Canada - Christine Jessop, 9, Queensville, Ont, 3 Oct 1984 *killer identified* #3

[Truth Prevails]

From what we have heard, I'm not sure why it is even relevant about the mom and brother going to visit the dad in jail that day. It was said that the brother had a dental appointment afterward, and THEN they even went shopping and bought him a watch. So where does the jail visit even come into play here? What is the reason the mom and brother couldn't have been home in time for CJ arriving home from school? (I'm not sure what time they arrived home?) It makes sense that if someone came across CJ and asked where her parents are, she perhaps may have mentioned, visiting my dad in jail, and that person would've had the opportunity to say, well come with me and we'll also go visit him.. but to use the jail visit as a preplanned event knowing CJ would arrive home to an empty house just doesn't make sense. imo.

No one outside a small circle was supposed to know that Mr. Jessop had been convicted and sentenced to two years in prison. The story was he was away for work purposes or work training, something like that. Apparently, even Christine at such a young age would have understood this.

The actual time they arrived home is debatable. It was quite likely "altered" at one point to help achieve a conviction.

My understanding is that Mrs. Jessop herself had been frequently left alone as a child so saw no harm in it, especially for half an hour or so.

IIRC, they went shopping and had lunch first, then the visit, then the dental appointment. Mrs. Jessop dropped her son off at the dentist's; rushed around paying a few bills; returned to the dentist's office to pick him up. They got running late at the last minute due to traffic, or whatever.

 

[Truth Prevails]

but to use the jail visit as a preplanned event knowing CJ would arrive home to an empty house just doesn't make sense. imo.

Sorry to split this up like this, but I ran out of edit time and would like to add to my comment on this point.

I think it was most likely that Hoover knew the family well and somehow knew details from the phone conversation between his wife and Christine's mother. He was a predator waiting for an opportunity to get Christine alone and realized the potential when it presented itself.

If Mrs. Jessop had been home when he arrived all he had to do was say he was simply dropping in to see how things were going. No suspicions would have been raised and he probably would have sat back and waited for the next opportunity.

 

[MistyWaters]

There were other possible suspects - involving weak alibis and opportunity. This article was first written in 1995. Had it not been for technological advancements of DNA which freed GPM, highly likely one of them might’ve been the next wrongful conviction. More than just GPM must be relieved this case is finally closed, noticing how an unsolved murder can cast shadows over innocent people’s lives. It’s probably a good thing for them SM wasn’t humming back in those days although that still wouldn’t have prevented local rumours.

Who murdered Christine Jessop? With Guy Paul Morin cleared, police tackle a fresh probe

 

[Forest_Wood]

I'm not saying they should've known it was CH, or been able to prove it. I'm simply saying that as far as I have understood how things work, LE starts with the immediate family, and works their way out from there. To me, considering CH's relationship with the Jessops at that time, he should've been included in the first round of interviews, along with his wife. Maybe I'm naive, but it's my belief that police can sometimes get ahead in an investigation, during interviews, seeing as something might be said to put up a red flag or whatever, making it seem the person might be worthy of further looking into. If they had simply interviewed him at the time, and nothing came of it, at least it would be there in the files, as to why he wasn't ever considered any further.

I agree! According to the CBC article, the police interviewed HH the very next day after Christine disappeared. There seemed a sense of urgency to speak with her. Was she a person of interest? And according to HH, she was asked "every question possible”.

Given that CH had the same kind of relationship with the Jessop family as HH did, why stop at interviewing only HH and not include an interview with her husband. If they asked her every question possible, why didn’t they have the same questions for CH. He was also a friend, a coworker, and Christine had been to their home 2 days before.

I don’t know if LE knew at that time if he also had free access to the Jessop’s home. They focused on HH and put no apparent focus on CH. This makes me think she gave him an alibi and they believed her without checking further. What could have disqualified him from being questioned the following day? His name was listed in LE's notes though. (moo). This was also long before GPM was a suspect. So they hadn’t had tunnel vision yet.

