Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #2

[justice be served]

Thank you for agreeing with my post. I do feel, however, that frugality has its limits. When you are the 15th wealthiest person in the country, a multi Billionaire, it would be prudent to take some measures to protect yourself. Perhaps he was a bit naive.

Or simply stubborn and set in his ways.

 

[Lilibet]

If there was only one suicide and no murder, how did the second person die?

I'm not following you - help me out.

jmo

I’m not the OP, but I don’t think there was a murder and one suicide. But I do think it’s possible there was a manslaughter...unintentional accident (in anger perhaps) in which Honey was clearly not going to survive. Not wanting to go on without her, it’s possible that Barry set it up to look like a double murder, knowing his kids would never accept murder-suicide as a verdict. He’d have to know it wouldn’t pass as a double suicide. But it might be easier for his kids to think it was a double murder. I’m not committing to this scenario, but I do think it’s a possibility.

 

[Grey-St]

I agree with what you've posted 100%. I think the confusion for many is the fact that it was reported early-on that the security camera in the poolroom was disabled. It was also reported that a rep. from the security company was called in.

Absolutely, I see the confusion. That's why I said "if we find it to be true" that there was no security system...
We have very little facts at the moment.

 

[Snoop Sister]

I’m not the OP, but I don’t think there was a murder and one suicide. But I do think it’s possible there was a manslaughter...unintentional accident (in anger perhaps) in which Honey was clearly not going to survive. Not wanting to go on without her, it’s possible that Barry set it up to look like a double murder, knowing his kids would never accept murder-suicide as a verdict. He’d have to know it wouldn’t pass as a double suicide. But it might be easier for his kids to think it was a double murder. I’m not committing to this scenario, but I do think it’s a possibility.

I think HS’s sister would know the most about Honey and Barry’s relationship and if he has ever been untoward etc toward Honey or any relationship difficulties. She also might know if Barry had been having any cognitive issues. I hope LE spends a lot of time with her. There are things Honey might have shared with her sister that she wouldn’t with her children.

I did originally think it was murder-suicide but now I am on the fence. Not sure ...totally bizarre.

 

[Grey-St]

“They are going to go through every square inch of that house for a clue and (also look at) the security cameras,” he said.

D’Angelo also believes “they are going to look between the middle of night and into the morning, how many cell calls there were in that area, near the front of that house.”

http://torontosun.com/news/local-ne...family-and-friends-of-barry-and-honey-sherman

I don't really know why D'Angelo thinks he knows what LE are going to do? He speaks as if he is a homicide detective.

How close were they anyway? I thought BS just had some involvement with D'Angelo's brewery, and then pushed him out and gave the brewery to his son.

 

[Hazel]

Measurements aren't really needed to align the floorpan foot prints. It is easy to see the "lift" on all three floors and it doesn't really have any association with stairs. It is in the kitchen, the pool area, and the master bedroom dressing room - which suggests to me that it is for food rather than people.

(RBBM)

Food and/or for dirty/clean laundry (to and from dressing room) and
wet/fresh towels (to and from indoor pools). JMO

Off topic: the laundry room seems small for the size of the house, JMO.

 

[Hazel]

This link contains many Getty images from:


http://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/ba...ography&phrase=barry sherman&sort=mostpopular

• the funeral, including our PM
• Conference Centre,
• demolition at the new-to-be-built Sherman's house
• outside the Sherman's house (50 Old Colony Rd.)
• forensics gathering evidence from outside the house,
• gathering evidence from inside one of the vehicles (the one parked at the top of the ramp)
• Also images of a few houses from the surrounding area,
• and BS pictures at Apotex

 

[BlueEarth]

I watched a very loving family grieving today. The family, friends, the co-workers, the associates ALL had the same message. These two people were devoted to their family and their empire.
A murder suicide seems nearly impossible to me. I may be wrong but I just find it unfathomable.
One suicide, yes. A murder, just no!

I did not watch the service, but I did read some quotes from the adult children, and a brief news-clip. I do feel for them: it must be incredibly difficult and traumatic to lose not just one, but both parents, so suddenly and under such alarming circumstances.

At the same time, I am mystified as to why they held a funeral service for six thousand. I don't think heads of state have so many people on the attendee list. (Princess Diana's funeral had two thousand, I think - obviously millions around the world watched on television.) Why not have a regular, intimate service for a much smaller audience of truly close family and friends? Startling to see that kind of spectacle.

