Canada - Christine Jessop, 9, Queensville, Ont, 3 Oct 1984 *killer identified* #3

[photographer4]

I said from day one that whoever the perp was...had to know of that location on Concession 4.... or know the people that owned the,property.
I will not believe he randomly picked it.
I hope we find out the answer.

No way he randomly found that spot while driving around with an abducted kid in his car! Wondering, did he do wiring there for work perhaps? Did the trailer at the site have TV wired? Anything? He knew that particular spot for some reason. I hope we find out.

 

[photographer4]

Our GlobalTV Canada interview with them a few weeks ago and what KJ said: "“There were three people my mother told that morning we went to visit my dad in jail and that Christine wasn’t coming,” he said, adding he had forgotten that his mother had told Hoover’s wife."
Okay, going by the above statement it is unclear if they mentioned Hoover's wife at the time being 'in the know' but surely LE at the time would've found out/been told about the friendship between the 2 families somehow, and checked into the Hoovers as their kids would visit back and forth? I would think LE would have seen CH in the course of events such as the search itself, the funeral, etc. etc.

Probably b/c he attended for search, funeral and wake. No way police didn't see him!

 

[photographer4]

In the quoted text above, it notes the DNA samples were provided consensually. I wonder if the issue is not whether CH flew under the radar somehow, but rather, that he wasn't willing to come in for a finger-prick?

If he'd declined the finger print, surely LE would have gotten a warrant to collect it - that would have certainly put more eyes on him as a potential suspect. So what was he like that police didn't notice him?

 

[Andreee]

If he'd declined the finger print, surely LE would have gotten a warrant to collect it - that would have certainly put more eyes on him as a potential suspect. So what was he like that police didn't notice him?

Yes, and I believe Hoover and his wife lived near or in Toronto at the time, so there's that. But they were close family friends regardless! It sounds like the family didn't suspect CH either, nor his wife as far as we know. But I can't help but think that if it were one of us here on WS, that we would've been

No way he randomly found that spot while driving around with an abducted kid in his car! Wondering, did he do wiring there for work perhaps? Did the trailer at the site have TV wired? Anything? He knew that particular spot for some reason. I hope we find out.

I can't remember now, what were Calvin Hoover's jobs?

 

[jobo]

Sorry I just have that Hoover’s wife worked at Eastern Independent Telecom with Mr Jessop.

 

[Tadpole12]

Was that the way her bike was found? It’s propped nicely up here.

wrt photo of bike:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/jessop-house-with-bike-jpg.27052/


I think the photo is screen captured from a CBC news program.
Staged.

Christine Jessop

"When Janet and Ken Jessop arrived home at about 4:10 pm, they saw Christine’s bicycle where she normally kept it – but it was in a fallen state with some minor damage. Her book bag was on the kitchen counter, as well as the mail."

? Does it look like the kick stand is a single kick stand on the left hand side of the bike?

 

[Tealgrove]

In the quoted text above, it notes the DNA samples were provided consensually. I wonder if the issue is not whether CH flew under the radar somehow, but rather, that he wasn't willing to come in for a finger-prick?

Honestly, I don't think he was ever asked. I think he flew under the radar, was never on the radar, and when his name came up as the match to DNA they all asked a collective "WHO?"

I hate kicking LE, but in this case, it was a bad scene from Day 1. They honed in on one person and never looked beyond.

Thank God for DNA. If not for this technology GPM would still be sitting in jail.

MOO

 

[Forest_Wood]

In the quoted text above, it notes the DNA samples were provided consensually. I wonder if the issue is not whether CH flew under the radar somehow, but rather, that he wasn't willing to come in for a finger-prick?

I find it disturbing that LE would not make it mandatory for all POI to have they’re finger pricked in a murder investigation. I wonder if that was because DNA was a new technology at that time? Do we know if this policy has changed over the years?

 

[Forest_Wood]

"When Janet and Ken Jessop arrived home at about 4:10 pm, they saw Christine’s bicycle where she normally kept it – but it was in a fallen state with some minor damage. Her book bag was on the kitchen counter, as well as the mail."

? Does it look like the kick stand is a single kick stand on the left hand side of the bike?

