Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #22

[cdnjan]

Haha Sue is my neighbour.

It’s been a couple years since I’ve driven that section but the highway in general is 90km/hr. But very few people do that. Lots of windy sections for sure and wildlife, especially bison are around the hot springs.

But there are also some sections you can speed it up, and in summer when it’s almost always light out, it’s doable. 110-120km/hr is the norm on the Hwy for most people. Tourists however...

ahh Small world that is so neat about Sue, she takes beautiful pics. Thank You Sprucetip for your input most helpful. Always! (Then there is the tourists hauling trailers and rv's etc lol)

 

[sprucetip]

SBM - I'm curious too about Whitehorse as I didn't think they made it there when theorizing. I didn't think they made it before the murders nor planned to even go there there for work so I was shocked they got there period.

Maybe they heard of 'Highway of Tears' and other 'titled' murders and wanted their notoriety to be the 'Alaska Highway Killers'.

Agree, the cowboy hat was hokey and looked costumey... definitely draws more attention. I seriously think they were in movie/game zone. Maybe they did watch Thelma & Louise and this was Bryer's Brad Pitt moment (Brad wore a cowboy hat in the movie). I'm joking... but I couldn't help make the connection!

Maybe, that’s certainly a way to be remembered, their own highway.

I definitely didn’t think they made it up here. I thought for sure that someone would have spoken up if they’d seen them.

Trying to make sense of the mapped times supplied in the report...

2019/07/15 1:50 Liard Hot Springs, BC
2019/07/15 3:25 Watson Lake, YT

The times in the middle of the night must be highway cams.

1hr 35 minutes it took for them to get from Liard to Watson Lake.. (google estimates 2hr 49 minutes)

2019/07/15 16:00 Whitehorse, YT
2019/07/16 14:30 M’Clintock River, YT
2019/07/17 18:27 Whitehorse YT
2019/07/17 23:40 Haines Junction, YT

2019/07/18 15:03 Dease Lake, BC

Is it doable that they could make it from HJ to Dease without any gas stops? If they speed like they seem to have done from Liars to Watson they must burn gas fast. It seems odd that they present/have surveillance showing multiple locations leading up to the 17th and then no other Hwy cams or stops between HJ and Dease. Estimating at about a 9 hour drive and 16ish hours unaccounted for.

Was it stated in the presser that the Dease Lake time recorded was them with the RAM or the RAV?
(ETA: On July 19, 2019 at approximately 7:19 a.m RAM is reported on fire)

2019/07/19 11:38 Kitwanga, BC
Kitwanga is almost 7 hours from Dease Lake (Maybe 5 if they speed?) so possible time if leaving Dease directly between 4:30/6:30am if speeding for an 11:30 arrival.

Definitely need a gas stop between HJ and Dease Lake. But maybe they had multiple jerry cans?

I also just noticed a discrepancy in the July 16, 14:30 time. In the report it says it’s km 1435 but in the list you posted and at the bottom of the report it says M’Clintock River. Those are two different spots and would explain why they said it was ‘east’ of Whitehorse. Km 1435 isn’t but M’Clintock River is. There seem to be so many mistakes, which makes me have even less faith in the RCMP and this investigation.

ETA: their route on the 14-16th is driving me crazy. So they got to Whitehorse on the 15th, then less than 24hrs later they were headed back south, where they came from (spotted at M’Clintock River). It’s a good 20-30 mins to that spot from town.

But when the supervisor saw them with the hood up, they were now facing north again. Did they come to whitehorse just to get away from the scene, then try to go back? And then something happened that made them head north again? Maybe they heard something on the news by then that spooked them. Then maybe they just kept driving north and ended up past HJ. Perhaps they actually pulled out a map then and realized they could take the Cassiar back down and avoid the murder scene altogether and have a ton of options one where to go. Unlike where they were past HJ.

 

[sprucetip]

Another thing about speed - they were fleeing a murder scene so maybe they just wanted to get away as fast as possible. And put as much distance between them and the scene as possible.

Also, they probably figured out by then that police presence is minimal on the Hwy AND all resources were headed to the scene, so maybe they thought it was ok to risk it and speed?

 

[Iwondertoo]

I could see the speeding because it was the middle of the night on open highway. They could clock 140-160kmh in that beast I’m guessing, but it would burn a lot of gas. If a bear or moose or deer came out of nowhere that would have been hard to avoid at those speeds. I wonder if anything like that happened.