Anyway, aside from the above, I am not sure if this has been earlier discussed, as I simply cannot read through all 96 (!) pages of this thread, but I think what is of more interest beyond whether there had been "signs of forced entry", is whether or not all doors/windows/any possible exits of the house were secured upon discovery. If so, that makes things quite interesting... If it was a double-murder, the perpetrator(s) would have had to have either locked the door behind them, or perhaps, if there was such a thing installed, the door would have had a mechanism to lock automatically upon closing. I know someone who has that installed on their door. But if there was no such mechanism, that means there is someone who had a key - whether they had obtained one through the Shermans providing one to them voluntarily, or had surreptitiously obtained one - OR they took it from the Shermans after they died.

Obviously, we will not know this answer, and many others, for some time (if at all), but to me that is worth pondering.

 

[dotr]

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...ion-into-barry-and-honey-shermans-deaths.html

[h=1]Sherman family’s private investigation is a bid to understand unexplained circumstances[/h]In making the decision to conduct a private investigation, the Sherman family joins a list of other families who have made the same decision after a loved one died suddenly

Mark Valois, a former Toronto police homicide officer who now serves as director of academic training at the Canadian Tactical Officers Association, told the Star that private investigators function the same way police officers do. Most, he said, are former police officers.

“Everyone has a right to hire a private investigator,” said Valois, who now serves as director of academic training at the Canadian Tactical Officers Association. “They may believe there are other issues they’ve suspected, other than what is found to be the investigative motive for the incident.

“They hire a third party to find differently.”

 

[Sillybilly]

Websleuths TOS does not allow discussion of rumour or gossip.

Information stated as fact must be supported by a link to MSM or LE, or it is considered rumour. Some rumour posts have been removed.

:wave:

 

[Jennifer17]

I agree with this. I think he seemed wisely frugal.

I also wont be shocked by any means if we find it to be true that there was no security system. I had a hunch early on when people were claiming "they must have security footage" that it could very well not be the case. They were certainly wealthy, but they weren't "celebrities". They didn't have paparazzi following them around and waiting outside their home. They didn't lead some kind of life that would pose a security risk. This was a normal, Toronto family from a close knit (well-to-do) community. I think I've know one family in my entire life to have a security system in their home, and there were certainly no cameras involved. It was a code you entered upon leaving and arriving home. I don't know where all this talk of cameras in every room and motion sensors is coming from... JMO.

I don't know why this is so shocking for some folks. Most people just lock their doors. Have a neighbour take in the paper and your mail when you're on vacation. Leave a porch light on. Remain vigilant. Simple stuff . And BS sounded like a simple guy.

I have long time friends like this. I don't think that they are billionaires, but they are multi, multi millionaires. They buy all generic label food and household items. Once when I was moving from a house that I had lived in for almost forty years, I had a pile of old threadbare towels that I was throwing out, when my friend asked could she have them because her husband would use them as grease rags on their boat, but when I stayed with them in their really expensive waterfront home, one of them was hanging on the towel rail in a bathroom.
The husband drives a 15 year old station wagon, for local errands, although the wife always has a late model car. My friend buys very expensive shoes and handbags, but not expensive clothing.
They fly economy class, often with numerous stops to get the cheapest airfare. They are 72 and 75, but they have been rich for decades and did that when they were middle aged rich too.

 

[gregjrichards]

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...ion-into-barry-and-honey-shermans-deaths.html

I don’t blame them to be honest the whole tragedy is like a plot in an episode of Columbo just totally bizarre but unfortunately it is real life and desperately sad. I would want answers too and would not be happy with the police leaking information.

 

[gregjrichards]

I have long time friends like this. I don't think that they are billionaires, but they are multi, multi millionaires. They buy all generic label food and household items. Once when I was moving from a house that I had lived in for almost forty years, I had a pile of old threadbare towels that I was throwing out, when my friend asked could she have them because her husband would use them as grease rags on their boat, but when I stayed with them in their really expensive waterfront home, one of them was hanging on the towel rail in a bathroom.
The husband drives a 15 year old station wagon, for local errands, although the wife always has a late model car. My friend buys very expensive shoes and handbags, but not expensive clothing.
They fly economy class, often with numerous stops to get the cheapest airfare. They are 72 and 75, but they have been rich for decades and did that when they were middle aged rich too.

I can believe it. The older man that owns IKEA, who is multi-billionaire and one of the richest men in the world, lives in a normal house, drives an old Volvo and eats in his local IKEA because it is low cost.