"Sgt. Raymond Bunce of the York Regional Police Service interviewed Heather the day after Christine Jessop disappeared. Heather said police asked her "every question possible."

 

[Satchie]

I agree! According to the CBC article, the police interviewed HH the very next day after Christine disappeared. There seemed a sense of urgency to speak with her. Was she a person of interest? And according to HH, she was asked "every question possible”.

Given that CH had the same kind of relationship with the Jessop family as HH did, why stop at interviewing only HH and not include an interview with her husband. If they asked her every question possible, why didn’t they have the same questions for CH. He was also a friend, a coworker, and Christine had been to their home 2 days before.

I don’t know if LE knew at that time if he also had free access to the Jessop’s home. They focused on HH and put no apparent focus on CH. This makes me think she gave him an alibi and they believed her without checking further. What could have disqualified him from being questioned the following day? His name was listed in LE's notes though. (moo). This was also long before GPM was a suspect. So they hadn’t had tunnel vision yet.

"Sgt. Raymond Bunce of the York Regional Police Service interviewed Heather the day after Christine Jessop disappeared. Heather said police asked her "every question possible."

IMO, precisely because it was so early in the investigation, they would not have been looking for a suspect. A suspect for what? They didn't even know a crime had been committed! IMO, they would have been primarily looking for Christine herself, who, at that stage, could have very likely been a runaway.

If I were in the position of LE, I'd have interviewed HH as an observant, close friend of the family, in order to get an outsider's perspective on the family itself: each of the family members (are they reliable, how did they treat Christine, what kind of person was she, how did she behave around her family and strangers? ), and then also the circumstances of the whole situation (father in jail, etc). They probably interviewed her teachers, and the parents of her friends, and her friends, in case she had talked about somewhere she liked to go hide, etc.

Unfortunately, you can't just believe everything a mother says, you do need corroboration. And then, did HH have any facts or suspicions to share that might help the investigation. If she'd said "I noticed my husband leering at her, and he's acting weird, and I bet he abducted, raped, killed her and left her somewhere where she won't be found", you bet they'd have interviewed him.

 

[Tadpole12]

"every question possible" but not until CJ's body was discovered on December 31 did that Queensville-Sunderland connection come to focus.

 

[Forest_Wood]

IMO, precisely because it was so early in the investigation, they would not have been looking for a suspect. A suspect for what? They didn't even know a crime had been committed! IMO, they would have been primarily looking for Christine herself, who, at that stage, could have very likely been a runaway.

If I were in the position of LE, I'd have interviewed HH as an observant, close friend of the family, in order to get an outsider's perspective on the family itself: each of the family members (are they reliable, how did they treat Christine, what kind of person was she, how did she behave around her family and strangers? ), and then also the circumstances of the whole situation (father in jail, etc). They probably interviewed her teachers, and the parents of her friends, and her friends, in case she had talked about somewhere she liked to go hide, etc.

Unfortunately, you can't just believe everything a mother says, you do need corroboration. And then, did HH have any facts or suspicions to share that might help the investigation. If she'd said "I noticed my husband leering at her, and he's acting weird, and I bet he abducted, raped, killed her and left her somewhere where she won't be found", you bet they'd have interviewed him.

What you describe makes a lot of sense. I hadn’t considered that they weren’t seeking a killer that soon. And by the time they did, it seems CH wasn’t even on the radar.

 

[Vern]

I agree! According to the CBC article, the police interviewed HH the very next day after Christine disappeared. There seemed a sense of urgency to speak with her. Was she a person of interest? And according to HH, she was asked "every question possible”.

Given that CH had the same kind of relationship with the Jessop family as HH did, why stop at interviewing only HH and not include an interview with her husband. If they asked her every question possible, why didn’t they have the same questions for CH. He was also a friend, a coworker, and Christine had been to their home 2 days before.