With all due respect, you may be confused about what a Canadian 'highway' is.

We call it a highway because it's the major route within towns. It doesn't necessarily mean it has pavement or passing lanes, especially up north. Clocking anything close to 140 km an hour just doesn't happen anywhere on that trip up north. (Actually, you couldn't expect to get away with 140 kmh anywhere in BC. Our roads aren't built to sustain that - maybe for a reason?)

Everyone driving up there is watchful for wildlife I would think.. Tourists take it slow because that's why they are visiting there. I'm thinking the average is 60 kmh. They enjoy it and the roads are built for that speed.

I agree that KM made great time driving up to Whitehorse.

It does make me wonder about stimulants.

JMO

 

[JudgeJudi]

This actually makes me a little worried about AS. He is mentally ill, jobless, homeless. He lost his father and now his son. I really do hope he is getting some help because I fear once all this really hits him, which I don't believe it has, I feel like he may be suicidal.

I share your concerns and wouldn't be at all surprised if he is feeling suicidal already. If he is, hopefully he's getting some form of treatment, but somehow I rather doubt it. He has no-one in his life now at all. The fact that no-one in the family contacted him at the outset when the teens were missing shows how fractured the family really is. To learn this via the media and then that BS was a suspect would have been devastating. To now have to live with the knowledge that BS confessed to one or more of the murders could easily push him over the edge.

Whether people like it or not, let's face it, who else does he have to turn to but the media. Keeping his grief bottled up inside will only make him more unstable than he already is. We only know his side of the story and it doesn't sit well with a lot of people here.

We don't know why his marriage broke down in the first place, and that could have been at the root of his mental problems. I haven't read that he was a bad husband or father prior to his divorce. Many fathers commit suicide after a marriage breakdown and they lose access to their children. There are always two sides to every story and we've only heard one.

All I can say is, people are always talking about empathy on WS, so I'm surprised at the lack of empathy for a man who's so obviously badly broken. It's just sad.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Even psychopathic people have a history and signs of such. Even if they aren't recognized right away.

And some psychopaths with an enormous history never exhibit any signs. How about Dennis Rader aka BTK who murdered 10 people over the course of 17 years.

He was hiding in plain sight and obviously no-one saw any signs. He was married for 34 years, had two children, became a Boy Scout leader and served as president of Christ Lutheran Church.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Here's the thing though, how do they know both guns were fired at the Lucas and Chynna scene?

A gun barrel will produce individual markings as the bullet passes through, and it is these unique markings that an examiner evaluates to determine whether a given bullet was fired from a particular firearm.

 

[CanadianSleuther]

share your concerns and wouldn't be at all surprised if he is feeling suicidal already. If he is, hopefully he's getting some form of treatment, but somehow I rather doubt it. He has no-one in his life now at all. The fact that no-one in the family contacted him at the outset when the teens were missing shows how fractured the family really is.

I think he's surviving on adrenaline. I'm actually really glad he has a lawyer who seemingly has compassion for him. I think in one article he said he had family in other parts of the country. I hope they had at least privately reached out to him. I can't imagine how he must feel though.

 

[JudgeJudi]

BTW, random thing, is Bryer looking at his phone in this picture from the Fairview gas station? Or what is that object he's holding and looking at?

I've enlarged the image. You can't tell what he's looking at but he's holding the gas nozzle while filling the car with gas. You can see the tube leading to it.

 

[CanadianSleuther]

I've enlarged the image. You can't tell what he's looking at but he's holding the gas nozzle while filling the car with gas. You can see the tube leading to it.

View attachment 207481

That's Kam who is pumping gas. I think they are referring to Bryer who is holding something bulky which does look like a cell phone. Samsung phone like the one AS said he had bought for Bryer are often bulky. Also for Kam considering we are looking at the back of the vehicle could he be talking to Bryer? Or maybe just looking around paranoid.