 

[Jennifer17]

I don’t blame them to be honest the whole tragedy is like a plot in an episode of Columbo just totally bizarre but unfortunately it is real life and desperately sad. I would want answers too and would not be happy with the police leaking information.

And I don't blame them either, but I am not sure that if it does turn out to be murder/suicide that they will accept it. Mind you, they have don't have to, and if it helps them to deal with it, it hurts no one, as long as they let it lie.

 

[Jackeee]

I don’t blame them to be honest the whole tragedy is like a plot in an episode of Columbo just totally bizarre but unfortunately it is real life and desperately sad. I would want answers too and would not be happy with the police leaking information.

Will the TPS investigation continue even though the family have their own investigator on it now? I’m just trying to understand who will be doing what.

 

[Kaley Smith]

I did not watch the service, but I did read some quotes from the adult children, and a brief news-clip. I do feel for them: it must be incredibly difficult and traumatic to lose not just one, but both parents, so suddenly and under such alarming circumstances.

At the same time, I am mystified as to why they held a funeral service for six thousand. I don't think heads of state have so many people on the attendee list. (Princess Diana's funeral had two thousand, I think - obviously millions around the world watched on television.) Why not have a regular, intimate service for a much smaller audience of truly close family and friends? Startling to see that kind of spectacle.

Anyway, aside from the above, I am not sure if this has been earlier discussed, as I simply cannot read through all 96 (!) pages of this thread, but I think what is of more interest beyond whether there had been "signs of forced entry", is whether or not all doors/windows/any possible exits of the house were secured upon discovery. If so, that makes things quite interesting... If it was a double-murder, the perpetrator(s) would have had to have either locked the door behind them, or perhaps, if there was such a thing installed, the door would have had a mechanism to lock automatically upon closing. I know someone who has that installed on their door. But if there was no such mechanism, that means there is someone who had a key - whether they had obtained one through the Shermans providing one to them voluntarily, or had surreptitiously obtained one - OR they took it from the Shermans after they died.

Obviously, we will not know this answer, and many others, for some time (if at all), but to me that is worth pondering.

Well, it's kind of a Canadian thing to televise funerals of murdered RCMP officers, famous hockey players and other very well-known people. I don't consider it a spectacle. The number of people attending doesn't surprise me as the couple helped so many folks. We attend a lot of funerals. I'm sure I've been to about 150 or so by now, if not 200. The funeral of just an average, common person often has to be moved into the largest church around or a community hall with a high capacity.

 

[kiwi50]

For such a long memorial service, there was a lot unsaid, I didn’t get the impression the siblings were very close to each other, but I guess there was such a big age gap between them all.

 

[gregjrichards]

And I don't blame them either, but I am not sure that if it does turn out to be murder/suicide that they will accept it. Mind you, they have don't have to, and if it helps them to deal with it, it hurts no one, as long as they let it lie.

It will be interesting to see what happens I hope they get the truth.

Will the TPS investigation continue even though the family have their own investigator on it now? I’m just trying to understand who will be doing what.

Toronto law enforcement will have to investigate thoroughly to determine for sure who is responsible. I don’t know how much involvement the private investigator will have with them not much I would imagine.

For such a long memorial service, there was a lot unsaid, I didn’t get the impression the siblings were very close to each other, but I guess there was such a big age gap between them all.

They are grieving and in shock and likely not their usual selves. Your parents are not supposed to die in these circumstances and you don’t anticipate grieving for them both at the same time. I just hope there isn’t a fight about the will looming too.

 

[dotr]

Will the TPS investigation continue even though the family have their own investigator on it now? I’m just trying to understand who will be doing what.

https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/...ord-of-high-profile-death-investigations.html
Dec. 19 2017

[h=1]Veteran cop leading Sherman probe has track record of high-profile death investigations[/h]Det.-Sgt. Susan Gomes is the lead investigator now examining the suspicious deaths of billionaires Barry and Honey Sherman.

 

[Jennifer17]

Well, it's kind of a Canadian thing to televise funerals of murdered RCMP officers, famous hockey players and other very well-known people. I don't consider it a spectacle. The number of people attending doesn't surprise me as the couple helped so many folks. We attend a lot of funerals. I'm sure I've been to about 150 or so by now, if not 200. The funeral of just an average, common person often has to be moved into the largest church around or a community hall with a high capacity.

I don't do funerals, unless they are very, very close family members or a really close friend. I don't really get people going to a funeral of someone they did not know or was just an acquaintance.