I don’t know if LE knew at that time if he also had free access to the Jessop’s home. They focused on HH and put no apparent focus on CH. This makes me think she gave him an alibi and they believed her without checking further. What could have disqualified him from being questioned the following day? His name was listed in LE's notes though. (moo). This was also long before GPM was a suspect. So they hadn’t had tunnel vision yet.

"Sgt. Raymond Bunce of the York Regional Police Service interviewed Heather the day after Christine Jessop disappeared. Heather said police asked her "every question possible."

They questioned her the very next day because she was one of the two individuals who knew Christine would be alone that day. Her and Mr. Jessop's boss. Perhaps she wasn't aware that her husband may have overheard the conversation and she didn't tell him of it ... so no cause for concern/suspicion there on her part of her husband.

IMO police ask something akin to:
"Did you tell anyone about this conversation that Christine would not be going on the visit?"
Answer: "No".
Police: "Anyone overhear it?"
Answer "I don't think so."
Police: "Your husband?"
Answer: "He was at work yesterday".

 

[Tadpole12]

Wrt CH's vehicle,

'Just pure evil': The downfall of Christine Jessop's killer, Calvin Hoover

"As for what vehicle he was driving around the time of the abduction, Toronto police's acting Det. Sgt. Steve Smith said there's information about someone calling in a tip about a silver Datsun with a rounded roof being seen in Queensville the day of Jessop's abduction.
In reality, Hoover owned a 1980 Grey Pontiac Phoenix, a compact vehicle that resembles the Datsun"
(photo of 2 door vehicle)

Photo from cardomain.com
1980 pontiac phoenix 2 door silver grey cardomain.comphoto - Google Search


Wondering what color/ type of car Yvette Devine had seen. Is it specified somewhere?

Canada: Kaufman Commission - Guy Paul Morin - Police - Investigation by York Police

"Hypnosis had been undergone by some witnesses, such as Yvette Devine, M's sister, who had seen a suspicious car in the driveway at the Jessop residence on the day of CJ's disappearance, in order to recall details of the licence plate."

 

[sibyl3]

'Just pure evil': The downfall of Christine Jessop's killer, Calvin Hoover
Jeremy Grimaldi writes:
“While the Toronto native's name was mentioned more than once in the Jessop homicide case file — including when his wife, Heather, told investigators he was taking care of their kids and had nothing to add to her statement — he was never actually questioned.”
Does this mean Heather Hoover provided Calvin Hoover with an alibi?!?! Am I understanding this correctly? Did she tell police he was taking care of their kids when Christine was abducted??!!

No, she said he was taking care of the kids when they questioned her.

 

[Truth Prevails]

What you describe makes a lot of sense. I hadn’t considered that they weren’t seeking a killer that soon. And by the time they did, it seems CH wasn’t even on the radar.

Until her remains were found, they were seeking the abductor or abductors of a tiny 9-year-old-girl. Even though they managed to royally muddle this case, they weren't naive.

The very first night, with Christine's mother acting so calm, a neighbour took a police officer aside and asked him how serious they thought this case was; serious enough to search for example, and law enforcement immediately said yes.

That neighbour got the community together to begin the first searches for Christine.

I don't think anyone ever believed she had simply run away.

Law enforcement even contemplated the involvement of Christine's father. They thought perhaps he had planned her disappearance to facilitate an early release.

Oh, yeah, if they didn't have any suspects at that point, they were looking.

And then when Christine's remains were found, due to the location, a new police jurisdiction became involved. They supposedly re-started the investigation from the beginning, questioning everyone again.

But HH only had one interview and that was it, I guess.

 

[Satchie]

Until her remains were found, they were seeking the abductor or abductors of a tiny 9-year-old-girl. Even though they managed to royally muddle this case, they weren't naive.

The very first night, with Christine's mother acting so calm, a neighbour took a police officer aside and asked him how serious they thought this case was; serious enough to search for example, and law enforcement immediately said yes.