 

[Jan424]

Yes, I agree that the butterfly posting was symbolic. I admit that I am quite old and out-dated so I know zero about Instagram, Snapchat and technology but there was definitely a message being conveyed in the butterfly picture. Was it then--after the first murders? May well have been. I, for one, have never swallowed the "story" that they were leaving PA to go to look for work in the Yukon--any evidence that they ever applied for or attempted to find work after they left PA??? I always thought this was their justification or "ruse" to their families. After the murders of LF and CD, I felt that their trip to the Yukon was only to try to distance themselves from the crime scene and give themselves an alibi that they had been in the Yukon, job searching. I also have had serious doubts about their alleged truck problems. This is my opinion only.

Agree, that butterfly photo speaks volumes, no question. And I also never ever believed the "going to find work" story, not for one second. The alibi theory is interesting, could very well be that's why they ended up in Whitehorse.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I think they are referring to Bryer who is holding something bulky which does look like a cell phone. Samsung phone like the one AS said he had bought for Bryer are often bulky. Also for Kam considering we are looking at the back of the vehicle could he be talking to Bryer? Or maybe just looking around paranoid.

Thanks. I'm dumb and dumber after midnight.

Here's an enlarged pic of Bryer. Yes, it does look like a phone.



I'd only be guessing at what Kam's looking at.

 

[Jan424]

Regardless of their labels, they found each other and nurtured their violent ideas enough to act on them.

SBM
Agree, these two were the perfect storm together ... I think they were in total partnership on this killing spree, they each had their roles to play. It doesn't matter whether one drove, had a car, had more money, provided guns, spoke more to the camera ... they BOTH went on this road trip willingly with murder on the mind and made a suicide pact for the end. I think Kam was as deeply disturbed as Bryer ... but he was apparently just better at keeping it hidden. JMO

 

[Jan424]

Regarding Bryer looking at a possible cell phone in the Fairview gas station photo .... I've no idea if that is a cell, but it looks like he is also holding something in his hand in the convenience store photo (where they are buying Doritos). I think its in his right hand in the middle photo, and then in his left hand in the last photo. What the heck is he always carrying around? Unless I'm seeing things at this point!

 

[CanadianSleuther]

Regarding Bryer looking at a possible cell phone in the Fairview gas station photo .... I've no idea if that is a cell, but it looks like he is also holding something in his hand in the convenience store photo (where they are buying Doritos). I think its in his right hand in the middle photo, and then in his left hand in the last photo. What the heck is he always carrying around? Unless I'm seeing things at this point!

The convenience store photo, to me looks even more like he's holding a phone.

 

[Jan424]

because psychopaths are good at charming, manipulating, and deceiving people
sociopaths aren't

Exactly, and haven't we heard this so many times before .... how neighbors, friends, family were shocked to discover so and so could commit murder. We also really don't know if Kam exhibited any odd or alarming behaviors within the family home over the past years .... maybe not at all, but we know nothing about him, so who can say for sure?

 

[Jan424]

The convenience store photo, to me looks even more like he's holding a phone.

Could be, cause he's holding something. I initially thought something soft like a hat, but its so hard to tell.

 

[CanadianSleuther]

Exactly, and haven't we heard this so many times before .... how neighbors, friends, family were shocked to discover so and so could commit murder. We also really don't know if Kam exhibited any odd or alarming behaviors within the family home over the past years .... maybe not at all, but we know nothing about him, so who can say for sure?

I do think Bryer does fit the sociopath profile but with Kam it's really hard to say. It could really go any direction. I do see how he could be classified as a psychopath but I also see many different scenarios. I can see him being depressed, gave up life, exhausted, on some kind of substance, and many other options because he really did have more to lose, and he wasn't really "in your face" from what we have seen, so he could have just shut down all together at the end. Because I do remember seeing the Meadow Lake footage and to me he always looked defeated, scared, and nervous to some degree.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I doubt the store owner sold them the vintage gun and bullets. I’m guessing the police questioned him and would probably follow up after the gun was recovered.

Personally, I think the gun was taken from someone who will eventually come forward or be tracked through tips.

The investigation found there were two non-restricted, semi-automatic rifles used in the deaths. One gun has unclear origins — police believe it was cobbled together using various parts over several years.

What the investigation of the northern B.C. murders found — and what we still don’t know

 

[CaseZero]

Thanks. I'm dumb and dumber after midnight.

Here's an enlarged pic of Bryer. Yes, it does look like a phone.

View attachment 207482

I'd only be guessing at what Kam's looking at.

It could be a phone but it also looks like something is hooked around his thumb, so I’m not sure.