Yes, it looks like a single kickstand to me on the left side. I wonder why the bike was moved for the photo if they found it “in a fallen state”.

 

[MistyWaters]

Honestly, I don't think he was ever asked. I think he flew under the radar, was never on the radar, and when his name came up as the match to DNA they all asked a collective "WHO?"

I hate kicking LE, but in this case, it was a bad scene from Day 1. They honed in on one person and never looked beyond.

Thank God for DNA. If not for this technology GPM would still be sitting in jail.

MOO

Yeah I agree. He just wasn’t in the radar. I think we’re reading too much into the DNA of 325 men. This would’ve occurred after 1995 when DNA science became a crime solving method and the 325 probably included every known sexual offender who’d ever lived in the area. It’s not clearly stated how many of the 325 were “family, friends or neighbours” but obviously CH wasn’t one of them. We already know he was never considered a suspect.

While it’s now known there was a family connection, we don’t know how close of a connection LE was made aware of 10 years later when the search for another suspect began. Nothing else has come to light to indicate it should’ve been known CH was a pedophilic predator, only in hindsight.

I’m curious if at the time LE was informed of the phone conversation with HH , CJ crying in the background. That seems a very clear memory compared to Mrs Jessop not initially recognizing CHs name when the DNA match was confirmed. So IMO it’s not totally out of the realm she only remembered this after CH was identified or possibly she’s only now suggesting it as a possibility, trying to think back over 36 years.

JMO

 

[deugirtni]

I find it disturbing that LE would not make it mandatory for all POI to have they’re finger pricked in a murder investigation. I wonder if that was because DNA was a new technology at that time? Do we know if this policy has changed over the years?

I think they have to get a warrant to collect DNA, unless it is consented to on a voluntary basis. Jmo. I would think it might raise an eyebrow or two however, if someone known to the family refused, which should hopefully have prompted a further look? I guess he was never asked. Would be nice to know how he fell so far below LE's radar though.

 

[deugirtni]

Yeah I agree. He just wasn’t in the radar. I think we’re reading too much into the DNA of 325 men. This would’ve occurred after 1995 when DNA science became a crime solving method and the 325 probably included every known sexual offender who’d ever lived in the area. It’s not clearly stated how many of the 325 were “family, friends or neighbours” but obviously CH wasn’t one of them. We already know he was never considered a suspect.

While it’s now known there was a family connection, we don’t know how close of a connection LE was made aware of 10 years later when the search for another suspect began. Nothing else has come to light to indicate it should’ve been known CH was a pedophilic predator, only in hindsight.

I’m curious if at the time LE was informed of the phone conversation with HH , CJ crying in the background. That seems a very clear memory compared to Mrs Jessop not initially recognizing CHs name when the DNA match was confirmed. So IMO it’s not totally out of the realm she only remembered this after CH was identified or possibly she’s only now suggesting it as a possibility, trying to think back over 36 years.

JMO

The connection was with CH's wife..is it possible they (any of them) failed to consider CH simply because he was a spouse of a connection and they didn't live in the area?

 

[Tealgrove]

The connection was with CH's wife..is it possible they (any of them) failed to consider CH simply because he was a spouse of a connection and they didn't live in the area?

Absolutely.

 

[casesensitive]

I find it disturbing that LE would not make it mandatory for all POI to have they’re finger pricked in a murder investigation. I wonder if that was because DNA was a new technology at that time? Do we know if this policy has changed over the years?

The legal restrictions for LE to collect DNA samples in 1998 is outlined in the following link. It is unbelievable that Canada passed a bill that prohibited police from attaining DNA samples unless a perp had been charged with at least two murders or two rapes. This explains why lead investigator Tweedy asked for voluntary DNA samples in Christine's case, and why he presented his objections along with other police forces and their attorneys in the Senate hearings for Bill C-3, fourteen years after CJ's murder when he got her case. I don't know what year this bill was amended. I have spent many hours in the past trying to figure out the justice system rulings and updates on DNA protocol and it is a nightmare to follow.

I did learn much later that police cannot ask a judge to issue a DNA warrant unless they have sound evidence that the person is a viable suspect, which is hard to prove during an ongoing investigation. LE are now allowed to gather DNA samples surreptitiously to test, and if a match is found, they can ask for a DNA warrant.