That neighbour got the community together to begin the first searches for Christine.

I don't think anyone ever believed she had simply run away.

Law enforcement even contemplated the involvement of Christine's father. They thought perhaps he had planned her disappearance to facilitate an early release.

Oh, yeah, if they didn't have any suspects at that point, they were looking.

And then when Christine's remains were found, due to the location, a new police jurisdiction became involved. They supposedly re-started the investigation from the beginning, questioning everyone again.

But HH only had one interview and that was it, I guess.

Yes certainly, as people, I'm sure officers were very concerned and imagined such scenarios. But IMO, as police officers, they are bound by the principles of modern criminal investigation, and the first stage is to gather evidence to determine whether a crime has been committed. That means facts, nit fears and suspicions. Only then can you proceed to investigating who the perperator might be.

 

[Tadpole12]

I wonder who is in possession of CH's knife/knives, and if it could be dna tested wrt other cases?

 

[Deleted member 275109]

I wonder who is in possession of CH's knife/knives, and if it could be dna tested wrt other cases?

Fantastic idea! Never thought of that. Possibly other tools could be tested as well.

 

[photographer4]

Fantastic idea! Never thought of that. Possibly other tools could be tested as well.

That is a great idea! I'd wonder too what became of his car (did he have one when he suicided)? But since he suicided so long ago, maybe no one was able to track his things / items of possible interest down to conduct such testing / examination?

Have LE ever figured out what his connect was to where CJ was eventually found? Had he done work there? Known someone in the area? It still seems an unusual place for him to have just happened upon with an abductee in his car!

 

[Forest_Wood]

That is a great idea! I'd wonder too what became of his car (did he have one when he suicided)? But since he suicided so long ago, maybe no one was able to track his things / items of possible interest down to conduct such testing / examination?

Have LE ever figured out what his connect was to where CJ was eventually found? Had he done work there? Known someone in the area? It still seems an unusual place for him to have just happened upon with an abductee in his car!

It seems CH knew the back area well around there due to hanging out with his old school friend.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/christine-jessop-killer-dna-interview-1.5903381

"Killer's connection to Sunderland, Ont.
Christine Jessop's body was found in a field in Sunderland, Ont., approximately 100 kilometres northeast of Toronto, on New Year's Eve, three months after she disappeared. Police have since learned that Calvin Hoover had an old school friend who lived in Sunderland.

"We know that Calvin used to visit him at least semi-regularly to do some outdoor activities up there. They'd go back in the bush together," said Det. Sgt. Steve Smith, the lead investigator on the case. "We believe that's how [Hoover] was familiar with where Christine's body was left."

Smith said police have no reason to believe the friend, who has since died, was connected to Christine's murder in any way."

 

[Deleted member 275109]

No one had any reason to believe it was Hoover either until recently.

 

[MistyWaters]

No one had any reason to believe it was Hoover either until recently.

It was known to be the man’s property where the body was found while he was still alive, that wasn’t learned just recently.

One of the questions I wonder about is why CH didn’t go back and bury the body somewhere so she’d never be found. The only answer I can think of, he was confident nobody would ever connect him. Other than through DNA, a technology which hadn’t been invented at that time, nobody did.

 

[Deleted member 275109]

So the property owner had this dead child appear on his property. His friend Calvin and his wife, were friends with the child’s parents. The property owner didn’t see a coincidence? Didn’t think to mention it to the police? Do I understand this correctly?

 

[MistyWaters]

So the property owner had this dead child appear on his property. His friend Calvin and his wife, were friends with the child’s parents. The property owner didn’t see a coincidence? Didn’t think to mention it to the police? Do I understand this correctly?

Probably not because the family and LE were convinced GPM was the killer. It wasn’t until more than 10 years later that he was exonerated by DNA. I think we all agree it was a botched investigation from the very beginning, for many reasons. GPM fit the profile of the most likely suspect, not even the family suspected CH - an example the perpetrator is not always the obvious.