim
Indian Trail = AG

Doesn't say anything but very close together (2,5 years apart). :gaah: IF the perp in case AG (maybe backpacker) had no driving license and IF no mate was waiting for him in a parked car: to which mate in the nearby area was he walking?
In a recently shown Divisonal court document (TB thread) there are 3 persons defendants vs. 1 person plaintiff. Probably only coincidence, but 1 female person defendant wears the same second name of someone in AG's neighbourhood. Just wanted to mention, although I did know only of a young male so far.
 
FromGermany, Thank you for the useful map. I am not from the Ancaster area, and it is helpful. Many years ago I was a witness for the Crown in a criminal case. It was quite an experience. One thing an RCMP officer told me at the time was that criminals really like to have a major highway, ( like the 403 ), near the scene of their crime. It makes for easy drop off, pickup, and escape, or moving stolen items, drugs away quickly, and handing them off to someone else on the major highway. I noticed on the map you provided that the 403 more or less bi-sects the area between Indian Trail, and Trinity Rd. The fact that they are only a 15 minute drive apart, on good paved roads, yet in quite rural, and secluded areas, tells me this might be a comfort zone for some criminals. It might also be a good place for cash crops of " weed ", and easy, quick access to the 403. We know MS sold drugs, and was involved in car theft. Does he have friends or relatives in this area ? All speculation on my part, but in my opinion it is a possibility that someone knew about Audrey's solitary, remote living situation, and that she had the nice Camaro.

I would like to know if she usually had the two German Shepherd dogs crated when they were in her house. It is unfortunate that they were not with her when she met the person(s) who killed her. Perhaps someone forced her at gunpoint into the garage, or killed her outside, then staged things in the garage. Was her purse found ? Was anything stolen from the house ? Thanks for any information you can provide. I did not follow Audrey's case until recently because I thought there might be a connection to Tim Bosma's murder.
 
Sphinx :wave: A little error with the button.

FromGermany, Thank you for the useful map. I am not from the Ancaster area, and it is helpful. Many years ago I was a witness for the Crown in a criminal case. It was quite an experience. One thing an RCMP officer told me at the time was that criminals really like to have a major highway, ( like the 403 ), near the scene of their crime. It makes for easy drop off, pickup, and escape, or moving stolen items, drugs away quickly, and handing them off to someone else on the major highway. I noticed on the map you provided that the 403 more or less bi-sects the area between Indian Trail, and Trinity Rd. The fact that they are only a 15 minute drive apart, on good paved roads, yet in quite rural, and secluded areas, tells me this might be a comfort zone for some criminals. It might also be a good place for cash crops of " weed ", and easy, quick access to the 403. We know MS sold drugs, and was involved in car theft. Does he have friends or relatives in this area ? All speculation on my part, but in my opinion it is a possibility that someone knew about Audrey's solitary, remote living situation, and that she had the nice Camaro.

I would like to know if she usually had the two German Shepherd dogs crated when they were in her house. It is unfortunate that they were not with her when she met the person(s) who killed her. Perhaps someone forced her at gunpoint into the garage, or killed her outside, then staged things in the garage. Was her purse found ? Was anything stolen from the house ? Thanks for any information you can provide. I did not follow Audrey's case until recently because I thought there might be a connection to Tim Bosma's murder.


AG was wearing a winter coat when she was found in her garage. Therefore I think, she wasn't forced at gunpoint into the garage but perhaps a) heard noises or b) wanted to smoke outside home or c) wanted to meet someone outside home.
If I know correctly, the shepherds were crated often or most of the time.
AG's purse was found inside her home, nothing seemed to have stolen, not out of the purse and not from her home. Though I don't know, who would have known exactly if no visitor ever had access except PK.

We don't know yet if MS has friends/acquaintances/relatives/girlfriends in this area.

To Oakville where MS comes from it's around 55min driving time - always along 403.

I think AG had always excited a stir with her Camaro and the "lovely" sound.
 
Reminder

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2259959-if-audrey-gleave-s-dogs-could-speak-/

But Det. Angela Abrams says Gleave was targeted — which stands to reason, given the relative isolation of where she lived and how careful she was about letting anyone close to her.

She was a creature of habit: the times when she checked her computer, the hours she slept, coming and going from the house with her dogs.

"It was not random," says Abrams. "She would have known who it was."
 
Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 4 Min.Vor 4 Minuten
Screen capture of travel itinerary to Christina Noudga. Sent to Dellen Millard. Bill of sale for Camaro to Millard.

After all, he liked Camaros ......
 
Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 4 Min.Vor 4 Minuten
Screen capture of travel itinerary to Christina Noudga. Sent to Dellen Millard. Bill of sale for Camaro to Millard.

After all, he liked Camaros ......

My heart skipped a beat when I read that on the Tim Bosma thread. I wonder if she was thinking of selling her Camaro?
 
Reminder


Togi and Schatze have played a role in the investigation. Detectives took DNA samples from the dogs — blood and hair — but it is unclear why.

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/2259959-if-audrey-gleave-s-dogs-could-speak-/

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/5809219-who-killed-audrey-gleave-/


When I heard that Mark Smitch had his dog with him when he was arrested, I posted that I hoped LE had taken hair/dna samples from the dog. They should have " arrested " the dog and taken him in for forensic examination at the same time to ensure the chain of evidence. Maybe they did. LE took his girlfriend at the same time. My reasoning was that dog hairs from this dog could have been transferred from MS's clothing into Tim Bosma's truck, where he was murdered, or those hairs might have been found on something else LE found in the homes of MS or Dellen Millard. I am relieved to hear that LE took hair/dna samples from Audrey's dogs. The killer might have picked up some of their hairs even in the garage, or from Audrey's clothing, or her Camaro. They might turn up yet somewhere, like in the bottom of a backpack, or in a glove, and provide a link to her killer.
 
AG's purse was found inside her home, nothing seemed to have stolen, not out of the purse and not from her home. Though I don't know, who would have known exactly if no visitor ever had access except PK.
Maybe there was a layer of dust in many areas of the home, so it was obvious nothing was moved?
 
Maybe there was a layer of dust in many areas of the home, so it was obvious nothing was moved?

Was it ever revealed whether or not she had house/car keys in her pocket ? I am wondering if she were waiting to meet someone to take them on a test drive of her Camaro, and maybe she became suspicious because the person arrived on foot, as happened in the Tim Bosma case. Perhaps she would have refused to go, someone tried to force her, and it resulted in her death in the garage, then in a panic, a sex attack was staged to cover up that the Camaro was the motive. I keep thinking about that stranger who was seen with a backpack, wearing a hoodie walking down her driveway about the time of her death. Mark Smitch often dressed that way, and wore a backpack, or a bag that resembled one. Were her phone calls really examined ? What about the cell phones that were pinging cell towers about the time of her murder ?
 
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