The only evidence from CJ"s murder was DNA which never produced a match, and we see how difficult it is to even legally enter samples into the system if a person hasn't been charged, or is just a suspect. Even if CH was acknowledged as a family contact, it seems that he wasn't asked to provide a voluntary sample. TPS will have his name in the files if he had been noted as such. I suspect he wasn't on the list, based on Mrs. Jessop not remembering who he was, and Kenny never once considering him, despite his years of tireless research. jmo

Senate of Canada - Committees

 

[Tadpole12]

Real Justice: Guilty of Being Weird

"The house looked quiet when Janet and Ken arrived home. Janet pulled the car to a stop in front of the shed leading to the back door. Christine's bike was lying on it's side in the shed. ... What really concerned her was the kickstand on her daughter's bike was bent."

 

[Arnie M]

That is a head scratcher .... a kickstand swings up and toward the back of the bike .... it will not swing forward.

If it was in the down position and the bike was pushed backward into a curb or something it could bend , but a little girl is not normally that strong or aggressive to do something like that .... even for an adult it would not be so easy to do. Bikes were built fairly strong in that era.

 

[Forest_Wood]

I did learn much later that police cannot ask a judge to issue a DNA warrant unless they have sound evidence that the person is a viable suspect, which is hard to prove during an ongoing investigation. LE are now allowed to gather DNA samples surreptitiously to test, and if a match is found, they can ask for a DNA warrant.

Thank you for this information and the link Casesensitive! It’s interesting to note that LE assigned a female officer to the band practice of GPM in order to get a strand of his hair. I can only imagine how humiliating it must have felt for GPM when he thought she was a hairstyling student and she tricked him to get a sample, likely by offering him a free haircut. Later, he saw her at the police station. You can see the pain of those emotions when he recounted that years later to a reporter.

Still today, it hasn’t seemed to change much. We hear at trials how they’ve tricked people into getting their DNA. One example is having them lick an envelope after telling them they’d won a prize and they must fill out a form and send the envelope back.

So it’s ok for them to trick suspects or POI by accessing their DNA secretly, but it’s not ok to access it “officially”. Seems so backwards.

 

[musicaljoke]

That is a head scratcher .... a kickstand swings up and toward the back of the bike .... it will not swing forward.

If it was in the down position and the bike was pushed backward into a curb or something it could bend , but a little girl is not normally that strong or aggressive to do something like that .... even for an adult it would not be so easy to do. Bikes were built fairly strong in that era.

I'm trying to come up with a scenario that could explain a bent kickstand, and it's very difficult. Does this idea work? If a person has just hopped onto their bike and not yet released the kick stand, then someone behind the bike, grabs the bike from the back and pulls it toward them, could the kickstand be bent?

Does the bent kickstand suggest that Christine was trying to get away from her captor?

It's really hard to find a way to bend the kickstand without damaging the bike, so it may be a significant detail.

 

[deugirtni]

The kickstand could've been bent long before disappearance day, but nobody had occasion to notice. Imo

 

[deugirtni]

Thank you for this information and the link Casesensitive! It’s interesting to note that LE assigned a female officer to the band practice of GPM in order to get a strand of his hair. I can only imagine how humiliating it must have felt for GPM when he thought she was a hairstyling student and she tricked him to get a sample, likely by offering him a free haircut. Later, he saw her at the police station. You can see the pain of those emotions when he recounted that years later to a reporter.

Still today, it hasn’t seemed to change much. We hear at trials how they’ve tricked people into getting their DNA. One example is having them lick an envelope after telling them they’d won a prize and they must fill out a form and send the envelope back.

So it’s ok for them to trick suspects or POI by accessing their DNA secretly, but it’s not ok to access it “officially”. Seems so backwards.

That really IS bizarre when you think about it. I can see how it would be legal to tail someone in the hopes of fetching a cup they see the person discard, or to bag a cup after offering them a drink at the police station during questioning, etc., but for an officer to trick them when they knew they wouldn't be able to get it by way of a warrant, seems just wrong. Imo